Cyprus-Forum.com

[zan]

ENOSIS will still be useful to the Greeks....We are not talking about a simple mans dream of becoming part of a greater Greece but total control of the region in shipping and any oil that might be around. The power it will give the MINORITY Greeks in the region will see them head and shoulders above Turkey.....It is about time some people grow up on this Forum....We all know that Oracle has no intention of doing so because of her Hellenistic racist views but the rest could try and put all the stories they have read together. ENOSIS is still on the cards though the joining of the EU has done most of the work. if it is were to ever happen that the Greeks took over the island then I would pity any leader that does not comply with main land Greek wants....Russian hopes are high that they will have friendlies controlling one of he most important shipping lanes in that area....

[Nikitas]

The time when Enosis could have been declared was between 1964 and 1967 when Greece had the military advantage on the island, yet Enosis was not declared.

It is disappointing to see that TCs here are unwilling to understand anything of what goes on in the "other" community. Well, Enosis is not the ONLY process going on in the GC community, there are other dynamics at work and they too influence the situation.

If you cannot understand the effect the Greek civil war had on Greece then you are nowhere near understanding how mainland Greeks faced the world in general and Cyprus in particular.

Right after WWII (which cost Greece 80 per cent of its infrastructure and almost a million dead, that is about ten per cent of its population), came the civil war. The cost was horrendous, about 600 000 dead. The officers of the Greek forces who served in Cyprus in 1967 lived the the Greek civil war, either as veterans or as young men. Their anticommunist feelings ranked way higher than Enosis.

After the Civil war the Greek army was organized as an inward looking counter insurgency force. It is no accident that the most powerful branch of the Greek army was the military police, head of which was the dictator Ioannides, the man who gave the go ahead for the Cyprus coup in 1974. His primary aim was to save Cyprus from the communist danger (as he perceived it) and not to unite it with Greece.

By 1974 the anticommunist slant of Greek policy was evident even to the most singleminded pro Enosis Cypriots. They knew that a game was being played against them. They would not go for Enosis. And in any case, the first public statement made by the coupists in Cyprus was to rule out Enosis.

In short, no, had the coupists prevailed in 1974 there would have been no Enosis. What would have taken place is an island wide, bicommunal repression of communists and leftists, GCs and TCs in which the TMT and the Turkish mainland agents would have participated. It is no coincidence that in both communities, anyone who is pro independence and against Enosis or Taksim was labeled a leftist or traitor and his murder was considered a non-crime.

Despie the vociferous cries of Enosis by the TC posters the end result of 1974 was Taksim-Enosis of the north with Turkey, and still, the south has not united with Greece, rather it has strengthened its independence on all levels and is charting its own course in the EU. In the EU political union would have been easier, and smoothed the way to practical Enosis, yet it has not happened and there are no signs that it might happen in the future.

In the end it seems that the cry of Enosis has been more useful to the Turkish side.

[Nikitas]

Minority Greeks in the region,

what utter nonsense! All nations in the region have a smaller population than Turkey, does that make all of them )Syria, Lebanon, Israel, Cyprus) minorities?

And which is the importan shipping lane around Cyprus which Greece would be controlling? The most important one I can see is the Suez canal, which is too far away to be influenced by Cyprus and nothing can threaten it as long as the 6th fleet is top dog in the whole of the Mediterranean.

[zan]

Minority Greeks in the region,

what utter nonsense! All nations in the region have a smaller population than Turkey, does that make all of them )Syria, Lebanon, Israel, Cyprus) minorities?

And which is the importan shipping lane around Cyprus which Greece would be controlling? The most important one I can see is the Suez canal, which is too far away to be influenced by Cyprus and nothing can threaten it as long as the 6th fleet is top dog in the whole of the Mediterranean.

The word minority seems to have many meanings Nikitas

Please tell me where Turkey would be if the whole area became Greek controlled???

[Oracle]

The only thing left that wasn't Greek was the government and that was forcefully replaced via the coup.

Was Sampson Greek?

He was more Cypriot than you, if you apply any worthwhile criteria (albeit treasonous at the end)!

So why would the junta forcefully replace one Cypriot, Makarios, with another Cypriot, Sampson?

Not because they wanted Enosis of Cyprus with Greece, but because they wanted an Independent Cyprus ... but one whose leader, they, for the sake of the CIA, could control and who was more palatable to the US/UK/Turkey even!

So don't be a part of the Propaganda that readily subscribes to Enosis being the raison d'être for EVERYTHING!

[zan]

The only thing left that wasn't Greek was the government and that was forcefully replaced via the coup.

Was Sampson Greek?

He was more Cypriot than you, if you apply any worthwhile criteria!

So why would the junta forcefully replace one Cypriot, Makarios, with another Cypriot, Sampson?

Not because they wanted Enosis of Cyprus with Greece, but because they wanted an Independent Cyprus ... but one whose leader, they, for the sake of the CIA, could control and who was more palatable to the US/UK/Turkey even!

So don't be a part of the Propaganda that readily subscribes to Enosis being the reason d'etre for EVERYTHING!

Well the GCs were so open about their plans that of course they would never think of putting a Greek mainlander in place of a Cypriot so that the world would stop believing they were after only independence. The fact that they were treading a thin line between making the world believe it was only "inter-communal" problems they had and not what is described in the AKRITAS PLAN as the real intentions.

Thats right GR...Don't add to the propaganda....Just follow the blind racist chants of a demented woman!!

[Nikitas]

"Please tell me where Turkey would be if the whole area became Greek controlled??? "

Legally it would be exactly where it is today, entitled to whatever continental shelf and Exclusive Economic Zones the Law of the Sea gives it. No better no worse.

Some military men (neither Greek nor Turkish) I have talked to say that the occupation of northern Cyprus makes Turkey more vulnerable to modern weapons such as cruise missiles. Turkey is obliged to defend sea and air links with northern Cyprus and commit valuable assets doing that. In the words of one American admiral "once you move out of your national borders, it does not matter if the distance is 10 or 10 000 miles, the logistics and operational problems are the same".

[Get Real!]

The only thing left that wasn't Greek was the government and that was forcefully replaced via the coup.

Was Sampson Greek?

He was more Cypriot than you, if you apply any worthwhile criteria (albeit treasonous at the end)!

So why would the junta forcefully replace one Cypriot, Makarios, with another Cypriot, Sampson?

Not because they wanted Enosis of Cyprus with Greece, but because they wanted an Independent Cyprus ... but one whose leader, they, for the sake of the CIA, could control and who was more palatable to the US/UK/Turkey even!

So don't be a part of the Propaganda that readily subscribes to Enosis being the raison d'être for EVERYTHING!

Sampson was a sworn “Hellene”; he repeats it over and over himself in videos on Youtube, so the Greeks didn’t have to worry about this traitor ever becoming pro-Cyprus.

Being born and raised somewhere is only part of your ethnic makeup, another being how you feel and in those days a good percentage of Cypriots sold out their country for Greece.

Good riddance to them all and anyone else left over today with such a treasonous mind…

As for the coup…maybe I’m wrong! Maybe they came to play scrabble.

[free_cyprus]

We do not need political union to have enosis. The fact that we share the same culture, religion, language and history is ENOSIS. We are all HELLENES.

o hsvr witnessed some incredible things in the past in my life but your statement takes the cake, this statement can only come from one who is ignorant uneducated idiot

next your going to tell me that half a billion peo-ple that speak spanish in south america and who are catholics and share the same name as spanish mainland are all spanish .

or that two hundred million portoguese speaking brazilians that are catholics and they have portogues names are portogues when the total population of portigal is only 12 million.

when mahatma ghandi libirated india from the british only 32% of india spoke hindu, the other 68% spoke 17 diffrent languages

you should do some reasearch and come to your own conclusions regarding cyprus but to say you are greek and that your ancesters are from greece is a joke

[zan]

"Please tell me where Turkey would be if the whole area became Greek controlled??? "

Legally it would be exactly where it is today, entitled to whatever continental shelf and Exclusive Economic Zones the Law of the Sea gives it. No better no worse.

Some military men (neither Greek nor Turkish) I have talked to say that the occupation of northern Cyprus makes Turkey more vulnerable to modern weapons such as cruise missiles. Turkey is obliged to defend sea and air links with northern Cyprus and commit valuable assets doing that. In the words of one American admiral "once you move out of your national borders, it does not matter if the distance is 10 or 10 000 miles, the logistics and operational problems are the same".

Then why all the dispute Nikitas

For Immediate Release
Contact: Maro Verrios 916-383-7000
Friday, September 26, 1997
"We commend the recent State Department clarification of policy regarding the resolution of Greek-Turkish territorial disputes.

"The United States should not pressure allies to negotiate sovereignty or internationally recognized borders. International treaties and agreements, recognized by both Greece and Turkey for decades, must be defended and upheld against unilateral assault.

"Turkey currently challenges the sovereignty of several hundred Greek islands, of Greek territorial waters, and of Greek national airspace, but refuses to recognize International Court of Justice jurisdiction as a resolution mechanism for any of its claims.

"In keeping with the spirit of the Madrid non-aggression agreement, the Administration should urge Turkey to join Greece in peacefully resolving the continental shelf delimitation question before the ICJ. Any other territorial disputes should be similarly resolved through peaceful, mutually acceptable mechanisms."

The point is that there is more to this than you are making out....