Cyprus-Forum.com

[zan]

Paphitis said:

"Which brings me back to my point. If Cyprus was not so sternly opposed to the West, and Communist influence was stemmed, then things may have turned out different, and Cyprus may not be divided today."

Cite ONE just ONE instance where Cyprus opposed the West at any time from its inception in 1960 to today.

How would you stem Communist influence in a democratic country in which the Communist party is legal, as it is in England, France, Italy etc? And the party was legal during the British occupation, how could it be outlawed during independence.

Nikitas, we seem to be on a slightly different wavelength.

It was the AKEL rhetoric and sloganeering which was opposed to NATO and the West. I have the feeling that Makarios was unduly pressured and influenced to forge closer ties with the USSR, which for me was like committing suicide.

This was a threat to the US, and so Henry Kissinger and his Athenian cronies gave the go ahead for the coup. And he we are 34 years later, a country divided.

As far as I am concerned, the AKEL party has a long history of betraying Cyprus, or at the very least not behaving in a way that would benefit the nation's well being. They initially opposed the 55-59 resistance, they forged close ties with the Soviet Union during the cold war, and more recently, they backstabbed Tassos Papadopoulos during the last elections.

Their anachronistic ideals do not belong in the 21st century. President Christofias last interview about the PfP and the Cyprus Problem were laughable. IMHO!

I think you need to remember Makarios in all his positions. That of president and leader of the GO Church.....Then you might realise the significance of his decisions towards the USSR???

That is the most ridiculous thing I have heard all day...

I can assure you, that Makarios did not have any personal desire to forge closer ties with a country whose Communist regime had a long history of intolerance and persecution towards the Orthodox Religion. He was influenced to do so by his coalition partners.

Makarios even had excellent relations with JFK and the US at one stage, and his strongest political allies went on to form the DIKO Party after him.

The DIKO Party was a centrist/moderate right wing party.

You are still ignoring his calling to god....WHY?????? Think Orthodox

[Nikitas]

Paphitis said"

"to forge closer ties with the USSR," and what are these ties for heavens sakes?

The cultural visits by some dancers? Or the sale of second rate zivania to Russia? Look at the trade figures of Cyprus over the years 1960- 1974 and see how the UK is our biggest trading partner. The only industrial goods from the easter block were some tractors and some WWII vintage tanks, less than 20 in total.

You are repeating rumor and not fact. The facts are that Cyprus was firmly anchored in the west well before independence and that is where it stayed ever since. And this makes that whole anticommunist mania of the Greeks seem even more stupid now when we are suffering the consequences of the split in our community.

[doesntmatter]

Since there are some Turks buzzing around which look at a person and judge him solely by their apparel .... I would just like to remind you, that to all intents and purposes, those religious Greek Cypriot voters, did not look on Makarios as a religious leader; in their eyes he was more a politician, and fairly lapsed from religious "calling".

Indeed as I have already mentioned, from anecdotal evidence, he was elected despite being a Priest and not because he was.

But the fact he was so gentle/soft in his dealings in a political capacity, may have been due to his more accurately calibrated moral compass.

Instead his being a man-of-the-cloth at the time, was purely indicative of the high level of education he had received.

In the 20th Century, probably 99% of the Cypriots were equally, relatively "mild" followers of Greek Orthodoxy. [b]So those who chose to join the Church as priests, did so not because they were any more religious than the general population, but usually as a means to furthering their educational prospects. Thus priesthood for Makarios was a springboard to his other callings ...[/b] namely gaining freedom for his people.

That is why, unlike the Roman Catholics who have their "Godly" Pope .. the followers of Orthodoxy view religious access as just another historical interest from which to gain further moral guidance when the human spirit is weak and may think of easier means to an end ... such as the routes the Turks do take!

False Priests preaching a fasle religion.

[Nikitas]

Oracle, you are forgetting that Makarios was not a mere priest, he was MONK, with all that implies. It is a world away from being a regular priest, check it out.

[doesntmatter]

Neither Paphitis , a foreign born of Cypriot parents not Oracle are repressentative of the Cypriot people.
Miltiades IS .

Miltiades has two foreign born kids with only one Cypriot parent, so what right does he have to laugh at others or call other "foreigners"?

He should also not forget that he supported enosis and still marches with "Cypriots" carrying the Greek flag at demonstartions.

I along with 80% of the Cypriot population supported ENOSIS , I along with perhaps 70% of the Cypriot people have seen the light , and want nothing more than an independent and united Cyprus with occupation troops out and third world 19th century Turkey not in control of 21st century Cyprus.
Have you seen the light mate ?

I wonder who the other 20% could have been...Those that it would have effected the most perhaps???Those that would have lost everything perhaps??? Those that still stand to lose the most perhaps????

What I want to know is where he gets his percentages from?

First of all, it was 96% of GCs who wanted and voted for enosis and not 80%. Maybe he got the 80% from the wine he drinks but where did he get the 70% from? Ouzo?

I said 80% of the Cypriot population stupid , work it out !

So you meant that 100% of GCs wanted enosis, right?

But 96% of GCs are not exactly 100% of GCs, is it?

Plus you also said:

The AKEL followers were against the struggle 1955-1959 from day one .

Now, as far as I know the percentage of AKEL followers were around 20-30% and that makes it much less than 80% of "Cypriots", doesn't it, you foolish old man.

Now then, you are either telling fibs about the "80% Cypriots" or telling fibs about AKEL not supporting enosis, which is it?

Or, maybe you just say the first thing that comes in to your head in the hope that it'll make you look a little "intelligent".

This is turning out to be as much a joke as your childish obsession in calling people "foreigners"while at the same time claiming that your foreign born kids whose mother is a "real foreigner", "Cypriots".

Foreigner , this ain't your country , your motherland is the one whose flag you are using as your avatar. Check it out at any UN or international source , your avatar is the flag of Turkey , this here island , Stupid , is Cyprus get it through your rather thick scull , you are a foreigner living in Cyprus that's all , nothing wrong with that but stop poking your nose into the business of my country.

Old man, are you talking to me or your own foreigner kids who stand to attention when a foreign flag is hoisted and sing a foreign national anthem?

Ermmm... your "country"? LOL, you mean the UK or the one you hastily abandoned about 50 years ago and doesn't now want you back because you are not Greek enough?

You are a waste of time old man.

[Bananiot]

Doesntmatter, you cannot take away someone's wish. If Miltiades feels like a Cypriot it is not up to you or me to have a say. I think you should post only when you have something constructive to say. In this way you gain respect.

[YFred]

Does anyone remember the speech Makarios gave on Radio in 63 regarding driving the turks to the sea. I was only five years old. Or did I imagen that speech on Greek radio.

[Get Real!]

Does anyone remember the speech Makarios gave on Radio in 63 regarding driving the turks to the sea. I was only five years old. Or did I imagen that speech on Greek radio.

If you were only five years old then somebody must’ve done the “translation” for you… find credible evidence to back this up and come back to us.

[miltiades]

The foreigner wrote:
""""Old man, are you talking to me or your own foreigner kids who stand to attention when a foreign flag is hoisted and sing a foreign national anthem?

Ermmm... your "country"? LOL, you mean the UK or the one you hastily abandoned about 50 years ago and doesn't now want you back because you are not Greek enough? Laughing

You are a waste of time old man. ""
I don't know why I bother with you , perhaps is in my nature to correct assumptions wrongly attributed to my self.
First of all , I , along with thousands of my compatriots emigrated either to the UK or to other parts of the world not in a hastily fashion but in a very orderly and premeditated way , to search for a better standard of living .
My children and my family are my affair and are not on the forum to air their views so kindly leave my family out.
Secondly , I visit Cyprus as often as my circumstances permit and usually I mane about 8 trips a year for mostly long weekends.
In the RoC I have the absolute right to air my views , insult Greece or any other nation without the fear of retribution from the authorities. When asked if I'm from Cyprus my reply is always the same Yes I'm , if pressed to reveal whether a G/C or a T/C I mostly reply " a Cypriot Greek "
My country is Cyprus , I do not see either a Greek or a Turkish Cyprus , realities do tell me that the long history of Cyprus has had much influence from Greece rather than Turkey and that the majority of the Cypriot people are Greek Cypriots . I do not recognise majorities or minorities and I consider all Cypriots to be equal in every sense , just as the Brits in the UK are all equal under the law of the land.
Further more I do not see my self as a minority in the UK having embraced the nation as my own. You ought to try the same approach to Cyprus but there again once a foreigner always a foreigner .

[doesntmatter]

Doesntmatter, you cannot take away someone's wish. If Miltiades feels like a Cypriot it is not up to you or me to have a say. I think you should post only when you have something constructive to say. In this way you gain respect.

I couldn't give a hoot what he wants to be but what gives him the right to call eveyone a "foreigner"?

Bananiot, I respect you views very much but please do not try to dictate to me what and when I should post and plase do not make the mistake to believe that I need "respect" from brainless racist idiots like Miltiades.