Cyprus-Forum.com

[brother]

We do not know what would have happened but lets take a stab at it, the mainland greeks and turks would never have come, the cypriots would have jointly fought the brits to leave the island, independance would have followed and the ROC would have been born as a soverign state with no amosity amongst its people, majority of people would if not all would have spoken greek( until 1974 i only spoke greek, no turkish or english) people would never had become refugees and right now we would all be pulling in the same direction to improve all cypriots lives and also the greek and turk bit that comes before cypriot would have most probably been killed off eventually imo.

[Kifeas]

Detailer, so u still think that the national forces of Cyprus is going to go around picking on TC?

or is that the last thing you can think of as to keep the stolen land you enjoy.

The 63-74 events are more than enough for me to show that we are not safe with "national forces of Cyprus".

If turkish troops leave the island, why do you want to keep them anyway?

What are you both speaking here?

Who said that with the withdrawal of Turkish troops, the GC National Guard will remain? The idea is for both armies to dissolve and /or withdraw completely, and the security to be undertaken by either a UN or an EU force.

It is another - totally different story, if some time in the future, the two communities will come together and agree to create a common Cypriot army which will assume the security of the island.

[MicAtCyp]

GC are so funny in saying that they will bring "DIFFUCULTIES" to the Turkey's EU perspective.

Do you remember how many chapters Turkey has to pass dude, yes or no? Do you think there is any possibility at all signing ANY chapter that is against our Interests? I think you got stuck on the "veto" thesis, and frankly you look like a clown there.

Turkish access to EU is a very big issue for EU countries which can not be compared to GC "wishes".
If they want Turkey's entrance, they won't give shit if GC want it or not. If they don't, they will let you to veto it. Simple...

Stuck on the veto again? I told you there is no veto anymore there are chapters/laws/and actions Turkey MUST do to get the signature of each and everyone of the 25 member states.
It is not a veto.Either Turkey dances, or she doesn’t. When she dances she gets a bon-bon, when she doesn’t she gets a cucumber.

A big issue indeed.Some forces in the EU want Turkey some others just want a special relation. That's why Cyprus will be pushed forward as the constant excuse.Turkey will have to clear Cyprus out of the way to deal directly with those hiding behind. Got it now?Greece was playing that role in the past until she exchanged her role with Cyprus’s EU membership. Similarly one day Turkey will exchange .... guess what???

Ha,ha,ha I can almost see your face.

******************************************

Than question why people of turkey support TC? Are they also strategist.

For nationalistic reasons. Exactly the same people existed (and still exist) in Greece. However those people are not taking decisions.Yes I agree the TCs will not be abandoned just like that but I am absolutely certain their interests will not have first priority over the interests of 80 million Turks and over the capitalists of Turkey.
Another complain of Talat to what Erdogan is doing, and Talat will soon be history next to Denktash. Then a new puppet and another and another until the TCs end up with someone who is always drunk like our Klerides was.

EU is not a must.

Murtaza you are wrong on this.Every country whose trade is with the EU will simply commit economic suicide by staying out. It is a club my friend which ties everyone around it. The Americans want Turkey in the EU because if Turkey does not enter they will lose all their IMF loans to Turkey which are many many billions.And Turkey will collapse economically and perhaps militarily.Don't be mistaken.This "EU is not a must" is a fairy tail that some circles in Turkey try to pass to the masses for national pride.Sorry but the truth is quite the opposite.

[detailer]

MicAtCyp wrote:

Stuck on the veto again? I told you there is no veto anymore there are chapters/laws/and actions Turkey MUST do to get the signature of each and everyone of the 25 member states.
It is not a veto.Either Turkey dances, or she doesn’t. When she dances she gets a bon-bon, when she doesn’t she gets a cucumber.

A big issue indeed.Some forces in the EU want Turkey some others just want a special relation. That's why Cyprus will be pushed forward as the constant excuse.Turkey will have to clear Cyprus out of the way to deal directly with those hiding behind. Got it now?Greece was playing that role in the past until she exchanged her role with Cyprus’s EU membership.

Good! at least you got Turkey's EU perspective has nothing to do with GC's balls!

Why Turkey should give a shit to directly deal with the ones behind GC. They know it quite well and she is dealing with them right now.

Turkey's attitude against GC is not a main problem for the ones who don't want to see you in Turkey. If Turkey sees that EU's main drive is to reject or delay the process, she will simply take herself back for a while rather accepting the GC "wishes" for nothing. This happened when the memership status was rejected by EU in late 90ties. By the way, how much Greece got from Turkey when she was the puppet that time?

wrote:

Similarly one day Turkey will exchange .... guess what???

Ha,ha,ha I can almost see your face.

[detailer]

The Americans want Turkey in the EU because if Turkey does not enter they will lose all their IMF loans to Turkey which are many many billions.And Turkey will collapse economically and perhaps militarily

Keep on dreaming!

[-mikkie2-]

Unfortunately, our Turkish friends will soon find out the problems they will get themselves in.

There seems to be a certain inevitability.

Turkey before Dec 17th was saying that regarding the signing of the Ankara agreement, that they must exchange letters with the EU to clarify that Turkey does not recognise the RoC and as such would be part of official EU documents. That has been demoted to a unilateral verbal declaration by Turkey that signing the protocol does not constitute recognition of the RoC by Turkey. Thats basically the EU telling TUrkey to get lost!

Now, regarding negotiating the 30+ chapters, Turkish officials need to negotiate face to face with RoC officials. All EU member states need to monitor progress of Turkey and that can only be done from within Turkey. This means that RoC will demand some kind of representation inside Turkey. As long as Turkey refuses this request, then negotiations will not begin.

Regarding the ports and airports, Turkey is holding out for direct trade first before allowing RoC access to Turkey. Well, infact, again, Turkey can hold out, but the non implementation of the customs union agreement in full means negotiations will not begin.

What you are seeing is the step by step, gradual recognition of the RoC by Turkey.

And for those hoping that Britain will somehow pull a rabbit out of the hat in her 6 month tenure of the EU presidency I am afraid to say that given the problems within the EU at the moment there is very little chance for anything happening, unless Turkey makes certain steps. Also, as term president, Britain needs to be seen to be impartial as she is representing all 25 member states. That is why Britain has said that she doesn't want to deal with the two regulations for the TC;s and that is why the Luxembourg presidency is holding meetings with representatives of both communities in order to break the impasse.

[Murtaza]

Maybe you dont understand but
1-we have a vague EU
2- We know EU dont want Turkey
3- Joining with EU will be after 15 year.(If happen)

And you think Turkey will accept cyprus and abandon TC with this 3 point.

Sorry But Even Turkey would be join in EU after 15 hours, I am not sure Turkey will abondon TC.

[-mikkie2-]

Murtaza,

Turkey has a $200billion dollar debt. At the moment, Turkey is being propped up by loans from the US, the IMF and World Bank. Turkey needs the EU much more than you realise! Just wait until the next economic crisis comes around. The way things are looking at the moment we probably won't have to wait too long. Then we will see how commited Turkey is in supporting the TC's.

[Murtaza]

Murtaza,

Turkey has a $200billion dollar debt. At the moment, Turkey is being propped up by loans from the US, the IMF and World Bank. Turkey needs the EU much more than you realise! Just wait until the next economic crisis comes around. The way things are looking at the moment we probably won't have to wait too long. Then we will see how commited Turkey is in supporting the TC's.

I think you probably will wait some years. For your knowledge our debt ratio is decreasing. And It will continue to decrease.

[Murtaza]

By the way, why are you so hopelessly try to persuade us, we realy realy need EU?

It looks like you realy realy need us in EU