Cyprus-Forum.com

[CopperLine]

Here are some points from the EConvHR which are pertinent to limiting any calls on Settlers' rights over those of GCs ....

a. Concerning such, European law, therefore, should not have an a priori priority, it is not and may not be hierarchically superior to national law.

b. What it should determine is only the minimum level of protection of rights which must be ensured in all member countries.

c. The rights of individuals are limited by the equal rights of others

Above and beyond the application of the EConvHR to Settlers, one would also have to look at the criminality of the process of colonisation.

The above bit from Oracle is total and utter made up bollocks. (a) doesn't even make sense, (b) is just Oracle's jaundiced opinion, and (c) shows that she has no idea what the meaning of equal rights before the law means. Rights aren't traded, and the legal rights of one do not depend on the efficacy of rights for the other.

[Oracle]

Try as you might CopperLine, to minimise this crime ... even by ignoring the fact that it was one of your own who came up with the figure of 300,000 illegal Turkish settlers ...

.... In 2003 the Official figures from the most unbiased source (Council of Europe) estimated them as 115,000. There are of course expected to be many more, post the 2004 Annan debacle.

Regardless of the actual precise numbers ... the essence by which the Law will be applied, will take into account the small overall population size of Cyprus (<1M) and the huge demographic pertubation such a deliberate act of illegal colonisation, has been enacted, by Turkey!

At the very least, the individual settlers are illegal immigrants, and can be treated as such, along with their offspring (hence a return to Turkey is inevitable). Tantamount, is the the fact, that Turkey is in breach of yet another International Law, which is a further nail/coffin in its aspirations, to join the civilised world!

[Oracle]

Here are some points from the EConvHR which are pertinent to limiting any calls on Settlers' rights over those of GCs ....

a. Concerning such, European law, therefore, should not have an a priori priority, it is not and may not be hierarchically superior to national law.

b. What it should determine is only the minimum level of protection of rights which must be ensured in all member countries.

c. The rights of individuals are limited by the equal rights of others

Above and beyond the application of the EConvHR to Settlers, one would also have to look at the criminality of the process of colonisation.

The above bit from Oracle is total and utter made up bollocks. (a) doesn't even make sense, (b) is just Oracle's jaundiced opinion, and (c) shows that she has no idea what the meaning of equal rights before the law means. Rights aren't traded, and the legal rights of one do not depend on the efficacy of rights for the other.

That's right, they are not traded, you fool.

So the Rights of the legal property owners are paramount ... not illegal immigrants, such as Settlers!

[CopperLine]

yawnyawnyawnyawnyawn

[Oracle]

Go to bed then, you are clearly too tired to make sense ....

You have off-loaded the manure you were paid to deliver.

[CopperLine]

So the Rights of the legal property owners are paramount

No, no, no : property rights are not paramount. They do not have a higher status than right to life, right to family life, right to freedom of conscience, right to a fair trial, etc.

Oracle I suggest you just read a basic guide to human rights before you post any more bollocks which embarasses you for your complete knuckle-headed ignorance.

[CopperLine]

Go to bed then, you are clearly too tired to make sense ....

You have off-loaded the manure you were paid to deliver.

...there's more culture in a load of manure than a year's exchange with you ...

[Oracle]

So the Rights of the legal property owners are paramount

No, no, no : property rights are not paramount. They do not have a higher status than right to life, right to family life, right to freedom of conscience, right to a fair trial, etc.

Oracle I suggest you just read a basic guide to human rights before you post any more bollocks which embarasses you for your complete knuckle-headed ignorance.

Idiot ... I did not say the property rights are paramount ... but the rights of the legal property owners ... the PEOPLE who originally were usurped ... It is their Rights which are paramount ..... not some illegal Immigrants (Settlers) that have to have their cases heard.

You have made it quite clear now Copper ... how you wish to distort, to obfuscate ... and it may work on the forum (briefly, until your posts are answered), but it will not work in the Courts, where the Laws are renowned.

[Get Real!]

With regards northern Cyprus where population data is more difficult to specify the most reliable figures - and the method of calculation - can be found at the highly respected Peace Research Institute Oslo report from last year. See http://www.prio.no/Cyprus/Publications/Beyond-Numbers-An-Inquiry-into-the-Political-Integration-of-the-Turkish-Settlers-in-Northern-Cyprus/

Here's an interesting section of that report from page 16...

Using statistics from the Labour and Education authorities of the TRNC, it is possible to divide Turkish nationals who are not citizens of the TRNC but may be present in northern Cyprus at any given moment into five main categories:

• workers with work permits (16,277 plus their families);
• workers without work permits (estimated at 20,000–30,000 plus their families);
• tourists (annual average per day is 1,695);
• students and lecturers (18,398 students and around 500 teaching staff);5
• Turkish army personnel, with families and conscripts (35,000).

Not exactly the kind of misinformation I expected to read in a "highly respected" Peace Research Institute Oslo report...

[Oracle]

With regards northern Cyprus where population data is more difficult to specify the most reliable figures - and the method of calculation - can be found at the highly respected Peace Research Institute Oslo report from last year. See http://www.prio.no/Cyprus/Publications/Beyond-Numbers-An-Inquiry-into-the-Political-Integration-of-the-Turkish-Settlers-in-Northern-Cyprus/

Here's an interesting section of that report from page 16...

Using statistics from the Labour and Education authorities of the TRNC, it is possible to divide Turkish nationals who are not citizens of the TRNC but may be present in northern Cyprus at any given moment into five main categories:

• workers with work permits (16,277 plus their families);
• workers without work permits (estimated at 20,000–30,000 plus their families);
• tourists (annual average per day is 1,695);
• students and lecturers (18,398 students and around 500 teaching staff);5
• Turkish army personnel, with families and conscripts (35,000).

Not exactly the kind of misinformation I expected to read in a "highly respected" Peace Research Institute Oslo report...

Case Closed GR! ... well done!

Someone needs to remind those necessary, of these extra HIDDEN Turkish soldiers sneaked upon our shores ....