Cyprus-Forum.com

[Piratis]

I was trying to find where all this hatred is coming from other than ( you invaded the island twice and bla bla )

So you think that invading our island, ethnically cleansing us and stealing our land is not a big deal and that we shouldn't hate you for it?

First "you" started invading our island, ethnically cleansing us and stealing our land between the years 1963-67. Then in 1974 it was "you" again prepared yourself to invade whole Cyprus and finish "your" job with a Junta backed fascist criminals together with significant amount of NG and reservists. As a consequence of the combat between Hellenic forces and Turkish forces u managed to capture only 61% of our Island and 35% remained for us? So why do u cry now for something "you" caused.

You first invaded us in 1571. Then in every year until 1878 you oppressed and killed us. Then in 1958 you started to kill us again. So what 1963 are you talking about? By 1963 you had already killed over 30.000 Cypriots and oppressed us for more than 300 years already. So 1963 was not what happened first. And this is our island. Are you saying that in 1963 Cypriots invaded Cyprus? You are the invaders you fool. If Turks had not invaded Cyprus then there would be peace in Cyprus and no problems. Your invasions of our island is the problem of Cyprus.

We invaded Venetian land.

And then you were killing and oppressing Venetians for 300 years. Then in 1958 you attacked the Venetians again. And then the GCs dropped from the sky in Cyprus in 1963 Do you have any more Turkish fairy tales?

Sotos you are a moron.

You were just a hand full of peasants living under one of the biggest empires on the planet.

What you think you were ever so special that got special treatment from the Ottomans, who constantly needed to "oppress and kill you"?

You were just as oppressed or happy or free as anyone else living under the Ottoman rule.

Yet you are the one who still bitches about it because you have been filled with this shit to help you fight in your unjust war in order to prevent us people from living on our country in peace.

Because you have NO OTHER substantial excuse that you can put forward to justify the killings and oppression you have committed towards the Turkish community on the island since the fall of the empire.

Go read some independent history books god damn it, you have the intellect of a week old roadkill

I see it is very easy for you to find lame excuses for the oppression of the Cypriot people for 100s of years. Very easy to justify the massacres of 10s of thousands of Cypriots. We were peasants, so it must be fine. And if Venetians abused us before, it means it is fine for you to do it as well. Any other lame excuse?

And no, we were not treated just as everyone else. Christians had to pay double the taxes, they were second category people and their testimony was not even accepted in courts.

Also I note one more important thing: After the Cypriots suffered for centuries under your brutal rule, you do not see this suffering and the massacres you committed against us as a reason for retaliation from us against you. Keep this in mind, because I will come back to it.

And then, when it is about your own people, one decade of suffering and some 100s of casualties (which in fact happened during a conflict which you started in 1958) is supposedly the worst thing that happened in the world, and an excuse for you to kill many more 1000s and ethnically cleansing 100s of thousands of innocent people and steal their lands.

Not only that, but GCs are labeled the "evils" that should never be allowed to have democracy. The nice Turks, and other countries that passed through things like slavery, extreme racism (e.g. KKK), civil wars with massive amounts of casualties, for all those people democracy is fine, but not for the "evil" GCs.

You asked from Sotos to read independent books, and I think you should follow your own advice. Not only you justify your every crime against us, obviously a result of a one sided brainwashing you went through, but you even get some basic facts totally wrong.

You said that since the fall of the Ottoman empire we have been killing and oppressing the TCs. Wrong. Although we suffered massively from the Turks, we did not turn against the TCs after the end of the Ottoman rule. On the contrary for the 80 years between the end of the Ottoman rule in 1878 and until 1958, we have been living peacefully with each other.

The only thing that Cypriots did was to continue to seek their freedom and self-determination from the new rulers, the British, just like we had every right to do, especially after the end of WWII when the UN was created and Colonialism was outlawed.

We have been asking for our self determination and freedom since the Ottoman times. This was the result:

During the Greek War of Independence in 1821, the Ottoman authorities feared that Greek Cypriots would rebel again. Archbishop Kyprianos, a powerful leader who worked to improve the education of Greek Cypriot children, was accused of plotting against the government. Kyprianos, his bishops, and hundreds of priests and important laymen were arrested and summarily hanged or decapitated on July 9, 1821.

When the British took over we continued to ask for the same thing, for our self-determination. This was always denied to us. We even asked for a referendum, again denied. And only in 1955 we decided to revolt against the Colonialists, not against you, seeking nothing more and nothing less than our rights.

And then, Turkey collaborated with the British, you joined the British in order to again oppress our revolution, Turkey shipped guns to you to fight against us, and then the conflict started:



So we were fighting against the British and you attacked us with the aim to oppress our revolution and deny to the Cypriot people their freedom and self-determination. And that is when the conflict was restarted. Merely 80 years after the Ottoman rule was over you attacked us again.

Then the combined forces of UK and Turkey, with the help of the TCs oppressed the revolution of the Cypriot people and the 1960 agreements were forced on us, which benefited the Turks, the British and the TC minority, on the expense of the Cypriot people.

The inter-communal conflict didn't start in 1963 as they teach you in your schools.

But what is more important is not the past, but the future. And again, we have more or the same. What we are asking for is nothing more than democracy, freedom and human rights. And we are even willing to make some compromises from some of our non-fundamental rights. Just as before, we are willing to again forgive you, as long you stop harming us and stop violating our human and democratic rights.

And you, as always, you are looking for excuses to deny to the Cypriot people fundamental rights that exist in every other normal democratic country, and you use foreign troops in order to blackmail us and have unfair gains on our expense.

[insan]

Divide and rule myth died long ago. Haven't u realized that it was inevitable clash of Turkish and Greek nationalism?

[Piratis]

I was trying to find where all this hatred is coming from other than ( you invaded the island twice and bla bla )

So you think that invading our island, ethnically cleansing us and stealing our land is not a big deal and that we shouldn't hate you for it?

First "you" started invading our island, ethnically cleansing us and stealing our land between the years 1963-67. Then in 1974 it was "you" again prepared yourself to invade whole Cyprus and finish "your" job with a Junta backed fascist criminals together with significant amount of NG and reservists. As a consequence of the combat between Hellenic forces and Turkish forces u managed to capture only 61% of our Island and 35% remained for us? So why do u cry now for something "you" caused.

well said Insan ..... This is the summary of the Bloody Cyprus problem that we are living since 21'st December 1963 .

Thats right Halil...we dressed up our dad's and uncles into turkish soldiers and they kicked us out of our homes while raping little girls on the way.

your lack of respect to the personal losses of 200,000 GC's in 74 is an insult to all of us. I have always shown respect and remorse at any atrocities that were committed by the GC's in the 60's but now this is the end. You don't give a shit and the cover up of cooperation as you call it is fine as long as you have your own way and Bayrak keeps you all on the payroll after a solution.

To claim that you defended and remained with 35% of the land that just happens to include the homes of 200,000 people is a spit in the face.

The bloody Cyprus problem that your dipshit friend just described forgot to say a few things,.

It left out the TMT killings and provocazia that started the violence, it left out the instructions from Turkish Generals leading units of TMT fighters in Cyprus....it left out the mass killing by napalm while you were "defending" yourselves, it left out the countless atrocities your Troops and the TC traitors of this island who joined hands along with the GC traitors to FUCK the rest of us up.

It left out the fact that the island was ready to agree to a peaceful resolution before you decided that you need to steal 35% of the island in a SECOND invasion. It left out that Turkey has broken the Treaty of Gurantee by maintaing its troops on this island and by declaring a separate bastard state.

Thats right, he left many things out which you off course agree with

DT, can u please answer my questions briefly?

1- What should Turkish leadership have done when Makarios proposed 13 amendments with a sole aim of degrading TCs into minority status?

2- How should TMT have acted during those years while u had many more than TMT alike organizations ready to act like TMT?

Please tell me. Where did TC leadership, TMT and Turkey go wrong?

What they did wrong started long before that. It started in 1958 when the TCs, armed by Turkey, collaborated with the British colonialists in order to oppress the revolution of the Cypriot people, and later imposed on the Cypriot people the 1960 agreements, where the British, Turks and the TC minority had gains on the expense of the Cypriot people.

TCs are a minority. How do you think Turks would react if some foreign power, say Russia, invaded them and then forced them that the Greek minority in Turkey is supposdedly not a minority, and it would have veto powers in everything that the Turks wanted to do in Turkey?

Makarios proposals were made to make the constitution democratic and fair and what you had to do was to accept them.

Galimatioas for us TCs that a community has never been a minority in their homeland. We struggled not to be a minority and we will keep struggling not to be a minority like Kosovans, Macedonians and all others.

Did the "Kosovans" or the "Macedonians" steal their land from others by ethnically cleaning them? No. They have their separate territories and in those territories they are the majority and they have been so, naturally and legally, for long before they declared their states.

On which part of Cyprus have the TCs been the majority? In none. Turkey invaded our island and stole our land from us, something which has been condemned by UN resolutions.

So don't try to give legitimacy to your crimes by associating yourselves with irrelevant cases. There was no foreign invasion, no ethnic cleansing, and no stealing of land in those cases. But this is what you did.

[Piratis]

Divide and rule myth died long ago. Haven't u realized that it was inevitable clash of Turkish and Greek nationalism?

When Rhodes which also has a Turkish minority, united with Greece in 1947, and the self-determination of the people of Rhodes was respected, why there was no such clash?

If the British and the Turks had not enticed the TC minority with gains on the expense of the rest of Cypriots, and they didn't arm them in order to attack the Greek Cypriots, then there would be no conflict.

[Nikitas]

"We invaded Venetian land. "

This is one is one of the funniest phrases on this forum. By analogy when Bulgaria was taken over it was the result of invading Byzantine land and so on with every area that the Ottomans took over. But when the time came to set up the modern Turkish state the song changed, the land miraculously became Turkish.

These clever ploys to deny people their heritage are nonsense. Just let go of your imperial past. It is irrelevant today. You accuse the Greeks of having Megali Idea-titis but in fact you suffer from it a lot more than they do.

[insan]

Divide and rule myth died long ago. Haven't u realized that it was inevitable clash of Turkish and Greek nationalism?

When Rhodes which also has a Turkish minority, united with Greece in 1947, and the self-determination of the people of Rhodes was respected, why there was no such clash?

If the British and the Turks had not enticed the TC minority with gains on the expense of the rest of Cypriots, and they didn't arm them in order to attack the Greek Cypriots, then there would be no conflict.

In little Island Rhodes, there were estimatedly just 11.000 Turks. In 1947 when the Paris treaty signed between Greece and Italy to cede Rhodes to Greece; the Turkish population of Rhodes was 4000 and right after the Rhodes ceded to Greece the Turkish population decreased to 1400.

1- Rhodes wasn't ceded to Itlay by Ottomans like Cyprus ceded to Brits in return of help in case Russia attacks Ottomans.

2- A Rhodesian Turkish revolt against Italian Rule or Greek rule had no chance to succeed with total of 4000 Turkish population.

3- TCs had factual arguments to oppose Enosis in Cyprus because Brits unilaterally abolished the Ottoman-Brit treaty and annexed Ottoman territory Cyprus into their territory.

4- After Turkey renounced her rights on Cyprus in 1923. TCs rationally based their arguments on either Cyprus shall remain under British rule or ceded back to Turkey by oposing Enosis. As u know, TCs were opposing Enosis since the begining of British rule.

4- When EOKA began it's armed struggle to annex Cyprus to Greece; TCs rationally and factually took side with Brits with an aim preventing Enosis and demanded if self determination right should be given for GCs; it should be given for TCs too.

I see nothing wrong and irrational with what TCs had done during ur Enosis struggle.

[insan]

Divide and rule myth died long ago. Haven't u realized that it was inevitable clash of Turkish and Greek nationalism?

When Rhodes which also has a Turkish minority, united with Greece in 1947, and the self-determination of the people of Rhodes was respected, why there was no such clash?

If the British and the Turks had not enticed the TC minority with gains on the expense of the rest of Cypriots, and they didn't arm them in order to attack the Greek Cypriots, then there would be no conflict.

In little Island Rhodes, there were estimatedly just 11.000 Turks. In 1947 when the Paris treaty signed between Greece and Italy to cede Rhodes to Greece; the Turkish population of Rhodes was 4000 and right after the Rhodes ceded to Greece the Turkish population decreased to 1400.

1- Rhodes wasn't ceded to Itlay by Ottomans like Cyprus ceded to Brits in return of help in case Russia attacks Ottomans.

2- A Rhodesian Turkish revolt against Italian Rule or Greek rule had no chance to succeed with total of 4000 Turkish population.

3- TCs had factual arguments to oppose Enosis in Cyprus because Brits unilaterally abolished the Ottoman-Brit treaty and annexed Ottoman territory Cyprus into their territory.

4- After Turkey renounced her rights on Cyprus in 1923. TCs rationally based their arguments on either Cyprus shall remain under British rule or ceded back to Turkey by oposing Enosis. As u know, TCs were opposing Enosis since the begining of British rule.

4- When EOKA began it's armed struggle to annex Cyprus to Greece; TCs rationally and factually took side with Brits with an aim preventing Enosis and demanded if self determination right should be given for GCs; it should be given for TCs too.

I see nothing wrong and irrational with what TCs had done during ur Enosis struggle.

Where is Piratis?

[shahmaran]

Probably exercising in some Eoka-B camp...

[Piratis]

Divide and rule myth died long ago. Haven't u realized that it was inevitable clash of Turkish and Greek nationalism?

When Rhodes which also has a Turkish minority, united with Greece in 1947, and the self-determination of the people of Rhodes was respected, why there was no such clash?

If the British and the Turks had not enticed the TC minority with gains on the expense of the rest of Cypriots, and they didn't arm them in order to attack the Greek Cypriots, then there would be no conflict.

In little Island Rhodes, there were estimatedly just 11.000 Turks. In 1947 when the Paris treaty signed between Greece and Italy to cede Rhodes to Greece; the Turkish population of Rhodes was 4000 and right after the Rhodes ceded to Greece the Turkish population decreased to 1400.

1- Rhodes wasn't ceded to Itlay by Ottomans like Cyprus ceded to Brits in return of help in case Russia attacks Ottomans.

2- A Rhodesian Turkish revolt against Italian Rule or Greek rule had no chance to succeed with total of 4000 Turkish population.

3- TCs had factual arguments to oppose Enosis in Cyprus because Brits unilaterally abolished the Ottoman-Brit treaty and annexed Ottoman territory Cyprus into their territory.

4- After Turkey renounced her rights on Cyprus in 1923. TCs rationally based their arguments on either Cyprus shall remain under British rule or ceded back to Turkey by oposing Enosis. As u know, TCs were opposing Enosis since the begining of British rule.

4- When EOKA began it's armed struggle to annex Cyprus to Greece; TCs rationally and factually took side with Brits with an aim preventing Enosis and demanded if self determination right should be given for GCs; it should be given for TCs too.

I see nothing wrong and irrational with what TCs had done during ur Enosis struggle.

Yet again more imperialistic "arguments". Cyprus is not "owned" by any foreign empire my friend. It is owned by its own people.

But even if I go along your lame excuses, you are still wrong.

Italy annexed Rhodes in 1912 just like Britain annexed Cyprus in 1914. In fact with the 1923 Treaty of Lausanne Turkey denounced any "ownership" over Cyprus. So Turkey "owned" Cyprus as much as they "owned" Rhodes: Zero.

The fact that the Turkish minority in Rhodes is smaller than your minority in Cyprus is again irrelevant in this case. Your minority in Cyprus had as much chances to succeed in fighting against the majority, as the Turkish minority in Rhodes did. You didn't start a war against us because you had a chance of winning such war by yourselves. You started the war so that the British and the Turks could use that as an excuse to deny to us our self-determination. The Turkish minority in Rhodes could have also been used as an excuse, if they were given the incentives and they were armed in order to attack the majority.

As far as your "self-determination" goes, we never denied it to you. It is you who came to our island to enslave us. Besides, we included you in this self-determination, since the self-determination was for Cypriots as a whole and you would get your one vote each as well when Cypriots would peacefully and democratically decide the destiny of their own island. If after 400 years you didn't manage to integrated with the native Cypriot population, and you remained the separate foreign element just as the time you first invaded our island, then you should have gone back from where you came from and you should have stopped denying to the Cypriot people their freedom.

[insan]

Divide and rule myth died long ago. Haven't u realized that it was inevitable clash of Turkish and Greek nationalism?

When Rhodes which also has a Turkish minority, united with Greece in 1947, and the self-determination of the people of Rhodes was respected, why there was no such clash?

If the British and the Turks had not enticed the TC minority with gains on the expense of the rest of Cypriots, and they didn't arm them in order to attack the Greek Cypriots, then there would be no conflict.

In little Island Rhodes, there were estimatedly just 11.000 Turks. In 1947 when the Paris treaty signed between Greece and Italy to cede Rhodes to Greece; the Turkish population of Rhodes was 4000 and right after the Rhodes ceded to Greece the Turkish population decreased to 1400.

1- Rhodes wasn't ceded to Itlay by Ottomans like Cyprus ceded to Brits in return of help in case Russia attacks Ottomans.

2- A Rhodesian Turkish revolt against Italian Rule or Greek rule had no chance to succeed with total of 4000 Turkish population.

3- TCs had factual arguments to oppose Enosis in Cyprus because Brits unilaterally abolished the Ottoman-Brit treaty and annexed Ottoman territory Cyprus into their territory.

4- After Turkey renounced her rights on Cyprus in 1923. TCs rationally based their arguments on either Cyprus shall remain under British rule or ceded back to Turkey by oposing Enosis. As u know, TCs were opposing Enosis since the begining of British rule.

4- When EOKA began it's armed struggle to annex Cyprus to Greece; TCs rationally and factually took side with Brits with an aim preventing Enosis and demanded if self determination right should be given for GCs; it should be given for TCs too.

I see nothing wrong and irrational with what TCs had done during ur Enosis struggle.

Yet again more imperialistic "arguments". Cyprus is not "owned" by any foreign empire my friend. It is owned by its own people.

But even if I go along your lame excuses, you are still wrong.

Italy annexed Rhodes in 1912 just like Britain annexed Cyprus in 1914. In fact with the 1923 Treaty of Lausanne Turkey denounced any "ownership" over Cyprus. So Turkey "owned" Cyprus as much as they "owned" Rhodes: Zero.

The fact that the Turkish minority in Rhodes is smaller than your minority in Cyprus is again irrelevant in this case. Your minority in Cyprus had as much chances to succeed in fighting against the majority, as the Turkish minority in Rhodes did. You didn't start a war against us because you had a chance of winning such war by yourselves. You started the war so that the British and the Turks could use that as an excuse to deny to us our self-determination. The Turkish minority in Rhodes could have also been used as an excuse, if they were given the incentives and they were armed in order to attack the majority.

As far as your "self-determination" goes, we never denied it to you. It is you who came to our island to enslave us. Besides, we included you in this self-determination, since the self-determination was for Cypriots as a whole and you would get your one vote each as well when Cypriots would peacefully and democratically decide the destiny of their own island. If after 400 years you didn't manage to integrated with the native Cypriot population, and you remained the separate foreign element just as the time you first invaded our island, then you should have gone back from where you came from and you should have stopped denying to the Cypriot people their freedom.

Just a bunch of lame excuses to ignore the facts and realities. Pure galimatias.