Cyprus-Forum.com

[kurupetos]

Make sure you know who the enemy is ... MLK had but one ... you have chosen two!

Not always sure what you're talking about, O. MLK's enemy was intolerance. So is mine.

You don't seem to be very tolerant of the majorities' wish to be associated with "Greekness".

Minority rules!

[Oracle]

Make sure you know who the enemy is ... MLK had but one ... you have chosen two!

Not always sure what you're talking about, O. MLK's enemy was intolerance. So is mine.

You don't seem to be very tolerant of the majorities' wish to be associated with "Greekness".

Minority rules!

Only amongst "True" Cypriots ....

[The Cypriot]

I'd ask you to do a bit of research then because I can't be bothered to educate you.

I wish someone would educate you on how to use quotes.

Irrelevant.

(re the Greek flag issue)

Not at all... you are proud to focus on all the ancient influences, which you collectively call "Greek", neglecting all other influences, yet the symbol you use to identify with has nothing to do with any of these ancient influences, but had everything to do with the one modern and disastrous Greek influence, namely the Junta.

Agreed, although sometimes the world chooses to close its eyes.

Only Cypriots, working together can open them.

Not patronising, it is a opinion based on the realities that I see. If you believe a differing opinion to yours is patronising, then that's your problem.

It's not your opinion that's patronising, just the way you object to mine. But it's no big deal. Forget it.

But who is going Greek on them? We are ethnically Greek (at least most of us; it's written in our constitution)

That constitution was a bad idea. Maronites and Armenians and Latins and indigenous Cypriots had to choose this or choose to be Turkish.

and I'm not going to deny my heritage for them. It is them going all Turkish on us, by taking the north, purging it of everything Greek and calling it a Turkish republic.

Not just the Greek. The Maronites have had their culture wiped out too. Or don't you care?

Bareda me, Simo! Sometimes freedom has to be fought for. It depends whether the freedom on offer is worth fighting for.

I'm laughing because you think the TCs will fight Turkey. You obviously do not understand this problem.

Some will. Those who graffiti the walls and call for the Turkish troops to go home, and get arrested. Those who set up Facebook groups that object to the erosion of the Cypriot culture in the north, and get arrested. Maybe if Turkey prevents a solution by and for Cypriots from materialising, their voices will grow. Their sense of injustice will grow. But perhaps you're right, maybe they won't. Maybe it is wishful thinking. Maybe we should just give up our seat at the EU and become a Greek backwater like Crete, they should just be Turks, and we should relinquish the north forever.

but Dr King understood the challenges that he faced. You obviously do not.

The good doctor certainly didn't go on about his blackness all the time. That's why so many non-blacks supported his cause. He understood how best to overcome the challenges his people faced.

[The Cypriot]

You don't seem to be very tolerant of the majorities' wish to be associated with "Greekness".

I'm not tolerant of the invader occupying my parents' homeland, nor those who gave the invader the excuse to do so, who continue to give the invader the excuse to do so, by perpetuating intolerance between the island's people, by forever focusing on differences instead of commonalities, by burning instead of building bridges.

[Oracle]

You don't seem to be very tolerant of the majorities' wish to be associated with "Greekness".

I'm not tolerant of the invader occupying my parents' homeland, nor those who gave the invader the excuse to do so, who continue to give the invader the excuse to do so, by perpetuating intolerance between the island's people, by forever focusing on differences instead of commonalities, by burning instead of building bridges.

Ok ... keep building your bridge to Turkey. Personally I do not wish to be associated with the values of the invader ... nor do I wish to subsume to tolerance of violators of Human Rights!

If I wanted association with Turkish ideals, I would go and live in Turkey. I do not need them force-fed to me, through invasion of my country.

[bill cobbett]

Who are the two Jurkish phookers who voted to cede the whole Island to Tr?

[Simon]

[quote]I wish someone would educate you on how to use quotes. [/quote]

I know exactly how to use the quotes. It is either a problem with the computer or website because it used to work. When someone runs out of arguments they often change the subject.


[quote](re the Greek flag issue)

Not at all... you are proud to focus on all the ancient influences, which you collectively call "Greek", neglecting all other influences, yet the symbol you use to identify with has nothing to do with any of these ancient influences, but had everything to do with the one modern and disastrous Greek influence, namely the Junta. [/quote]


I do not ignore any influence. I call it Greek because it is overwhelmingly Greek. It would be tedious, unnecessary and excessive for me to mention every influence on Greek whenever I say Greek. Just because the junta used the Greek flag, does not mean the Greek flag belongs to the junta. How ridiculous. Does the British flag belong to the BNP? The Greek flag belongs to Greeks, of which the junta was a very small, but tragic part of its past. The Greek flag belongs to Greece, which is the inheritor of ancient Greece.


[quote]Only Cypriots, working together can open them. [/quote]

The problem is many Cypriots of Turkish origin would rather them closed. So Greek Cypriots must work all that harder and remain united to open them.


[quote]It's not your opinion that's patronising, just the way you object to mine. [/quote]

And how is that?


[quote]Not just the Greek. The Maronites have had their culture wiped out too. Or don't you care?[/quote]


The constitution is the one we work under today. It is the one that means the Republic of Cyprus exists, so we must work with it. Of course I care about the Maronites, Latins and all others, so stop trying this cheap points scoring. I refer to the Greek because the Greek culture is the most prevalent, and I'm a Greek Cypriot. But the Turks are responsible to all these communities.


[quote]Some will. Those who graffiti the walls and call for the Turkish troops to go home, and get arrested. Those who set up Facebook groups that object to the erosion of the Cypriot culture in the north, and get arrested. Maybe if Turkey prevents a solution by and for Cypriots from materialising, their voices will grow. Their sense of injustice will grow. But perhaps you're right, maybe they won't. Maybe it is wishful thinking. Maybe we should just give up our seat at the EU and become a Greek backwater like Crete, they should just be Turks, and we should relinquish the north forever. [/quote]


Some perhaps will, maybe 30, 40, even a couple of hundred. Good luck removing nearly 40,000 troops. The vast majority have a completely different mindset to the one that you are implying, this is why I stated that you are a wishful thinker. As much as we would like to think that the TCs can't wait for the Turks to leave, the reality on the ground just doesn't reflect this (regardless of a few isolated cases which doesn't amount to much). Who is suggesting we become a part of Greece? These are your own assumptions.


[quote]The good doctor certainly didn't go on about his blackness all the time. That's why so many non-blacks supported his cause. He understood how best to overcome the challenges his people faced.[/quote]


Wrong! The good doctor spoke of race all the time. The difference is, he said that it doesn't make a difference, and that there is far more that unites us than divides us. A lesson for GCs and TCs perhaps. If someone told Dr King he wasn't black, you would have got a contradictory answer, just like you are getting now. Perhaps if our Greek heritage wasn't always denied, we wouldn't have to constantly go on about it. People like you constantly highlight the issue and then moan at us for going on about it.

[Oracle]

For those who think the 'Turkey thing' is about "race" and keep harking on about MLK ... let me tell you it is not!

It is about ideals and respect for democracy.

And whilst MLK was trying to convince the US that "blacks" had the same ideology irrespective of colour (so true) ... this invasion about Turkey has less to do with 'race', and more to do with expansionist greed by the Turks and a wish to extinguish the flame of Cypriot freedom!

Quite the reverse of what MLK dreamed ....

[The Cypriot]

Ok ... keep building your bridge to Turkey. Personally I do not wish to be associated with the values of the invader ... nor do I wish to subsume to tolerance of violators of Human Rights! If I wanted association with Turkish ideals, I would go and live in Turkey. I do not need them force-fed to me, through invasion of my country.

Sorry Oracle, I've no doubt you're an educated and wily woman, and I certainly feel the pain of invasion and human rights violations as strongly as you do. But sometimes you simply don't articulate yourself in ways I can comprehend and therefore debate with.

[The Cypriot]

I know exactly how to use the quotes. It is either a problem with the computer or website because it used to work. When someone runs out of arguments they often change the subject.

It makes it very difficult to follow you. What were we arguing about?

The Greek flag belongs to Greeks, of which the junta was a very small, but tragic part of its past. The Greek flag belongs to Greece, which is the inheritor of ancient Greece.

Which was a collection of rival, often warring city states who united only in the face of Persian oppression. But anyway, Cyprus has its own flag.

The problem is many Cypriots of Turkish origin would rather them closed. So Greek Cypriots must work all that harder and remain united to open them.

Cypriots in the north are not necessarily of Turkish origin, some converted to Islam in the face of Ottoman oppression. These and all who consider themselves Cypriots in the north should be allowed, invited, encouraged to work with us to open the world's eyes.

Who is suggesting we become a part of Greece? These are your own assumptions.

And the world's... when you fly it's flag. They don't understand the subtleties.

The good doctor spoke of race all the time. The difference is, he said that it doesn't make a difference, and that there is far more that unites us than divides us. A lesson for GCs and TCs perhaps.

Agreed.

If someone told Dr King he wasn't black, you would have got a contradictory answer, just like you are getting now.

This isn't the same. There was no argument. He was black.

Perhaps if our Greek heritage wasn't always denied, we wouldn't have to constantly go on about it. People like you constantly highlight the issue and then moan at us for going on about it.

It isn't denied. It's you who deny, ignore or play down all the island's other heritages, like you did for the Maronites, heritages that together make us all Cypriots.

Anyway, Simo, there is certainly more that unites us than divides us. I've enjoyed debating with you.