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TC ROC passport holders, Citizen without Military Service!

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby Viewpoint » Sat Nov 22, 2008 10:23 pm

BlackBolt
But this doesn't change the fact that Turkey and the 'TRNC' aren't providing for you to the point where you don't need us or the fact that you have to take our handouts to survive. This is very different to the 'paradise' that some of your compatriots profess (though I'm inclined to believe they're not as bright as you and they don't live in the 'TRNC')


What is exactly that you give us that we need to survive, do you think taking them away everyone in the TRNc will die, you were fed these lies at school and over estimate your contribution to our lives, close the borders tomorrow and life would go on as it has done for the past 34 years.

This just sounds like 'we want to live in the houses we stole from you and you should sign them over to us and pay us to live here just because that's what we want and we're people too'. It doesn't make sense (unless you're an irritable child.


The current situation is just as much your doing as it ours, we have been unable to find an equilibrium to resolve matters so while you enjoy the stolen "RoC" and all its benefits we have make use of what we have in order to survive, do I need to remind you that the last attempt at resolving matters was rejected by yourselves.

Equality in democracy relates to majority rule. That's how it works and in this case GCs are the majority population. This means that in a true democracy, most of the people voting will be GCs. However, if you want to think of it as a business partnership then I would argue that equal partnerships are based on equal contribution. Both partners put in the same amount of capital and effort.

If we consider a unified Cyprus as a business partnership, what exactly will the TCs be putting in to equal the contribution of the GCs? The RoC has the superior resources, economy, political contacts etc. What are you offering the business apart from the land that was taken from us during the invasion? Even in this sense, you're still a minority because you just don't have the 'capital' to contribute equally.


If you share equally the natural resources and benefits of recognition you have stolen and solely enjoyed over the last 34 years you will soon realize that we have a great deal to put into a partnership. Plus you conveniently forget your own constitution and the rights therein which quite clearly state our role in the partnership that is the basis for any future unification.

Our leaders are currently negotiating a BBF with political equality, a 2 state solution, a partnership where both sides will have equal say on sensative issues, you better start to voice your objections as you do not seem to be in tune with your leader he appears more inline with what we are saying.

Now I'm no biologist (don't we have one around here?) but it seems to me that natural selection and adaptation tell us that going back to swinging in the trees and looking for bananas isn't a good idea. So how does 'going Turkish' qualify as 'evolution' for the TCs?


As you well know and are showing signs of playing silly buggers we are already Turkish in origin so our close ties with the mainland, mixing with Turks both socially and in business means that over time we will in fact be more Turkish than Cypriot as new generations marry and bear children raised with Turkish values rather than Cypriot, we are witnessing this in our schools today, this is a natural process as opposed to cohabiting with GCs where TCs would object to marry into or accept Greek values or culture. We dont have a problem with this why do you?
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Postby DT. » Sun Nov 23, 2008 2:07 am

Now that the people have tasted the sweet...toys are gonna fly if things are reversed. If, say, a provocation is made by the occupying forces such as a live mortar is fired over to the govt controlled areas rather than a training dud, and the govt with full support of the EU shuts the cease fire line...People ain't gonna get mad with us. They're gonna get mad with talat or whichever poor sap is receiving instructions from Turkey that week)

- Cancellation of all ROC passports given to address holders in the north.
- No more access to destinations via Larnaka
- Visa requirements for Europe
- Cheaper shopping (trust me a whole 2 Euro/kg price difference on lamb makes a difference)
- No more employment and salaries for 2000 TC's.
- No more Sunday afternoons in the malls (No Mcd's, no Burger kings, no junk, period, which should set your youth off in a withdrawal symptom so bad that you'll wish you knew how to mime to James Blunt to appease them.)

Just a few examples which should they happen will turn your people against you. You and other apologists for Turkey will be behaving like airport staff trying to explain to angry tourists why their flight to Majorca got cancelled and they can't have a refund. (and one of your settler baggage handlers ate their bags) :lol:

All we need VP is a provocation so bad that can be spun into a justified argument to our EU partners, and we'll be able to try out this little experiment.
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Postby Viewpoint » Sun Nov 23, 2008 2:35 am

DT. wrote:Now that the people have tasted the sweet...toys are gonna fly if things are reversed. If, say, a provocation is made by the occupying forces such as a live mortar is fired over to the govt controlled areas rather than a training dud, and the govt with full support of the EU shuts the cease fire line...People ain't gonna get mad with us. They're gonna get mad with talat or whichever poor sap is receiving instructions from Turkey that week)

- Cancellation of all ROC passports given to address holders in the north.
- No more access to destinations via Larnaka
- Visa requirements for Europe
- Cheaper shopping (trust me a whole 2 Euro/kg price difference on lamb makes a difference)
- No more employment and salaries for 2000 TC's.
- No more Sunday afternoons in the malls (No Mcd's, no Burger kings, no junk, period, which should set your youth off in a withdrawal symptom so bad that you'll wish you knew how to mime to James Blunt to appease them.)

Just a few examples which should they happen will turn your people against you. You and other apologists for Turkey will be behaving like airport staff trying to explain to angry tourists why their flight to Majorca got cancelled and they can't have a refund. (and one of your settler baggage handlers ate their bags) :lol:

All we need VP is a provocation so bad that can be spun into a justified argument to our EU partners, and we'll be able to try out this little experiment.


I dare you go ahead find an excuse and close the borders, we lived without the GC south for 34 years we can do it again. TC were traveling to Turkey way before th borders were opened everything is much cheaper there. I love to see what the international reaction would be.
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Postby DT. » Sun Nov 23, 2008 2:37 am

Viewpoint wrote:
DT. wrote:Now that the people have tasted the sweet...toys are gonna fly if things are reversed. If, say, a provocation is made by the occupying forces such as a live mortar is fired over to the govt controlled areas rather than a training dud, and the govt with full support of the EU shuts the cease fire line...People ain't gonna get mad with us. They're gonna get mad with talat or whichever poor sap is receiving instructions from Turkey that week)

- Cancellation of all ROC passports given to address holders in the north.
- No more access to destinations via Larnaka
- Visa requirements for Europe
- Cheaper shopping (trust me a whole 2 Euro/kg price difference on lamb makes a difference)
- No more employment and salaries for 2000 TC's.
- No more Sunday afternoons in the malls (No Mcd's, no Burger kings, no junk, period, which should set your youth off in a withdrawal symptom so bad that you'll wish you knew how to mime to James Blunt to appease them.)

Just a few examples which should they happen will turn your people against you. You and other apologists for Turkey will be behaving like airport staff trying to explain to angry tourists why their flight to Majorca got cancelled and they can't have a refund. (and one of your settler baggage handlers ate their bags) :lol:

All we need VP is a provocation so bad that can be spun into a justified argument to our EU partners, and we'll be able to try out this little experiment.


I dare you go ahead find an excuse and close the borders, we lived without the GC south for 34 years we can do it again. TC were traveling to Turkey way before th borders were opened everything is much cheaper there. I love to see what the international reaction would be.


we'll take care of the international reaction (wouldn't shoot ourselves in the foot) you just take care of the domestic reaction cause you'll have a revolution on your hands. If you think the tc's are going to be satisfied with going back to the 80's you're kidding yourself.
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Postby Viewpoint » Sun Nov 23, 2008 2:39 am

DT. wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:
DT. wrote:Now that the people have tasted the sweet...toys are gonna fly if things are reversed. If, say, a provocation is made by the occupying forces such as a live mortar is fired over to the govt controlled areas rather than a training dud, and the govt with full support of the EU shuts the cease fire line...People ain't gonna get mad with us. They're gonna get mad with talat or whichever poor sap is receiving instructions from Turkey that week)

- Cancellation of all ROC passports given to address holders in the north.
- No more access to destinations via Larnaka
- Visa requirements for Europe
- Cheaper shopping (trust me a whole 2 Euro/kg price difference on lamb makes a difference)
- No more employment and salaries for 2000 TC's.
- No more Sunday afternoons in the malls (No Mcd's, no Burger kings, no junk, period, which should set your youth off in a withdrawal symptom so bad that you'll wish you knew how to mime to James Blunt to appease them.)

Just a few examples which should they happen will turn your people against you. You and other apologists for Turkey will be behaving like airport staff trying to explain to angry tourists why their flight to Majorca got cancelled and they can't have a refund. (and one of your settler baggage handlers ate their bags) :lol:

All we need VP is a provocation so bad that can be spun into a justified argument to our EU partners, and we'll be able to try out this little experiment.


I dare you go ahead find an excuse and close the borders, we lived without the GC south for 34 years we can do it again. TC were traveling to Turkey way before th borders were opened everything is much cheaper there. I love to see what the international reaction would be.


we'll take care of the international reaction (wouldn't shoot ourselves in the foot) you just take care of the domestic reaction cause you'll have a revolution on your hands. If you think the tc's are going to be satisfied with going back to the 80's you're kidding yourself.


Do it,you havent got the balls, the backlash would be tremendous and would benefit us 110%, please please do it, you cannot be that stupid or can you?
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Postby BlackBolt » Sun Nov 23, 2008 6:00 pm

Viewpoint wrote:What is exactly that you give us that we need to survive, do you think taking them away everyone in the TRNc will die, you were fed these lies at school and over estimate your contribution to our lives, close the borders tomorrow and life would go on as it has done for the past 34 years.


I think DT covered this for you, I'll let you two discuss it.

Viewpoint wrote:The current situation is just as much your doing as it ours, we have been unable to find an equilibrium to resolve matters so while you enjoy the stolen "RoC" and all its benefits we have make use of what we have in order to survive, do I need to remind you that the last attempt at resolving matters was rejected by yourselves.


Even if you see it like that, it doesn't change the fact that you are demanding compensation from us even though it is you that is occupying OUR land and supporting a regime that is clearly against the Republic of Cyprus. How you can have the audacity to make ANY claims on 'Cypriotness' (to whatever degree) or the island of Cyprus (and all her resources etc) is absolutely laughable. If you support a Turkish regime, you are Turkish. You have even said this yourself with your own 'evolution of the TCs' theory. As you well know, the last proposal was rejected because it was a transparent attempt to legalise the crimes of Turkey against us.

Viewpoint wrote:
If you share equally the natural resources and benefits of recognition you have stolen and solely enjoyed over the last 34 years you will soon realize that we have a great deal to put into a partnership. Plus you conveniently forget your own constitution and the rights therein which quite clearly state our role in the partnership that is the basis for any future unification.


'A great many things' says nothing. Give me a list of what you have to offer apart from the things that were taken from us. Even if you want to say we have all the natural resources and benefits of recognition, then why the hell should we share them with you if you have nothing to offer the partnership in return? Out of the goodness of our hearts?

As for the constitution, then really you have no claim to it's protection or guarantees as you violate it every day you choose to support a foreign occupying army against the Republic of Cyprus.

Viewpoint wrote: Our leaders are currently negotiating a BBF with political equality, a 2 state solution, a partnership where both sides will have equal say on sensative issues, you better start to voice your objections as you do not seem to be in tune with your leader he appears more inline with what we are saying.


I am sure President Christofias is well aware of the objections to his stance. Lets just see how it goes and if there is a referendum then let the people speak. As long as I get my vote, I'm glad to go with the majority.

Viewpoint wrote:
As you well know and are showing signs of playing silly buggers we are already Turkish in origin so our close ties with the mainland, mixing with Turks both socially and in business means that over time we will in fact be more Turkish than Cypriot as new generations marry and bear children raised with Turkish values rather than Cypriot, we are witnessing this in our schools today, this is a natural process as opposed to cohabiting with GCs where TCs would object to marry into or accept Greek values or culture. We dont have a problem with this why do you?


I'm not messing with you VP, I actually think you're a fantastic bloke and enjoy your contributions immensely. I genuinely find your ideas about the TCs 'returning to their roots' very interesting and think they are important.

You see, if you are all going to be Turkish and reject any notion of 'Cypriotness' then really you have no claim on Cyprus. Personally I completely support your renunciation of 'Turkish Cypriotness' and I am very happy for you all to stand up and shout at the top of your voices that you're Turkish and want nothing to do with Greeks/GCs.
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Postby Viewpoint » Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:15 pm

Blackbolt
Even if you see it like that, it doesn't change the fact that you are demanding compensation from us even though it is you that is occupying OUR land and supporting a regime that is clearly against the Republic of Cyprus. How you can have the audacity to make ANY claims on 'Cypriotness' (to whatever degree) or the island of Cyprus (and all her resources etc) is absolutely laughable. If you support a Turkish regime, you are Turkish. You have even said this yourself with your own 'evolution of the TCs' theory. As you well know, the last proposal was rejected because it was a transparent attempt to legalise the crimes of Turkey against us.


Ok lets amalgamate all the benefits of both sides starting from 1960 and split everything, economically you have firstly hijacked or even stolen th "RoC" turning it into a GC state sequeezing recognition for all its worth add to that international financial support and you will owe the TCs billions of dollars. Your land on the whole is still in place and can be returned but how will you pay back what you have solely exploited for over 45 years?

I support those that have turned my life from the ghettos of the 60s to a state where we do not live in fear of discrimiantion or persecution, where we are not afraid to roam freely and enjoy our country.

The AP was not only supported by us but also the UN USA and EU yet as it did not live up to your notion of gaining what you want you rejected it. So the last side to reject a solution wa sin fact yourselves.

'A great many things' says nothing. Give me a list of what you have to offer apart from the things that were taken from us. Even if you want to say we have all the natural resources and benefits of recognition, then why the hell should we share them with you if you have nothing to offer the partnership in return? Out of the goodness of our hearts?

As for the constitution, then really you have no claim to it's protection or guarantees as you violate it every day you choose to support a foreign occupying army against the Republic of Cyprus.


No Turkish army, freedom to settle where you wish, stronger economy, removal of settlers, a curb on more settlers moving in, more prosperity, refugees returning from both sides, stronger ties with Turkey, Turkish ports, problem solved and not occupying leaders time which can be used to concentrate on developing Cyprus, removal of borders, better understanding of the TCs, a well educated youth, I could go on and on but you will shoot everything down as this is the GC way.

I choose to support the Turkish army because you are the ones who wanted to change to constitiution you live by today so as not to give us the protection it provided, so supporting my protector is better than supporting my potential murderer.

I am sure President Christofias is well aware of the objections to his stance. Lets just see how it goes and if there is a referendum then let the people speak. As long as I get my vote, I'm glad to go with the majority.


As you will have go with the other side and their decision as they represent 50% of this deal without it you are nowhere closer to resolving this issue.


I'm not messing with you VP, I actually think you're a fantastic bloke and enjoy your contributions immensely. I genuinely find your ideas about the TCs 'returning to their roots' very interesting and think they are important.

You see, if you are all going to be Turkish and reject any notion of 'Cypriotness' then really you have no claim on Cyprus. Personally I completely support your renunciation of 'Turkish Cypriotness' and I am very happy for you all to stand up and shout at the top of your voices that you're Turkish and want nothing to do with Greeks/GCs.


That's where you are wrong we have every right to claim Cyprus as we are indigenous to this land the fact that we are unable to share it mixed together is reconfirmed by us not being able to find a balance that will bring about a solution that both sides can accept. 1974 was the explosion that provided the current day divide which has brought about a peaceful and prosperous existence for the majority, this you cannot deny as you have time and time again boasted about the GCs prosperity and wealth. The opportunity to nurture "Cypriotisim" died in 1963 we lost that chance and TCs were forced to cling onto their Turkishness more strongly than their diminishing and problem creating Cypriot side. Over the last 34 years TCs have been exposed to Turkishness through many outlets be it people, the media, visits to Turkey, financial support and interacting with Turks both locally and abroad we have become more and more Turkish this in 10 20 years time and with an increasing influx of Turks who in the last few years have not just been uneducated workers but Turks well educated looking for a slower pace of life therefore moving to the TRNC from the big cities of Turkey will change the mosaic and fabric of TCs forever. There are those few that will oppose this change but on the whole they will embrace and accept that the next generations will be increasing and growing as Turks more than Cypriots. There is a definite increase in TC and Turkish marriages, our children go to Turkey to study at universities they meet and marry Turks this will continue to happen unless a solution is found and the 2 sides are brought closer together to build a Cypriot people otherwise you are on your own.
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Postby Get Real! » Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:29 am

Viewpoint wrote:That's where you are wrong we have every right to claim Cyprus as we are indigenous to this land...

:? Right, well maybe it’s about time you told us when your people made first contact with this island because the GCs claim millenniums ago... Keep in mind that indigenousness is EXCLUSIVE and non-transferable. You won’t find any country where there are two indigenous people.
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Postby Viewpoint » Mon Nov 24, 2008 1:21 am

Get Real! wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:That's where you are wrong we have every right to claim Cyprus as we are indigenous to this land...

:? Right, well maybe it’s about time you told us when your people made first contact with this island because the GCs claim millenniums ago... Keep in mind that indigenousness is EXCLUSIVE and non-transferable. You won’t find any country where there are two indigenous people.


Doesnt give you any more rights, we are both indigenous thats what you have to come to terms with not me. The fact that we cannot live together is why we are still on this forum and why we are divided.
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Postby Get Real! » Mon Nov 24, 2008 1:24 am

Viewpoint wrote:
Get Real! wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:That's where you are wrong we have every right to claim Cyprus as we are indigenous to this land...

:? Right, well maybe it’s about time you told us when your people made first contact with this island because the GCs claim millenniums ago... Keep in mind that indigenousness is EXCLUSIVE and non-transferable. You won’t find any country where there are two indigenous people.

Doesnt give you any more rights, we are both indigenous thats what you have to come to terms with not me. The fact that we cannot live together is why we are still on this forum and why we are divided.

Why does the word “indigenous” elude you? :lol:
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