Cyprus-Forum.com

[Get Real!]

Republic of Turkey citizens who are here and have n't done their military service are not exempt from military service and they have to do it in Turkey not Cyprus.

Are you saying that Turkey has an OBLIGATORY military service for all able-bodied males?

This is news to you? As soon as you finish your education you get called up for national service, the same was as it in Greece, Russia, etc etc.

In that case, how come Turkey's RESERVES are only around 700,000 out of her 80M people???

Just to get a comparative idea, the RoC reserves are around 90,000!!!

That is because they are NOT reserves, those are actually unifromed men in the standing army as we speak. If you mean by "reserves", if war broke out tommorow how many able bodied men (under age of 49) who have military training could be called apon, the number is around 17,000,000.

That's where we're getting confused... I've read that they have ACTIVE DUTY MEN of around 520,000, followed by RESERVES (part time pros) of around 700,000, for a total of 1.2M if a war broke out tomorrow say and would get called up...

Turkish Armed Forces are greater than those of France and Britain combined, with 514,000 men under arms and 380,000 in reserve, plus a robust air force with American fighters. Actually, it's the 2nd largest standing force in NATO after the United States, and 8th biggest number of active troops in the world.

Turkey has the largest Standing Army, second only to USA in NATO ... I seem to recall reading somewhere (can't find the source of that above quote for now)!

It sounds like a mouthful but they have plenty of borders to guard and internal issues so they can never utilize them all in any single campaign against someone else. Another issue is that not all have the same training and/or equipment.

The same goes for hardware, Turkey has around 4,500 tanks but it may turn out that only 400 of them are the latest technology, etc, so there’s a lot of “hidden” information when we only look at general figures.

[Oracle]

Republic of Turkey citizens who are here and have n't done their military service are not exempt from military service and they have to do it in Turkey not Cyprus.

Are you saying that Turkey has an OBLIGATORY military service for all able-bodied males?

This is news to you? As soon as you finish your education you get called up for national service, the same was as it in Greece, Russia, etc etc.

In that case, how come Turkey's RESERVES are only around 700,000 out of her 80M people???

Just to get a comparative idea, the RoC reserves are around 90,000!!!

That is because they are NOT reserves, those are actually unifromed men in the standing army as we speak. If you mean by "reserves", if war broke out tommorow how many able bodied men (under age of 49) who have military training could be called apon, the number is around 17,000,000.

That's where we're getting confused... I've read that they have ACTIVE DUTY MEN of around 520,000, followed by RESERVES (part time pros) of around 700,000, for a total of 1.2M if a war broke out tomorrow say and would get called up...

Turkish Armed Forces are greater than those of France and Britain combined, with 514,000 men under arms and 380,000 in reserve, plus a robust air force with American fighters. Actually, it's the 2nd largest standing force in NATO after the United States, and 8th biggest number of active troops in the world.

Turkey has the largest Standing Army, second only to USA in NATO ... I seem to recall reading somewhere (can't find the source of that above quote for now)!

It sounds like a mouthful but they have plenty of borders to guard and internal issues so they can never utilize them all in any single campaign against someone else. Another issue is that not all have the same training and/or equipment.

The same goes for hardware, Turkey has around 4,500 tanks but it may turn out that only 400 of them are the latest technology, etc, so there’s a lot of “hidden” information when we only look at general figures.

Exactly!

Which brings us "nicely" back to the original worry about their having a SECOND objective to landing all these Settlers on our shores.

Everyone knows and condemns their 40,000 troops on our Island, so how can they increase that number? Bring in some civilians with a ready (yet cryptic) supply of trained / trainable Turks on our doorstep, at the ready, for an immediate attack (if needed).

[Get Real!]

Republic of Turkey citizens who are here and have n't done their military service are not exempt from military service and they have to do it in Turkey not Cyprus.

Are you saying that Turkey has an OBLIGATORY military service for all able-bodied males?

This is news to you? As soon as you finish your education you get called up for national service, the same was as it in Greece, Russia, etc etc.

In that case, how come Turkey's RESERVES are only around 700,000 out of her 80M people???

Just to get a comparative idea, the RoC reserves are around 90,000!!!

That is because they are NOT reserves, those are actually unifromed men in the standing army as we speak. If you mean by "reserves", if war broke out tommorow how many able bodied men (under age of 49) who have military training could be called apon, the number is around 17,000,000.

That's where we're getting confused... I've read that they have ACTIVE DUTY MEN of around 520,000, followed by RESERVES (part time pros) of around 700,000, for a total of 1.2M if a war broke out tomorrow say and would get called up...

Turkish Armed Forces are greater than those of France and Britain combined, with 514,000 men under arms and 380,000 in reserve, plus a robust air force with American fighters. Actually, it's the 2nd largest standing force in NATO after the United States, and 8th biggest number of active troops in the world.

Turkey has the largest Standing Army, second only to USA in NATO ... I seem to recall reading somewhere (can't find the source of that above quote for now)!

It sounds like a mouthful but they have plenty of borders to guard and internal issues so they can never utilize them all in any single campaign against someone else. Another issue is that not all have the same training and/or equipment.

The same goes for hardware, Turkey has around 4,500 tanks but it may turn out that only 400 of them are the latest technology, etc, so there’s a lot of “hidden” information when we only look at general figures.

Exactly!

Which brings us "nicely" back to the original worry about their having a SECOND objective to landing all these Settlers on our shores.

Everyone knows and condemns their 40,000 troops on our Island, so how can they increase that number? Bring in some civilians with a ready (yet cryptic) supply of trained / trainable Turks on our doorstep, at the ready, for an immediate attack (if needed).

Back in 1963/64 Turkey did not launch a ground invasion on Cyprus because they DID NOT have the means to land them, but later when they purchased those special personnel carrying boats that open at the front they did!

The point I’m trying to make is that if Turkey was able to launch a ground invasion in 1974 what would stop them today with 21st century gear?

The bottom line: Turkey doesn’t necessarily need THAT many numbers ON Cyprus to be militarily successful as they CAN get here relatively quickly.

[doesntmatter]

Tim,I was just wondering...How come you were interpreting for these people in the trnc???? From Turkish into...What???

Sorry, my lips are sealed. Professional integrity and all that - I am sure you have been there. If I could tell you, you jaw would drop in astonishment.

There are two questions Tim, which one can you not tell us about? Surely you can tell in to what language you translated to? I just can't see why the secrecy there.

On the other hand, maybe you don't want to say because what you said is just a story you made up for whatever purpose for your own agenda?

You said before that you lived in Turkey for a long time and seen and done so much and from your arguments, you seem to think that you know more than anyone in this forum about anything. Then you moved to the "RoC" for whatever reason. Now you are still seing and doing so much, too much if you ask me that is beginning to sound like it's all made up, especially with all the secrecy.

Anyway, isn't there enough work for you in the South Greek Cyprus that you are forced to cross over the border and take on work in the TRNC as well to earn you wages?

[skipper]

Republic of Turkey citizens who are here and have n't done their military service are not exempt from military service and they have to do it in Turkey not Cyprus.

Are you saying that Turkey has an OBLIGATORY military service for all able-bodied males?

This is news to you? As soon as you finish your education you get called up for national service, the same was as it in Greece, Russia, etc etc.

In that case, how come Turkey's RESERVES are only around 700,000 out of her 80M people???

Just to get a comparative idea, the RoC reserves are around 90,000!!!

That is because they are NOT reserves, those are actually unifromed men in the standing army as we speak. If you mean by "reserves", if war broke out tommorow how many able bodied men (under age of 49) who have military training could be called apon, the number is around 17,000,000.

That's where we're getting confused... I've read that they have ACTIVE DUTY MEN of around 520,000, followed by RESERVES (part time pros) of around 700,000, for a total of 1.2M if a war broke out tomorrow say and would get called up...

The number of males reaching military age each year is 660,000, in fact they have more men that they know what to do with, thats why army duty was reduced to 12 months instead of 18.

I don't know what constitutes a reserve in Turkey but all TC males who have had militray training upto the age of 49 turn up one day a year in army uniform to be counted as "Ready for service". I'm sure they have something similar in Turkey but probably due to the population size they dont need to call everyone.

But my point is there are 17M men under the age of 49 who are fit and have done at least 12 months military service and training and could be called up if the situation got to that stage.

Also 520,000 number is usually the NATO number, there is also the Aegean army which is n't available to NATO.

Regardless we all know the Turkish army is huge, what the exact numbers are do not really make that much difference.

[doesntmatter]

Republic of Turkey citizens who are here and have n't done their military service are not exempt from military service and they have to do it in Turkey not Cyprus.

Are you saying that Turkey has an OBLIGATORY military service for all able-bodied males?

This is news to you? As soon as you finish your education you get called up for national service, the same was as it in Greece, Russia, etc etc.

In that case, how come Turkey's RESERVES are only around 700,000 out of her 80M people???

Just to get a comparative idea, the RoC reserves are around 90,000!!!

That is because they are NOT reserves, those are actually unifromed men in the standing army as we speak. If you mean by "reserves", if war broke out tommorow how many able bodied men (under age of 49) who have military training could be called apon, the number is around 17,000,000.

That's where we're getting confused... I've read that they have ACTIVE DUTY MEN of around 520,000, followed by RESERVES (part time pros) of around 700,000, for a total of 1.2M if a war broke out tomorrow say and would get called up...

Turkish Armed Forces are greater than those of France and Britain combined, with 514,000 men under arms and 380,000 in reserve, plus a robust air force with American fighters. Actually, it's the 2nd largest standing force in NATO after the United States, and 8th biggest number of active troops in the world.

Turkey has the largest Standing Army, second only to USA in NATO ... I seem to recall reading somewhere (can't find the source of that above quote for now)!

It sounds like a mouthful but they have plenty of borders to guard and internal issues so they can never utilize them all in any single campaign against someone else. Another issue is that not all have the same training and/or equipment.

The same goes for hardware, Turkey has around 4,500 tanks but it may turn out that only 400 of them are the latest technology, etc, so there’s a lot of “hidden” information when we only look at general figures.

Exactly!

Which brings us "nicely" back to the original worry about their having a SECOND objective to landing all these Settlers on our shores.

Everyone knows and condemns their 40,000 troops on our Island, so how can they increase that number? Bring in some civilians with a ready (yet cryptic) supply of trained / trainable Turks on our doorstep, at the ready, for an immediate attack (if needed).

Back in 1963/64 Turkey did not launch a ground invasion on Cyprus because they DID NOT have the means to land them, but later when they purchased those special personnel carrying boats that open at the front they did!

The point I’m trying to make is that if Turkey was able to launch a ground invasion in 1974 what would stop them today with 21st century gear?

The bottom line: Turkey doesn’t necessarily need THAT many numbers ON Cyprus to be militarily successful as they CAN get here relatively quickly.

You must be a military genious GR. What pc game do you practice on? Or is the xbox your preferred military training machinary?:lol:

[Get Real!]

Back in 1963/64 Turkey did not launch a ground invasion on Cyprus because they DID NOT have the means to land them, but later when they purchased those special personnel carrying boats that open at the front they did!

The point I’m trying to make is that if Turkey was able to launch a ground invasion in 1974 what would stop them today with 21st century gear?

The bottom line: Turkey doesn’t necessarily need THAT many numbers ON Cyprus to be militarily successful as they CAN get here relatively quickly.

You must be a military genious GR. What pc game do you practice on? Or is the xbox your preferred military training machinary?:lol:

My mate Ricco has pulled up a chair...

[doesntmatter]

Back in 1963/64 Turkey did not launch a ground invasion on Cyprus because they DID NOT have the means to land them, but later when they purchased those special personnel carrying boats that open at the front they did!

The point I’m trying to make is that if Turkey was able to launch a ground invasion in 1974 what would stop them today with 21st century gear?

The bottom line: Turkey doesn’t necessarily need THAT many numbers ON Cyprus to be militarily successful as they CAN get here relatively quickly.

You must be a military genious GR. What pc game do you practice on? Or is the xbox your preferred military training machinary?:lol:

My mate Ricco has pulled up a chair...

He has? WHich oine is he?

[utu]

What do you mean by: "If what you say is true". .... I raised four questions; now numbered for clarity.

Besides, it's not me the Settlers need to fear, but their unsettled future; passively depending on those they allowed to transport them here (Turkey). Until finally the rightful authorities (EU , UN etc) take over their fate and hopefully send them back: colonisation experiment failed!

Chill, Oracle! I was doing a small attempt at humor. Maybe you need to take a deep breath and relax... with maybe a shot or two of Ouzo...

[skipper]

Skipper said:

"If you need a comparison I suppose you could compare them to the "pontians" in the south."

Well, no, it is not a comparison because the Pontians are foreign residents who hold on to their original nationality and definitely DO NOT vote in national or local elections and do not serve in the military. They cannot seek government employment. Their children do not qualify for nationality. Therefore the 15000 Pontians in the south do not stand in the way of a settlement in any way. The settlers in the north are a MAJOR obstacle and hence justify my contention that their preseince is the result of a micky mouse policy. One of those half baked ideas that had their origins in 18th century thinking.

And now you have them what are you going to do with them? THis is the inevitable question and one which will be faced in the talks.

Firstly, I mentioned the Pontians because from everything I have read they are very much stereo-typed in the south.

Secondly, I'm sure most Pontians have now lived in cyprus long enough to beable to apply for citizenship via naturalisation, I'd be surprised if those with children have n't dont so for the sake of their offspring.

Thirdly, 50,000 would have stayed under the Annan plan but as time goes by the number you can send back becomes less and less because believe or not these people have human rights too and you already have 3rd generations growing up now, in 15 years time you will have a 4th generation and you wont beable to send any back because turkey will be like how greece is to GC's, similar but different enough.

They have become a major problem because the GC side has never been in a rush to get a solution because as I keep reading here even now about the "balance of power" changing and whatever. I'm not saying I agree with the policy (if it ever was planned as such) but it's not as Mikey Mouse as it seems because as far as I can see Turkey does n't really care if an agreement is reached or not.