Cyprus-Forum.com

[bill cobbett]

The O's will probably put family house in someone elses name!

GB courts would take a very dim view of this where essentially they would have contrived and conspired with others to put assets beyond the reach of a potential court ruling.

Probably better off selling any GB property and spending the money.

All the above are just my opinions.

[Viewpoint]

Double post

[Viewpoint]

I'd really like to get you elected President of the ROC someday and let them suffer a little more by having a tc President after them.

Thanks for the thought, DT, but as a President of the RoC, I would like to guide the TC's from a "Corrupted Society" into a True Democracy and not make them suffer. They have been suffering long enough with leaders such a Denktash for way too long. If not aloud, but silently. It will take a lot of the burden off their shoulders to be living in an "Honest Society" once again. That would be my mission for the TC's. As for the GC's, I will have a mission for them also.!

You would lead us to capitulation, surrender to GC dominance and discrimination, you do not know TC well they will never accept living in a GC state as just another minority, they will fight for their rights and would rather become part of Turkey than accept your proposals.

Oh, but that's not true, VP, because I already gave you a Democratic plan that safeguards all the TC's rights with 50% power at the upper house. All you have to do, is to agree to return the GC land that does not belong to you.! But you would rather keep the GC land than have peace and an "honest society" for our people. Did you not say, that each side needs to make a compromise.? Well, where the hell is it from your part, if you turn down my BBF plan.?

http://www.cyprus-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=21685

Your plan was disguised capitualtion which is the worst form of deception you would have the TCs exposed to GC domination by loss of just one seat in the upper house as the lower house was a lost cause from day 1. Your plan was to reduce our numbers to a size that could give the GCs that 1 seat necessary to disregard us and take control of both states, you shoudl feel ashamed that you do not try to close the door on such risks and put forward a plan that would guarantee TCs effective say in a new structure where they cannot be pushed to one side. You may be willing to live in a GC dominated country without any community rights but there is a majority of TCs would fell so strongly that they would rather unite with Turkey than be exposed to GC administered democracy and human rights.

Nothing is disguised about my plan. It is written in plain English on ONE page and not the 9000+ pages that the AP had, which was the "mother of all disguises".! I have told you what steps needed to be taken to make it work. Your problem is, you don't want to live in a True Democratic country, because you think you have certain "community rights" that can violate others Democratic and Human Rights. Since you insists on having some "community rights", then ask the EU to allow you to limit the number of GC's can live in the 20% TC state in the north, so that you can always have the majority in the TC state, which means keeping all the Upper House seats. You did it with the AP and you said yes to it, so do it again. See, it's simple to fix if the EU goes along with it. I don't see why not, since there won't be anywhere the GC's will reach the limit to be a problem to cause a Human Rights problem. So, VP, go ahead and ask the EU to bend some of it's rules. I'm sure the GC's will be able to accept this arrangement, since according to my calculations, it is not going to effect any GC's at all. You see, nothing is disguised, so, as soon as you hand over 50% of the north, you can have peace in Cyprus.

Although that proposal was backed by both the UN and EU the GCs rejected that idea as it did not serve their purpose.

[Viewpoint]

When we win against the Orams - can they appeal??

The ECJ is the senior court in matters of EU law so its judgments on the points of EU law on which it has been asked for rulings are final.

....great. When will the action take place? (i.e passing the Hove house onto the GC or knocking down their house in occupied??

If things go in favour of Mr A at the ECJ, he'll have to go back to a GB court with the ECJ ruling and ask for an enforcement order, probably a "legal charge" on any GB property that is still in the O's names and this will probably also be appealable (within the GB court system).

So this affair will probably still be making news for a long time.

At last someone with comments that take into account the realities on the ground, the Brits can tie this procedure in knots for the next few years.

[bill cobbett]

When we win against the Orams - can they appeal??

The ECJ is the senior court in matters of EU law so its judgments on the points of EU law on which it has been asked for rulings are final.

....great. When will the action take place? (i.e passing the Hove house onto the GC or knocking down their house in occupied??

If things go in favour of Mr A at the ECJ, he'll have to go back to a GB court with the ECJ ruling and ask for an enforcement order, probably a "legal charge" on any GB property that is still in the O's names and this will probably also be appealable (within the GB court system).

So this affair will probably still be making news for a long time.

At last someone with comments that take into account the realities on the ground, the Brits can tie this procedure in knots for the next few years.

Yes, thanks but ultimately, when the law has run its long course, Mr A will win cos he has right on his side, in my opinion.

[AWE]

for the more sophisticated buyer in the TRNC, if they have bought exchange land - which is unlikely, they can form a UK company with bearer shares

(see here http://www.economist.com/finance/displa ... d=13382279
"America is not the only rich nation Mr Sharman tested. He tried to open anonymous shell companies and bank accounts 45 times across the world. These were successful in 17 cases, of which 13 were in OECD countries. One example was Britain, where in 45 minutes on the internet he formed a company without providing identification, was issued with bearer shares (which have been almost universally outlawed because they confer completely anonymous ownership) as well as nominee directors and a secretary. All was achieved at a cost of £515.95 ($753)."

and sell the assets to that company, move the bank account and cash offshore so not covered by an EU court jurisdiction. it would be very hard to have any judgement enforced against non existent assets! and all this can be done by oneself without the need to use an offshore trust lawyer.

[Kikapu]

I'd really like to get you elected President of the ROC someday and let them suffer a little more by having a tc President after them.

Thanks for the thought, DT, but as a President of the RoC, I would like to guide the TC's from a "Corrupted Society" into a True Democracy and not make them suffer. They have been suffering long enough with leaders such a Denktash for way too long. If not aloud, but silently. It will take a lot of the burden off their shoulders to be living in an "Honest Society" once again. That would be my mission for the TC's. As for the GC's, I will have a mission for them also.!

You would lead us to capitulation, surrender to GC dominance and discrimination, you do not know TC well they will never accept living in a GC state as just another minority, they will fight for their rights and would rather become part of Turkey than accept your proposals.

Oh, but that's not true, VP, because I already gave you a Democratic plan that safeguards all the TC's rights with 50% power at the upper house. All you have to do, is to agree to return the GC land that does not belong to you.! But you would rather keep the GC land than have peace and an "honest society" for our people. Did you not say, that each side needs to make a compromise.? Well, where the hell is it from your part, if you turn down my BBF plan.?

http://www.cyprus-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=21685

Your plan was disguised capitualtion which is the worst form of deception you would have the TCs exposed to GC domination by loss of just one seat in the upper house as the lower house was a lost cause from day 1. Your plan was to reduce our numbers to a size that could give the GCs that 1 seat necessary to disregard us and take control of both states, you shoudl feel ashamed that you do not try to close the door on such risks and put forward a plan that would guarantee TCs effective say in a new structure where they cannot be pushed to one side. You may be willing to live in a GC dominated country without any community rights but there is a majority of TCs would fell so strongly that they would rather unite with Turkey than be exposed to GC administered democracy and human rights.

Nothing is disguised about my plan. It is written in plain English on ONE page and not the 9000+ pages that the AP had, which was the "mother of all disguises".! I have told you what steps needed to be taken to make it work. Your problem is, you don't want to live in a True Democratic country, because you think you have certain "community rights" that can violate others Democratic and Human Rights. Since you insists on having some "community rights", then ask the EU to allow you to limit the number of GC's can live in the 20% TC state in the north, so that you can always have the majority in the TC state, which means keeping all the Upper House seats. You did it with the AP and you said yes to it, so do it again. See, it's simple to fix if the EU goes along with it. I don't see why not, since there won't be anywhere the GC's will reach the limit to be a problem to cause a Human Rights problem. So, VP, go ahead and ask the EU to bend some of it's rules. I'm sure the GC's will be able to accept this arrangement, since according to my calculations, it is not going to effect any GC's at all. You see, nothing is disguised, so, as soon as you hand over 50% of the north, you can have peace in Cyprus.

Although that proposal was backed by both the UN and EU the GCs rejected that idea as it did not serve their purpose.

No, VP, what the GC's rejected was the Annan Plan as a package and not individual proposals in it, just as you accepted the AP as a whole also, which included Racist , Undemocratic and Human Rights violations against the GC's.!

[CBBB]

for the more sophisticated buyer in the TRNC, if they have bought exchange land - which is unlikely, they can form a UK company with bearer shares

(see here http://www.economist.com/finance/displa ... d=13382279
"America is not the only rich nation Mr Sharman tested. He tried to open anonymous shell companies and bank accounts 45 times across the world. These were successful in 17 cases, of which 13 were in OECD countries. One example was Britain, where in 45 minutes on the internet he formed a company without providing identification, was issued with bearer shares (which have been almost universally outlawed because they confer completely anonymous ownership) as well as nominee directors and a secretary. All was achieved at a cost of £515.95 ($753)."

and sell the assets to that company, move the bank account and cash offshore so not covered by an EU court jurisdiction. it would be very hard to have any judgement enforced against non existent assets! and all this can be done by oneself without the need to use an offshore trust lawyer.

The first sentence rules out all of them, because if they were sophisticated, they wouldn't have bought there in the first place!

[Kikapu]

When we win against the Orams - can they appeal??

The ECJ is the senior court in matters of EU law so its judgments on the points of EU law on which it has been asked for rulings are final.

....great. When will the action take place? (i.e passing the Hove house onto the GC or knocking down their house in occupied??

If things go in favour of Mr A at the ECJ, he'll have to go back to a GB court with the ECJ ruling and ask for an enforcement order, probably a "legal charge" on any GB property that is still in the O's names and this will probably also be appealable (within the GB court system).

So this affair will probably still be making news for a long time.

At last someone with comments that take into account the realities on the ground, the Brits can tie this procedure in knots for the next few years.

Regardless, the claims will go through and in the end, stolen GC property buyers will lose the case. Don't forget, the loser will have to pay all the legal costs for both sides, so, the longer the defendants drags this in the courts, the more they will lose. Last time I looked, legal fees go from £200 pounds to £900 pounds an HOUR in the UK..

What are the chances that the UK lawyers will give their fellow Brits with stolen GC properties a break on their legal cost??:lol:

[Z4]

When we win against the Orams - can they appeal??

The ECJ is the senior court in matters of EU law so its judgments on the points of EU law on which it has been asked for rulings are final.

....great. When will the action take place? (i.e passing the Hove house onto the GC or knocking down their house in occupied??

If things go in favour of Mr A at the ECJ, he'll have to go back to a GB court with the ECJ ruling and ask for an enforcement order, probably a "legal charge" on any GB property that is still in the O's names and this will probably also be appealable (within the GB court system).

So this affair will probably still be making news for a long time.

At last someone with comments that take into account the realities on the ground, the Brits can tie this procedure in knots for the next few years.

Regardless, the claims will go through and in the end, stolen GC property buyers will lose the case. Don't forget, the loser will have to pay all the legal costs for both sides, so, the longer the defendants drags this in the courts, the more they will lose. Last time I looked, legal fees go from £200 pounds to £900 pounds an HOUR in the UK..

What are the chances that the UK lawyers will give their fellow Brits with stolen GC properties a break on their legal cost??:lol:

So the Orams could lose their house in the UK and life savings - the lawyers will won't paying.

How can they think they will win? Are they crazy or something?