Cyprus-Forum.com

[zan]

This is a funny thread Greeks telling Greeks that they are not the same in between singing the same national anthem telling TCs that they are "Cypriots" just like them

[Get Real!]

We need to analyze more the composition of these deprived & desperate mix of people (Bulgarians, Albanians, Slavs Gypsies, disgruntled Ottomans) under harsh Ottoman rule, who had formed modern “Greece”, so I will be starting a thread soon where we can take a closer look at all the details.

[Klik]

[supporttheunderdog]

GR, what you appear to have overlooked is the original Mycenaean embezzlement of Minoan Culture: the Mycenaean/Achaeans (who were were Indo-European ) spoke an early version of what later became the Greek language) came out of the North and, in about 1650 BC met the non Greek speaking and definitely non Greek Minoans (who were probably rather more closely related to the then Cypriots ("Eteo-Cypriots"?) and the ancient middle eastern civilisations.

They were warrior folk who were probably functionally illiterate as the evidence suggests they only acquired a written script (Linear A) , which was debased form of Minoan Linear B. They also probably acquired other aspects of Minoan civilisation, such as building ideas.

Significantly with the destruction of the Mycenaean civilisation in about 1200BC 1100 BC, where a few remnants ended up on Cyprus, they appear to have remained mostly iliterate, as ing disappeared in the Mycenaean homelands while in Cyprus they appear to have had to rely on Cyprus Scribes to wrote for them and that is why one ended up with the Cypriote Script being used to write the Mycenaean version of early Greek (Arcado-Cypriot Greek).

When the Eastern Med emerged from the Dark ages Cyprus was dominated by the Persian Empire, there were three languages in use, ie the original (non-Greek) Cypriote language, the (early Greek) Arcado-Cypriote, spoken by Mycenaean relics, and (non- Greek) Phoenician, from relatively recent settlers. (this was probably partly why "Greek" cities did not set up Colonies in Cyprus in the great wave of Colonisation from the 8th Century BC onwards.

Hellenisation was only properly achieved in about 300 BC with conquest by the Ptolemies, and the suppression of the Cypriot city kingdoms.

[DT.]

GR, what you appear to have overlooked is the original Mycenaean embezzlement of Minoan Culture: the Mycenaean/Achaeans (who were were Indo-European ) spoke an early version of what later became the Greek language) came out of the North and, in about 1650 BC met the non Greek speaking and definitely non Greek Minoans (who were probably rather more closely related to the then Cypriots ("Eteo-Cypriots"?) and the ancient middle eastern civilisations.

They were warrior folk who were probably functionally illiterate as the evidence suggests they only acquired a written script (Linear A) , which was debased form of Minoan Linear B. They also probably acquired other aspects of Minoan civilisation, such as building ideas.

Significantly with the destruction of the Mycenaean civilisation in about 1200BC 1100 BC, where a few remnants ended up on Cyprus, they appear to have remained mostly iliterate, as ing disappeared in the Mycenaean homelands while in Cyprus they appear to have had to rely on Cyprus Scribes to wrote for them and that is why one ended up with the Cypriote Script being used to write the Mycenaean version of early Greek (Arcado-Cypriot Greek).

When the Eastern Med emerged from the Dark ages Cyprus was dominated by the Persian Empire, there were three languages in use, ie the original (non-Greek) Cypriote language, the (early Greek) Arcado-Cypriote, spoken by Mycenaean relics, and (non- Greek) Phoenician, from relatively recent settlers. (this was probably partly why "Greek" cities did not set up Colonies in Cyprus in the great wave of Colonisation from the 8th Century BC onwards.

Hellenisation was only properly achieved in about 300 BC with conquest by the Ptolemies, and the suppression of the Cypriot city kingdoms.

So according to you Cyprus has only been hellenised since 300 BC?

[supporttheunderdog]

It is not a yes or no answer as Hellenisation was a process, where, as is a matter of Historical record, while Hellenisation had begun in about 1200 BC lwhen a few Mycenaean Remnants were left on the Island and probably conquered Enkomi, as is well known from the record Cyprus (a) these early arrivals did not go far inland (b) The Island was not otherwise colonised by Greek speaking/Hellenic peoples in the great wave of "Greek" colonisation from the 8th to 5th Centuries or so,(as it was a part of the Persian Worl,d and Hellenisation was only finally completed when (i) Cyprus was wrested from the Persians and (ii) the non-Greek speaking states suppressed. IMHO the story of Hellenisation in about 1200BC or so is however not correct.

[yialousa1971]

It is not a yes or no answer as Hellenisation was a process, where, as is a matter of Historical record, while Hellenisation had begun in about 1200 BC lwhen a few Mycenaean Remnants were left on the Island and probably conquered Enkomi, as is well known from the record Cyprus (a) these early arrivals did not go far inland (b) The Island was not otherwise colonised by Greek speaking/Hellenic peoples in the great wave of "Greek" colonisation from the 8th to 5th Centuries or so,(as it was a part of the Persian Worl,d and Hellenisation was only finally completed when (i) Cyprus was wrested from the Persians and (ii) the non-Greek speaking states suppressed. IMHO the story of Hellenisation in about 1200BC or so is however not correct.

Keep your nonsense to yourself and leave history to the experts!

The most complete study of Greek skeletal material from Neolithic to modern times was carried out by American anthropologist J. Lawrence Angel who found that in the early age racial variability in Greece was 7% above average, indicating that the Greeks had multiple origins within the Europid racial family. Angel noted that from the earliest times to the present “racial continuity in Greece is striking.” Buxton who had earlier studied Greek skeletal material and measured modern Greeks, especially in Cyprus, finds that the modern Greeks “possess physical characteristics not differing essentially from those of the former [ancient Greeks].”

[supporttheunderdog]

You may be interested in this

http://www.white-history.com/refuting_rm/7.html -

[supporttheunderdog]

You may be interested in this

http://www.white-history.com/refuting_rm/7.html -

Even the article you quote from has the answer and that is that the correlation between the cranial / skeletal styles of peoples found in Cyprus today and many of those found in Ancient Greece is because they mainly originated in ancient stock who left the middle east area and spread along the mediterranean cost from east to west, and not the Indo-European peoples who constituted the Hellenes and who formed the aristocracy of ancient Greece, imposing their language as they went - the Greeks are not descended from who they think they are - it is a conquest myth. The same goes for the Cypriots - they had "Greekness" imposed upon them.

(Curiously this also is the case in Turkey that a majority of modern day citizens of Turkey are Turkic in genetic origin, but are likewise of this same Middle Eastern stock, who had "Turkishness" imposed upon them. (between 10% and 30% are of Turkic origin) and it may explain why there is a considerable similarity between modern day Greek Speaking Cypriots and Turkish Speaking Cypriots (excluding the post74 illegal immigrants) in the genetics of the two groups.

[Piratis]

GR, what you appear to have overlooked is the original Mycenaean embezzlement of Minoan Culture: the Mycenaean/Achaeans (who were were Indo-European ) spoke an early version of what later became the Greek language) came out of the North and, in about 1650 BC met the non Greek speaking and definitely non Greek Minoans (who were probably rather more closely related to the then Cypriots ("Eteo-Cypriots"?) and the ancient middle eastern civilisations.

They were warrior folk who were probably functionally illiterate as the evidence suggests they only acquired a written script (Linear A) , which was debased form of Minoan Linear B. They also probably acquired other aspects of Minoan civilisation, such as building ideas.

Significantly with the destruction of the Mycenaean civilisation in about 1200BC 1100 BC, where a few remnants ended up on Cyprus, they appear to have remained mostly iliterate, as ing disappeared in the Mycenaean homelands while in Cyprus they appear to have had to rely on Cyprus Scribes to wrote for them and that is why one ended up with the Cypriote Script being used to write the Mycenaean version of early Greek (Arcado-Cypriot Greek).

When the Eastern Med emerged from the Dark ages Cyprus was dominated by the Persian Empire, there were three languages in use, ie the original (non-Greek) Cypriote language, the (early Greek) Arcado-Cypriote, spoken by Mycenaean relics, and (non- Greek) Phoenician, from relatively recent settlers. (this was probably partly why "Greek" cities did not set up Colonies in Cyprus in the great wave of Colonisation from the 8th Century BC onwards.

Hellenisation was only properly achieved in about 300 BC with conquest by the Ptolemies, and the suppression of the Cypriot city kingdoms.

Before 1200BC the population of the world was about 150 times less than it is today. The population of Cyprus at that time could not have been more than 5-6 thousand people max and most of Cyprus at that time was uninhabited. Those people, just like Greeks and Phonecians, came from somewhere else, and they were not homogeneous since they came from different places of the mainland around Cyprus at different times. If you count how much time each of this pre-Greek colonists existed in Cyprus you will find that it is far less than the almost 3500 years that Greeks exist in Cyprus.

For example the colonists who came to Cyprus and created Chirokitia, inhabited Cyprus for less than a millennium and their population never reached more than 600 people. Other groups that came later had nothing to do with the people who inhabited Chirokitia.

It is funny that you go back to a pre-historic era to "prove" that Cyprus is not Greek because some small small groups of colonists came to Cyprus before the Greeks.

But your lame attempt proves exactly the opposite: How much Greek Cyprus really is when compared to almost any other part of the world.

Lets take "England" for example. How English is what you today call England? The answer is: Not even a tiny fraction of how Greek Cyprus is. Go back to 1200BC or even to 300BC and you will find absolutely nothing which is English, Anglo-Saxon or anything that is even remotely related to the English people in the territory you today call "England". What you will find however as many other people, totally unrelated with the English.

And lets not even go to "Turkey". In that territory before the Turks not only you had pre-historic settlements (older and far more populous than the ones of Cyprus) but also whole civilizations. In many parts of "Turkey" the Turks didn't even became the majority until 100 years ago, and in many more parts of "Turkey", Turks are still not even the majority, since they are inhabited by Kurds, who existed in the area for long before the Turks came. And still you don't have a problem to call those lands "Turkish", but you have a problem to call Cyprus Greek because there are some pre-historic settlements on the island, just like they existed everywhere else?