Cyprus-Forum.com

[Mr. T]

Was this from Alexander the great? Those who are in military want to have respect either they win or lose. I wouldn't expect anything else from them! Respect from me goes to those who fight for freedom, democracy and human rights! Those who fight for expansionism and to oppress others don't have my respect. I think we should progress and reject the negative things of the past!

Yes Sotos. You are quite right. Our freedom fighters should be respected and it may surprise you but they are willing to do just that.

Unfortunately for us and for those freedom fighters it was not to be, but we must accept the blame for this.

Nevertheless, they just might surprise you in the very near future and I hope we reciprocate.

The British have even build a memorial in Staffordshire, England, for 5,000 German service personnel killed in Britain during WW11, on land gifted to the German Government in 1962.

So what does this say about us? Are we upholding Alexander's legacy?

Paphitis

That is a cemetery where the soldiers killed on British soil were buried. We already have the equivalent in Cyprus at Wayne's Keep.

What we do not need is a Memorial to Colonialism which is what the collective tribute will be.

Please stop ... ... it really is like asking the Africans to have a Memorial for the slave traders .....

The German Cemetery near Broadhurst green, on Cannock Chase is a memorial to some 5,000 German war dead ACCORDING TO CANNOCK CHASE DISTRICT COUNCIL.

There is a memorial in Scotland dedicated to the crew of a German bomber that was on a mission to bomb a Scottish city.

It's a cemetery with graves ... and not just a "50 years later specific Memorial to the war" ... we already have the equivalent in Cyprus at Wayne's Keep, Nicosia

Cannock Chase - German Military Cemetery
The German Cemetery Near Broadhurst Green
The German Cemetery near Broadhurst green, on Cannock Chase is a memorial to some 5,000 German war dead, where the servicemen's graves are marked by headstones of Belgian granite, set in plots of heather and tended by gardeners.

You are lacking of even the most basic comprehension of the memorials.
Think 'Memorial to the war dead' It may suit your purpose to contort facts as is your norm but they are NOT memorials to wars.

You coveniently make no reference to the Scottish memorial!
If Cannock Chase District Council who created it say it is a memorial who are you to say it isn't?

It is a cemetery with graves ... the memorial is inherent in the fact all the graves are for the Germans. This is the equivalent situation as in Wayne's Keep in Nicosia ... so what is your gripe?

The Scottish thing has some schadenfreude undertones I am afraid but I don't know enough to comment and cannot be arsed to check it out. But it was not a specific memorial for the fallen set up some 50 years after the event.

'Schadenfreude.' What absolute trash you write. It is apparent that you don't wish to acknowledge that in the UK a memorial was erected to our previous foes when you are blatently inhuman and incapable of accepting something similar.

Not wishing to hear anything further concerning your arse or any other oraxxxx the background to the memorial located at the crash site is:
A Junkers Ju-88A had been been sent on a mission to bomb Leith docks on the Firth of Forth, thereby disrupting the traffic through this busy port.
Junkers Ju 88, coded 3E+HM, was believed to have begun its flight from an airfield near Paris (possibly, Grève) after which it had proceeded to Deelen (Arnhem, Holland) to be bombed up and refuelled. It would then have proceeded NE up the Dutch coast until turning in a NW direction across the North Sea and direct for the Firth of Forth for its bombing run. However, unable to locate their target, the crew decided to jettison their incendiary bombs over farmland before returning to base.
The pilot, Oberleutnant Fritz Förster, then headed back toward his operating base. However, as he was flying across the Pentland Hills south of Edinburgh, his aircraft failed to clear Hare Hill halfway across the Pentlands. As a result, the Junkers crashed, killing all on board.
The wreckage of the aircraft was scattered over half a mile. It is believed that this Ju 88 was not brought down by machine gun or anti-aircraft fire, as no such engagements had been reported in this area at the time.
The crew were originally buried in a parish churchyard and subsequently transferred to Cannock where they lay with their countrymen, Poles, Australians and Britsh.

[Mr. T]

The German Cemetery near Broadhurst green, on Cannock Chase is a memorial to some 5,000 German war dead ACCORDING TO CANNOCK CHASE DISTRICT COUNCIL.

There is a memorial in Scotland dedicated to the crew of a German bomber that was on a mission to bomb a Scottish city.

Although to be fair, England and Scotland both have the luxury of not having been invaded and remain unoccupied by a foreign power, (a foreign power not aided and not abetted by Nazi Germany).

It not a luxury at all. It is something we have fought and died for, beating off prospective invasions from other countries as well as Germany.

It's sure might feel like a luxury to people who fought and died in the second world war on Britain's side; who then had to fight and die against British colonial rule; who then had to fight and die to try and prevent a coup orchestrated by Greece which Britain could and should have helped prevent; who then fought and died trying to prevent an invasion by Turkey that Britain could and should have helped prevent... and who still aren't free. It sure might feel like a luxury to them.

Clever these same people who got killed several times.

Who are these GCs who aren't free? In prison I guess as I thought that people are free in South Cyprus.

Strangley enough on another thread there is a reference to GCs chosing to fight with the Allies not because they believed in the cause of defeating the Nazis but because of the selfish idea that it would increase the chance of independence for Cyprus or merely because they would get better food than they were used to eating. (I believe posted by a GC).

What is there in the the genes of GCs that makes them believe that they are blameless of everything and everything is the fault of other nations. Quite some weird mutation.

As concerns 1974 there are many who believe the Turkish were right to invade and should have done so earlier.

[The Cypriot]

Clever these same people who got killed several times.

Are we going to have an exchange or are you going to play silly buggers?

Who are these GCs who aren't free? In prison I guess as I thought that people are free in South Cyprus.

Their – the CYPRIOTS that is – island isn't free. Their land isn't free. Jesus! How would you like it, if a third of Britain was occupied by Germany? Would Britons be free? Mate, are you connected to the forces, saying stuff like that?

Strangley enough on another thread there is a reference to GCs chosing to fight with the Allies not because they believed in the cause of defeating the Nazis but because of the selfish idea that it would increase the chance of independence for Cyprus or merely because they would get better food than they were used to eating. (I believe posted by a GC).

Selfish idea? I thought that's why everyone fought the Nazis. For freedom! How selfish of the Cypriots to fight the Nazis for their own freedom, rather than just for Britain's freedom.

What is there in the the genes of GCs that makes them believe that they are blameless of everything and everything is the fault of other nations.

They are to blame. They're to blame for being stupid; for allowing themselves to be shafted by foreigners like you. But they're wising up pretty quick.

As concerns 1974 there are many who believe the Turkish were right to invade and should have done so earlier.

They did invade earlier, as the Ottomans, in 1571. And Cypriots have had enough of foreign armies invading and interfering.

Cypriots have had enough of foreigners telling them what to do in their own homeland. OK?

[Oracle]

Dear delluded Mr. T

A cemetery where the graves of some of the war fallen rest, can act as a memorial to them. That is what they have in the UK to Germans, and that is what we have in Cyprus to the Colonialists, at Wayne's Keep. Evens Stevens!

Fantasise all you like, but that is it!

As for Scottish Schadenfreude, I said I wasn't interested in researching it but that is how it looks to me. They have various plaques commemorating where planes crashed and such like, to remind everyone of the failed attempts to take Scotland. Akin to the memorials they have for Battles they beat the English at ... Schadenfreude, yup! That's it!

... And if we ever have a memorial in Cyprus to the Colonialists, it should be when every last trace of that desire to control us, hold on to parts of our country, and ride rough-shot over our Government to build whatever they wish, even against the UK government's support, has been extinguished. Is that possible?

[barouti]

The British continuing to refer to the heroes of EOKA as “terrorists” proves there is still quite a lot of bitterness on their part. Because it’s unthinkable to them, isn’t it, that they were actually oppressors fighting against a popular liberation movement. They prefer the “Retreat of Empire” that whenever they left was because of their own choosing.

After the British had to relinquish their so-called mandates of Palestine and Jordan, as well as the debacle of the Suez Crisis, Cyprus became that more important to them as they needed the island to maintain a military presence in the Levant. They simply had no intentions of “retreating from empire” with Cyprus. That’s why EOKA had to take up arms, and those bastards have the audacity to refer to them as terrorists.

The thing with the British is they like their Gunga Dins (exactly what the TC’s were btw), and everyone else who refused to bow to them is just branded a bandit or terrorist.

[purdey]

How many British are referring to EOKA as terrorists ? maybe two or three in writing. The vast majority have no clue about EOKA, the Cyprus Problem or the building of a monument.

[barouti]

How many British are referring to EOKA as terrorists ? maybe two or three in writing. The vast majority have no clue about EOKA, the Cyprus Problem or the building of a monument.

Of course I’m generalising here. On an internet message board that does tend to happen. Therefore whom I was referring to as “bastards” was meant to apply to the “maybe two or three in writing” that you mentioned, though this number is much higher imo. But which Brits have actually written/spoken out against British colonial bastardry in Cyprus before, during and after the EOKA struggle? Because the British fighting against the EOKA heroes didn't involve marching in an orderly fashion and yelling "tally-ho" when gun fire was heard in the distance. Some of their tactics were quite brutal, which included spraying areas with gasoline so to burn out the EOKA fighters, as well as the recruitment of Turks to assist in oppressing Greeks. These last two tactics would make the British sound like colonial bastards, therefore to deflect from this they refer to the EOKA heroes as terrorists, which in turn makes them sound real nasty and their struggle dishonorable by comparison, right?. It's just them trying to dictate history to their favour.

Sure, ignorance is bliss and the average Brit today can easily lecture for bygones to be bygones. But it’s not their country that remains divided, right? And how many of them will admit that past British governments denied 85% of the population the right to self-determination for their country, and therefore are equally responsible for the current division. And there is also the fact that an impasse to a solution suits the current UK administrations because as long as it remains then their so-called sovereign bases remain as such. So ignorance can't always be used as an excuse to dissuade open debate.

I think the great George Orwell summed up the Brits very well:

Twenty million people are underfed but literally everyone in England has access to a radio. While sections of the working-class who have been plundered of all they really need are being compensated in part, by cheap luxuries, which mitigate the surface of life...It is quite likely that fish and chips, art-silk movies, the radio, tinned salmon, cut-price chocolate...the movies, the radio, strong tea and the Football Pools have between them averted revolution. (1937)

And what has really changed. They still have a very clever establishment, and the average Brit can do a Sergeant Schultz ie "I know nothing."

[purdey]

On this particular issue I think the British public have absolutely no idea what is proposed or what is been discussed. I think you would be hard pushed to get a 50% yes vote on the question "Have the UK got bases in Cyprus"
I am afraid to the vast majority, Cyprus is two weeks in Paphos in August.I am not trying to dampen debate or make excuses but I believe the vast majority of British have no idea about the history of Cyprus and British involvement.

[RichardB]

On this particular issue I think the British public have absolutely no idea what is proposed or what is been discussed. I think you would be hard pushed to get a 50% yes vote on the question "Have the UK got bases in Cyprus"
I am afraid to the vast majority, Cyprus is two weeks in Paphos in August.I am not trying to dampen debate or make excuses but I believe the vast majority of British have no idea about the history of Cyprus and British involvement.

Purdey I'd go a little further and say less than 50% of Brits could point to Cyprus on a map...Sad but I feel true