Cyprus-Forum.com

[zan]

Doesn'tfuckinghaveanidea wrote:

20,000 Greek soldiers brough to Cyprus to ensure a successful enosis and you come up with this crap.

Papitis, you are funny.

Those Greek troops which were in actual fact only 12,000, where bought in to resist the planned Turkish invasion which would have annexed and partitioned part of the island.

The Turkish bullshit on this forum is horrendous...

It was you who was claiming that they came to "enforce" Enosis the other day.

Now it's "they came to resist the planned Turkish invasion".

What a joke!

What's wrong?

I stand corrected. I thought that was the whole purpose of debate and having an inquisitive mind for research.

Oracle did state this in another thread:

I agree with you on virtually all these matters Paphitis; no contradictions with what I've read so far.

But I think the emphasis on Enosis, certainly after 1960, is distorted.

From what I can gather on the man, Grivas, I believe his main objective was to remove the inordinate amount of power the Brits and Turks mastered, into the 60's over the Island, and his only ally, in this simmering, continuous war, was Greece. This perpetual Enosis dream attributed to him, sounds like bad publicity spread by the enemies of Cyprus (Britain and Turkey).

Makes perfect sense to me.

There is no credible evidence whatsoever that proves the goal of ENOSIS was maintained post independence.

Let me give your inquisitive mind some help...Look up who was in the presidential seat at the time and have a look at a few of his RECORDED speeches.....Then get back to me........Enjoy!!!!

[BirKibrisli]

Bir let me disagree on the support of EOKA by AKEL.
AKEL was anti - EOKA from day one.

AKEL were just anti-violence but not anti-enosis.

And yet he still claims to have lived the events but still gets even the basics wrong...

He left the country very young and didn't really understand much, not that anything has changed...

Miltiades got nothing wrong...Akel was anti-EOKA ....Or to put it the other way EOKA was anti-AKEL....A certain number of Akel members were killed by EOKA because they were communists...

[Oracle]

Doesn'tfuckinghaveanidea wrote:

20,000 Greek soldiers brough to Cyprus to ensure a successful enosis and you come up with this crap.

Papitis, you are funny.

Those Greek troops which were in actual fact only 12,000, where bought in to resist the planned Turkish invasion which would have annexed and partitioned part of the island.

The Turkish bullshit on this forum is horrendous...

It was you who was claiming that they came to "enforce" Enosis the other day.

Now it's "they came to resist the planned Turkish invasion".

What a joke!

What's wrong?

I stand corrected. I thought that was the whole purpose of debate and having an inquisitive mind for research.

Oracle did state this in another thread:

I agree with you on virtually all these matters Paphitis; no contradictions with what I've read so far.

But I think the emphasis on Enosis, certainly after 1960, is distorted.

From what I can gather on the man, Grivas, I believe his main objective was to remove the inordinate amount of power the Brits and Turks mastered, into the 60's over the Island, and his only ally, in this simmering, continuous war, was Greece. This perpetual Enosis dream attributed to him, sounds like bad publicity spread by the enemies of Cyprus (Britain and Turkey).

Makes perfect sense to me.

There is no credible evidence whatsoever that proves the goal of ENOSIS was maintained post independence.

The presence of the Greek troops was to offer security against TMT separatists, and to provide a deterrence to a possible Turkish Invasion aimed at annexing a part of the island.

The troops were quickly withdrawn when the UN stationed a peacekeeping force on the island.

Yes the TCs conveniently forget Turkey Bombed and Napalmed us in 1964 as their first major attempt at invading and partitioning the island after Independence.

[zan]

Doesn'tfuckinghaveanidea wrote:

20,000 Greek soldiers brough to Cyprus to ensure a successful enosis and you come up with this crap.

Papitis, you are funny.

Those Greek troops which were in actual fact only 12,000, where bought in to resist the planned Turkish invasion which would have annexed and partitioned part of the island.

The Turkish bullshit on this forum is horrendous...

It was you who was claiming that they came to "enforce" Enosis the other day.

Now it's "they came to resist the planned Turkish invasion".

What a joke!

What's wrong?

I stand corrected. I thought that was the whole purpose of debate and having an inquisitive mind for research.

Oracle did state this in another thread:

I agree with you on virtually all these matters Paphitis; no contradictions with what I've read so far.

But I think the emphasis on Enosis, certainly after 1960, is distorted.

From what I can gather on the man, Grivas, I believe his main objective was to remove the inordinate amount of power the Brits and Turks mastered, into the 60's over the Island, and his only ally, in this simmering, continuous war, was Greece. This perpetual Enosis dream attributed to him, sounds like bad publicity spread by the enemies of Cyprus (Britain and Turkey).

Makes perfect sense to me.

There is no credible evidence whatsoever that proves the goal of ENOSIS was maintained post independence.

The presence of the Greek troops was to offer security against TMT separatists, and to provide a deterrence to a possible Turkish Invasion aimed at annexing a part of the island.

The troops were quickly withdrawn when the UN stationed a peacekeeping force on the island.

Yes the TCs conveniently forget Turkey Bombed and Napalmed us in 1964 as their first major attempt at invading and partitioning the island after Independence.

Yes...We forget the intimidation and the murders and your quest for ENOSIS and the relief it brought us...

[Oracle]

This enclave / exclave mentality intrigues me; speaking as one who relishes freedom and minimal restrictions on global (let alone local) movement.

It's not enough anymore, for the TCs to claim they set-up these enclaves under duress, and because of threats from GCs.

That something sinister was being cooked is now a fact ... i.e. the role of the enclaves in roller-coasting the destruction by Turkish invasion of Cyprus.

The mentality of Islamic followers may be at the root of this "back to the womb", get away from the corrupting influences of infidels etc ... "we shall proclaim a section of Earth that is free from Christians by setting up enclaves from where we will gain communal strength", .... to brew and hatch strength for planned incursions to expand outwards from an inner core of strength, perhaps.

Anyway, just thinking aloud because it seems the Oil Rich Arab states that want the Tourist dollars and Euros, but do not want the influence of the Western-freedom-seekers, seem to be setting up more and more such enclaves ...

So TCs .. kindly do not blame the GCs for you, resorting to setting up something for your own gain and interests!

[zan]

This enclave / exclave mentality intrigues me; speaking as one who relishes freedom and minimal restrictions on global (let alone local) movement.

It's not enough anymore, for the TCs to claim they set-up these enclaves under duress, and because of threats from GCs.

That something sinister was being cooked is now a fact ... i.e. the role of the enclaves in roller-coasting the destruction by Turkish invasion of Cyprus.

The mentality of Islamic followers may be at the root of this "back to the womb", get away from the corrupting influences of infidels etc ... "we shall proclaim a section of Earth that is free from Christians by setting up enclaves from where we will gain communal strength", .... to brew and hatch strength for planned incursions to expand outwards from an inner core of strength, perhaps.

Anyway, just thinking aloud because it seems the Oil Rich Arab states that want the Tourist dollars and Euros, but do not want the influence of the Western-freedom-seekers, seem to be setting up more and more such enclaves ...

So TCs .. kindly do not blame the GCs for you, resorting to setting up something for your own gain and interests!

And then she walked back through the closet to Narnia..........Aren't Greeks embarrass ed b his woman

[Paphitis]

Oracle wrote:

That something sinister was being cooked is now a fact ... i.e. the role of the enclaves in roller-coasting the destruction by Turkish invasion of Cyprus.

Here is the evidence that really does clear the air about Turkish propaganda with regards to the enclaves:

In addition to the hostile environment that was created by combatants on both sides, there was a second factor that led to the polarization of both communities: with a view toward partition, the Turks withdrew from predominantly Greek areas and evicted Greeks from areas where Turks were in the majority.

Turkish extremists forced several thousand Turkish peasants to abandon their farms and animals and move into an overcrowded Turkish enclave in Nicosia.

And any TC that resisted or refused to abandon their homes and move into enclaves were either murdered or went missing:

Turkish Cypriots who favoured compromise or a close relationship between the two ethnic communities were targets of TMT violence.

In Limassol, a Turkish Cypriot owner of a restaurant popular with Greeks was threatened and later murdered by the TMT.

Two progressive-thinking, London-educated Turkish barristers who spoke against partition were killed outright by these same Turkish gangs.

The sole aim of the enclaves was so that the TMT extremists were more easily able to gather all TCs and mobilise them towards partition. This could not be achieved if the TCs remained scattered all over Cyprus.

"Thus the aim of partition, camouflaged by Turkish propaganda as `federation,' was relentlessly pursued regardless of loss of human life and the human misery created.

On 23 Dec 63, Turkish Gangs force Armenians to abandon their homes, shops, schools and clubs at gunpoint, to make more room for TCs and create another enclave within the Armenian quarter of Nicosia.

On December 23, 1963, Turkish gangs also moved through the Armenian quarter of Nicosia and forced the inhabitants at gunpoint to leave their houses, shops, church, school and clubs to make room for more Turks.

http://www.ahmp.org/MedByp2.html

Therefore, we can conclude that the TC claims that enclaves were set up for protection against the Greeks is false. The primary objective for the TMT was TAKSIM!

[T_C]

Oracle wrote:

That something sinister was being cooked is now a fact ... i.e. the role of the enclaves in roller-coasting the destruction by Turkish invasion of Cyprus.

Here is the evidence that really does clear the air about Turkish propaganda with regards to the enclaves:

In addition to the hostile environment that was created by combatants on both sides, there was a second factor that led to the polarization of both communities: with a view toward partition, the Turks withdrew from predominantly Greek areas and evicted Greeks from areas where Turks were in the majority.

Turkish extremists forced several thousand Turkish peasants to abandon their farms and animals and move into an overcrowded Turkish enclave in Nicosia.

And any TC that resisted or refused to abandon their homes and move into enclaves were either murdered or went missing:

Turkish Cypriots who favoured compromise or a close relationship between the two ethnic communities were targets of TMT violence.

In Limassol, a Turkish Cypriot owner of a restaurant popular with Greeks was threatened and later murdered by the TMT.

Two progressive-thinking, London-educated Turkish barristers who spoke against partition were killed outright by these same Turkish gangs.

The sole aim of the enclaves was so that the TMT extremists were more easily able to gather all TCs and mobilise them towards partition. This could not be achieved if the TCs remained scattered all over Cyprus.

"Thus the aim of partition, camouflaged by Turkish propaganda as `federation,' was relentlessly pursued regardless of loss of human life and the human misery created.

On 23 Dec 63, Turkish Gangs force Armenians to abandon their homes, shops, schools and clubs at gunpoint, to make more room for TCs and create another enclave within the Armenian quarter of Nicosia.

On December 23, 1963, Turkish gangs also moved through the Armenian quarter of Nicosia and forced the inhabitants at gunpoint to leave their houses, shops, church, school and clubs to make room for more Turks.

http://www.ahmp.org/MedByp2.html

Therefore, we can conclude that the TC claims that enclaves were set up for protection against the Greeks is false. The primary objective for the TMT was TAKSIM!

About the author: Matthew J. Stowell is an Associate with the American Hellenic Media Project (AHMP).

[Oracle]

There are many foreign academics who are students of Hellenic projects.

For example ... http://firestone.princeton.edu/hellenic/hellref.htm

[denizaksulu]

This enclave / exclave mentality intrigues me; speaking as one who relishes freedom and minimal restrictions on global (let alone local) movement.It's not enough anymore, for the TCs to claim they set-up these enclaves under duress, and because of threats from GCs.  That something sinister was being cooked is now a fact ... i.e. the role of the enclaves in roller-coasting the destruction by Turkish invasion of Cyprus.The mentality of Islamic followers may be at the root of this "back to the womb", get away from the corrupting influences of infidels etc ... "we shall proclaim a section of Earth that is free from Christians by setting up enclaves from where we will gain communal strength",  .... to brew and hatch strength for planned incursions to expand outwards from an inner core of strength, perhaps.  Anyway, just thinking aloud     because it seems the Oil Rich Arab states that want the Tourist dollars and Euros, but do not want the influence of the Western-freedom-seekers, seem to be setting up more and more such enclaves ...   So TCs .. kindly do not blame the GCs for you, resorting to setting up something for your own gain and interests!

Dear Oracle. Can I, on behalf of all Turkish Cypriots (some will object)apologise for our folk trying to find safety in numbers and moving to villages where the Turkish Cypriots had a majority or Wholly Turkish Cypriot population. How dare we try to save our lives from the marauding paramilitaries in 1963/64.

Please forgive us.