Cyprus-Forum.com

[pantelis]

http://www.cyprus-mail.com/news/main.ph ... 6&cat_id=1


Mr. Rolandis, you are either too naive or very ambitious for higher political posts (with outside support) to have the audacity to say what you have said in the Mail (I don’t see how the “Cyprus” part fits, in the name of this paper).
Yes, Erdogan and Talat seem to be nice people who may mean what they proclaim, regarding their desires for a solution to the Cyprus problem.
The question is, "did they, or do they have the ultimate authority and final say of the Turkish side?", to the kind of a solution that would be acceptable to their side?
The result of the Turkish Cypriot 2004 referendum was not final until the Turkish parliament, next, and the Turkish "National Security Council" last, had “their” chance to approve Annan Plan. Did the Turkish Generals or parliament, as a body, express any support or approval to the plan, before or after the referenda?
The Greek Cypriot side was not given the chance for additional votes or approvals to the plan; their vote was final. The Greek parliament did not ask for a say in the matter either. Why so?
What could have the Greek & Turkish Cypriots done, if after both had voted "YES" and one of the two bodies in Turkey had voted "NO"?
NOTHING!
How about the international community, could have they done anything?
NOTHING. They had done nothing for 30 years, why start now?
The Greek Cypriot side would have been pressured right now, as they are, to make additional concessions, to satisfy the demands of the Regime that actually rules Turkey, and Erdogan and Talat have no powers over this regime.

The un-democratic regime the white South Africa did not fall, until they were isolated by the entire international community. The duo, United States and Kingdom, coincidentally, were the last ones to give in the international outcry, and join them. It took many years and many black South African lives, for them to finally see the injustices of the regime. Their financial and strategic interests, as it is the case with Turkey, were more important, than the injustices committed to the majority of the South African people. The Greek Cypriots are not suffering any longer. Why should they bother?

Mr. Rolandi, why don't retire from the Cyprus political stage? You have done enough damage to Cyprus already and you statesmanship and leadership have been proved a big failure during the many years you have served as minister of the ROC.
Bon voyage!

[magikthrill]

4. Greece, rightly or wrongly (wrongly in my view) has grown tired of keeping up with our act, and has chosen to play the part of a ball boy. The Greek government no longer takes an active role in the Cyprus issue. It just rehashes what we say, and in this way avoids problems with us. Perhaps the Greeks are thinking: “Let them reap what they sow.”

yes greece is a problem when it interferes and also a problem when it does nothing.


also who is this guy. aside from pantelis opinion he seems to have some facts wrong:

What is more, we are now bent on solving the Cyprus problem through lawsuits. It seems that thousands of suits by Greek Cypriots against Turkish Cypriots, and vice versa, are on the cards.

so 4 civilian lawsuits are all of a sudden "thousands". am i wrong here or do i stand corrected?

[Murtaza]

http://www.cyprus-mail.com/news/main.php?id=20036&cat_id=1

The result of the Turkish Cypriot 2004 referendum was not final until the Turkish parliament, next, and the Turkish "National Security Council" last, had “their” chance to approve Annan Plan. Did the Turkish Generals or parliament, as a body, express any support or approval to the plan, before or after the referenda?

This is wrong, after the approve of Parliment "National Security Council" can do nothing.Before the approval they can affect Parliment. (Not after)
[/quote]

How about the international community, could have they done anything?
NOTHING. They had done nothing for 30 years, why start now?
The Greek Cypriot side would have been pressured right now, as they are, to make additional concessions, to satisfy the demands of the Regime that actually rules Turkey, and Erdogan and Talat have no powers over this regime.[/quote]

This is the wrong too, They are other powers who can affect the subject, But Erdogan and Talat is most powerful parties in this subject.(Because of support from their people, even military cant be against this. Not openly.)


[/quote]"Did the Turkish Generals or parliament, as a body, express any support or approval to the plan, before or after the referenda?[/quote]

It is not our choice to approve A-Plan. Because we wont live with it, (At least not more than TC)

If we say what they have to do, than wont you accuse us by ruling TC?

I dont understand you, do you wish Turkey should say TC what they have to do? I as know , Erdogan deliberatly dont want to say anything about the A-Plan. Erdogan and Aptullah Gül said mostly, It is TC decision.

With the approval of A-Plan by GC , Turkey wont have any chance for refusing plan.

[turkcyp]

deleted by the author...

[detailer]

The result of the Turkish Cypriot 2004 referendum was not final until the Turkish parliament, next, and the Turkish "National Security Council" last, had “their” chance to approve Annan Plan. Did the Turkish Generals or parliament, as a body, express any support or approval to the plan, before or after the referenda?

How much you know about Turkey and law in general!

National Security Council is an advisory body and it has no law making or approving rights or mechanisms. The laws and treaties are only approved in the parliament, and the government with close to 2/3 majority in the parliament had already declared that they would have abide by the results of the referendum.

What did you expected? The parliament to approve a treaty which does not exist (Annan Plan would have only come to legal existence if it is approved by both sides in referendum.)

I do not know many things about Rolandis. He may have domestic political reasons to write a article right that. I have no clue. That is why I am not making any comments to his article, but choosing to correct some of the mistakes in your reply.

You seem to take the easy road and find a fake justification for rejection of Annan Plan (fake justification being "even if A. plan was accepted it would still be rejected by Turkey) instead of simply sticking with the real reason of justification (GCs did not like the plans contents not that they were scared that it would have been rejected by Turkey).

Take care,

That's it!

[Murtaza]

"But if we cannot find a solution with Talat in Cyprus and Erdogan in Ankara, then how, when, and with whom shall we ever reach a settlement? Do we think it possible that a better combination of leaders will arise on the Turkish side? Having lived through the past 30 years of developments, it is my belief that combination is not possible."

He looks like a sensible man. I dont know much about Talat.(TC know it better).But I am sure You cant even find old Erdogan. He take too much political risk and He gain nothing. I am not sure he would be same friendly to GC or EU (EU didnt perform her promises)

[pantelis]

The laws and treaties are only approved in the parliament, and the government with close to 2/3 majority in the parliament had already declared that they would have abide by the results of the referendum.

If the Turkish parliament was in agreement with plan, why was there a condition that the "plan" would be valid, only with their vote?

[detailer]

Pantelis,

With my all respect to you,

I would like to remind you a cypriot/turkish or whatever saying:

"If my grandmother had a penis, she would be my grandfather"

[Murtaza]

The laws and treaties are only approved in the parliament, and the government with close to 2/3 majority in the parliament had already declared that they would have abide by the results of the referendum.

If the Turkish parliament was in agreement with plan, why was there a condition that the "plan" would be valid, only with their vote?

Pantalis are you realy serious about this discussion?
You didnt even accept plan. And accuse us "we will refuse plan?"
Great now we even accused something "we didnt do."

do you realy think Turkey parlement have any chance to refuse plan?
If you believe this you should be accept plan. Than let to Turkey refuse plan. You would gain everything and loose nothing.

[Murtaza]

Pantelis,

With my all respect to you,

I would like to remind you a cypriot/turkish or whatever saying:

"If my grandmother had a penis, she would be my grandfather"

lol in Turkey it is "If my aunt have moustache, She would become my uncle"

But your way is better:)