Cyprus-Forum.com

[Viewpoint]

"why can’t the Greek Cypriots accept such a model? "

Becaue DENKTASH and Makarios in 1977 agreed on a BIREGIONAL federation and not on a Binational Confederation. The agreement was reaffirmed in two more agreements.

And because we choose leaders who keep their word, and not protitutes who cannot keep their panties on, we proceed along what was agreed and signed. Are you getting it now Mr H?

Akritas?

[halil]

This non paper does not represent a proposal of the G/C side but a last effort to overcome the debate on vision and begin at last negtiotion on core issues.

The GC and TC reperesentive at talks conducted under the good offices of the secretary general of the united nations,have reached the following preliminary conclusions,which do not constitute an agreement,because nothing is sighn is agreed until everything is agreed on all issues:

a) The 1960 constitution ,based on Zurich Agreement of 1959 ,can not any longer reflect the new arrangement to be made and must be abrogated.
b) A new foundation agreement is needed on which the new constitution of Cyprus will be based.
c) A new foundation agreement must be respect new political relationship between the GC and TC and must be that of political equality,bizonality and bicomunality.
d)Regarding political equality ,which does not mean numarical equallity,it must be clearly understood that the GC numarical majority and the TC numarical minority will have equal political rights and will both effectively participate in the executive,legislative and judical organs of the the states of Cyprus so that the GC numarical majority will not be able to impose its will on the TC numerical minority.
e) The state of Cyprus must have a single sovereignty ,single international personality and single citizenship and the settlement must exclude union in whole or in part of the other country or any form of partition or secession.
it shall contain 2 seperate self administeral states i.e a GC and TC state , each having its own executive ,legislative ,judical organs , police and civil service operating in the sphere of functions stated in the foundation agreement and in the constituation.
f)The state of Cyprus should posses all organs and powers necessary to functiones as a state.
g)The state of Cyprus will not be empowered to encroach on the powers of the aforesaid self adminstered states.
h)Subjuct to a agreement on all aspect of the core issue of security, the treaty of guarantee may be extended so as to cover the territorial integrity, security and constutional order of the aforesaid self-abminstreted states.
i) A plan must be agreed for creation ,within a specified time, of the necessary infa structure to raise the per capita income of the Turkish Cypriots.
j)The core issue to be discussed in a sprit of give and take .
k)The agreement reached ,including the accession of the state of Cyprus to the E.U should be put together in seperate referanda to the GC and TC's who, than (if the result is position) will be counders of the new state of affaires of the sovereign state of Cyprus.

May13,2003 Proposals from Ex-Presidend Clirdes .

You see friends what thet were saying before ..... İdeas didn't came from the moon .....in diplomacy everywords you are saying always wll noted and afterwards you drive your road map .

[Get Real!]

The way I see the 'Cyprus Problem' is different from most TC views to a certain degree.

To 'Partition' our Island is an outmoded ideal. This ideal was created to counter the GCs demands for Enosis. During the 50's and 60's our minds, (all Cypriots that is, whether Greek speaking, Armenian, Maronite and Turkish speaking Cypriots) were polarised.
I no longer see the necessity for partition simply because there is no more any demand for Enosis. Our Greek speaking compatriots (a majority) have realised this now. My first choice of a solution is an agreed complete re-unification of our island under a constitution which will have safeguards for all. (the finer details I will leave to the political minds -which I am not). Where possible all refugees gain access to their domiciles and land, or compensated.

Under the guardianship of the EU we should give this a serious thought.

Ofcourse this is a personal opinion, so I will at this stage add that I am opposed to systematic ethnic cleansing which has taken place (very efficiently I might add) I find this wrong. The destruction of Cyprus' cultural heritage was also wrong. This day and age we (or rather Turkey) has no right to 'gain' from the 'conquest'.

Turkey in 1974, had rightly under the treaty of guarantorship, 'intervened' and prevented the real or unreal 'threat of annihilation' of the TC population of Cyprus. Perhaps it was the GCs who gained more from this intervention at that time(ending of their own civil war). But once the threat had disappeared the Turkish Army should have withdrawn and all refugees returned to their homes. TC and GC refugees were still hoping for a time when they would be allowed to return to their homes. For some it may be too late. Time is passing slowly. I think we should strive to achieve peace on this island without the interference from Superpowers or others. I think we should give these peace talks a chance and I am aware they are not talking of a'complete re-unification' but a BBF. To me, this is a step towards eventual partition. I think the GCs will not accept this (referandum) and I am of the opinion that the current negotiators are wasting our time. I cannot but feel a sense of hypocrisy of intent about.

The puppet is held by too many strings.

A post worthy of honorary Choirokitian status…

[Oracle]

Get Real!

Thank you for the comments!

I remember once seeing a photograph of you and your Mrs! Many years ago? Please don't try and mock me, especially on a site where many are listening! Otherwise those photos may soon re-appear!!!!!!

Boo! Poor show, bad form!

Resorting to threats just because you do not like someone's reply to your post is of the lowest order.

We have a code of conduct in CyProb above and beyond the strict rules of CF for intolerance to personal threats whilst practicing freedom of speech.

Two more warnings and I will seek Admin's intervention.

[Get Real!]

Get Real!

Thank you for the comments!

I remember once seeing a photograph of you and your Mrs! Many years ago? Please don't try and mock me, especially on a site where many are listening! Otherwise those photos may soon re-appear!!!!!!

Boo! Poor show, bad form!

Resorting to threats just because you do not like someone's reply to your post is of the lowest order.

We have a code of conduct in CyProb above and beyond the strict rules of CF for intolerance to personal threats whilst practicing freedom of speech.

Two more warnings and I will seek Admin's intervention.

It's actually very unintelligent of her because she's threatening to post something that has ALREADY been posted. I might actually upload a marriage pic for her... if I'm to be paraded do it in style!

[Paphitis]

Get Real!

Thank you for the comments!

I remember once seeing a photograph of you and your Mrs! Many years ago? Please don't try and mock me, especially on a site where many are listening! Otherwise those photos may soon re-appear!!!!!!

Boo! Poor show, bad form!

Resorting to threats just because you do not like someone's reply to your post is of the lowest order.

We have a code of conduct in CyProb above and beyond the strict rules of CF for intolerance to personal threats whilst practicing freedom of speech.

Two more warnings and I will seek Admin's intervention.

It's actually very unintelligent of her because she's threatening to post something that has ALREADY been posted. I might actually upload a marriage pic for her... if I'm to be paraded do it in style!

Please don't GR!

You will give a young guy like me nightmares.

I do not want to see a fat hairy Turk!

[DT.]

Get Real!

Thank you for the comments!

I remember once seeing a photograph of you and your Mrs! Many years ago? Please don't try and mock me, especially on a site where many are listening! Otherwise those photos may soon re-appear!!!!!!

Boo! Poor show, bad form!

Resorting to threats just because you do not like someone's reply to your post is of the lowest order.

We have a code of conduct in CyProb above and beyond the strict rules of CF for intolerance to personal threats whilst practicing freedom of speech.

Two more warnings and I will seek Admin's intervention.

It's actually very unintelligent of her because she's threatening to post something that has ALREADY been posted. I might actually upload a marriage pic for her... if I'm to be paraded do it in style!

Please don't GR!

You will give a young guy like me nightmares.

I do not want to see a fat hairy Turk!

"for" her paphiti...not "of" her Put down the knife GR!

[Paphitis]

Get Real!

Thank you for the comments!

I remember once seeing a photograph of you and your Mrs! Many years ago? Please don't try and mock me, especially on a site where many are listening! Otherwise those photos may soon re-appear!!!!!!

Boo! Poor show, bad form!

Resorting to threats just because you do not like someone's reply to your post is of the lowest order.

We have a code of conduct in CyProb above and beyond the strict rules of CF for intolerance to personal threats whilst practicing freedom of speech.

Two more warnings and I will seek Admin's intervention.

It's actually very unintelligent of her because she's threatening to post something that has ALREADY been posted. I might actually upload a marriage pic for her... if I'm to be paraded do it in style!

Please don't GR!

You will give a young guy like me nightmares.

I do not want to see a fat hairy Turk!

"for" her paphiti...not "of" her Put down the knife GR!

Oh sorry! My apologies.

I should of said that I do not want to see a fat hairy Choirokitian!

[Oracle]

Get Real!

Thank you for the comments!

I remember once seeing a photograph of you and your Mrs! Many years ago? Please don't try and mock me, especially on a site where many are listening! Otherwise those photos may soon re-appear!!!!!!

Boo! Poor show, bad form!

Resorting to threats just because you do not like someone's reply to your post is of the lowest order.

We have a code of conduct in CyProb above and beyond the strict rules of CF for intolerance to personal threats whilst practicing freedom of speech.

Two more warnings and I will seek Admin's intervention.

It's actually very unintelligent of her because she's threatening to post something that has ALREADY been posted. I might actually upload a marriage pic for her... if I'm to be paraded do it in style!

Jump the (shot) gun! Why don't you start a thread and we can all post our Wedding photographs ....

[halil]

lets to study Cyprus problem movements from 1977 Makarios-Denktas Accords .

After intensive efforts by Waldheim, Makarios and Denktas met on January 27, 1977, the first meeting between the two men since the Turkish Cypriots had withdrawn from the government of the republic in 1964. By then Makarios was leaning toward negotiation on the basis of a bizonal federation, provided that there be some Turkish Cypriot territorial concessions. He continued to insist on a strong central government and freedom of movement for all Cypriots. He demanded 80 percent of the territory, proportionate to the size of the Greek Cypriot population, but indicated that he might accept 75 percent if it included Varosha, the formerly prosperous tourist area of Famagusta to which 35,000 Greek Cypriots wanted to return. Denktas apparently indicated readiness to consider about 68 percent.

On February 12, 1977, the two men met and agreed on four guidelines. The first was that Cyprus would be an independent, nonaligned, bicommunal federal republic. Second, the territory under the administration of each community was to be discussed in light of economic viability, productivity, and property rights. Third, questions of principle such as freedom of movement and settlement, rights of ownership, and certain special matters were to be open for discussion, taking into consideration the fundamental decision for a bicommunal federal system and certain practical difficulties. Finally, the powers and functions of a central government would be such as to safeguard the unity of the country.

This achievement raised hopes among Cyprus's foreign friends that a settlement could be reached. These hopes were dashed when President Makarios, the central figure in the Greek Cypriot community, died of a heart attack in August 1977. Spyros Kyprianou, his successor, pledged to adhere to positions he believed Makarios would have taken.

Over time, it became clear that Kyprianou enjoyed less political room to maneuver than his predecessor, partly because of the growing political strength of the refugees and displaced persons. Kyprianou found in this group a ready-made constituency, and he embraced their advocacy of their right to return to homes and property and their call for a permeable border and unimpeded free movement and unrestricted settlement. This position sharpened differences with the Turkish Cypriot advocacy of a tightly controlled border and guarantees that the ethnic balance established by the de facto partition would remain undisturbed.

In April 1978, a new set of Turkish Cypriot proposals was made public, but was quickly rejected by the Greek Cypriot negotiator, Papadopoulos, who objected to both the proposals constitutional and territorial aspects. Kyprianou dismissed Papadopoulos in June over disagreements.

Later in 1978, external powers tried their hand at a Cyprus proposal. President Jimmy Carter had convinced a slim majority in the United States Congress to lift the arms embargo imposed against Turkey because of its intervention on Cyprus; Carter pledged to renew diplomatic efforts to resolve the Cyprus problem. The United States then worked with Britain and Canada to launch a new settlement plan. The twelve-point plan (often called the ABC plan because of its American, British, and Canadian sponsorship) proposed a biregional, independent federal republic. The state's constitutional structure would conform to the Makarios-Denkta guidelines of February 1977, as well as to pertinent clauses of the 1960 constitution. There would be two constituent regions. The federal government would be responsible for foreign affairs, defense, currency and central banking, trade, communications, federal finance, customs, immigration and emigration, and civil aviation. Residual functions would rest with the two regions. A bicameral legislature would be established, with the upper chamber evenly divided between the two communities, and the lower one divided on a population-ratio basis. The Council of Ministers would be jointly selected by the president and vice president, one of whom would be a Greek Cypriot and the other a Turkish Cypriot. On territorial issues, the plan envisioned significant Turkish Cypriot geographic concessions, although the size and locale of the two regions would take into account factors such as economic viability, security, population distribution, and history. The plan addressed the refugee issue, and called for essentially a demilitarized republic and withdrawal of all foreign forces except for an agreedupon contingent.

The Republic of Cyprus government objected to many points in the plan, largely because it preempted various positions of the two sides. The Greek Cypriot foreign minister said he would have preferred an agenda that did not go into so much detail. Other Greek Cypriot forces, including the church and some political parties, also opposed the plan. In the Greek community, only Glafkos Clerides urged its acceptance as a basis for talks. Turkish Cypriots also formally rejected the plan as an overall settlement package.

However, the ABC plan stimulated further efforts toward a settlement, and the UN Security Council acted quickly to resume intercommunal talks, on the basis of an agenda that combined the Makarios-Denktas guidelines with some aspects of the allied plan.

Two other effects of the American initiative should be noted. The plan was the last American-drafted proposal for Cyprus and convinced some in the Western policy community that even a fairminded effort had little chance of winning Cypriot acceptance. Second, it reinforced Cypriot anxiety about having solutions imposed from outside. By the early 1990s, many features of the initiative remained part of the UN-brokered negotiating effort, but Cypriots remained committed to writing their own plan.