Cyprus-Forum.com

[Get Real!]

If that were the case GR! (and people have chosen stranger alliances in times of war) thank you for clarifying how you would have countered the frustration of the Ottoman suppression .... by joining forces with them to fight back the marauding Greeks.

A daft assumption but abandoning their real herritage for Greek turned out to be the Cypriot pinnacle of their stupidity and demise.

So we had an Ottoman invasion in 1570 because the Cypriots were associated with Greeks, and for no other reasons?

So we failed to remove the Ottoman suppressors in 1821, because we were too-Greek like in our thinking and not Cypriot-like enough to succeed?

So Grivas, our Greek trained General ..... was part of this pinnacle of stupidity, because he led the removal of the Brits?

Your struggle to comprehend what I’ve been saying; and you’d be hard pressed to find anyone who writes as clearly as I do, is testimony that you’re not as intelligent as you think and history/politics isn’t your forte.

Fine! ... So far you have failed to discredit any historical evidence from Paphitis, then you failed to discredit logical reasoning along ethnic lines by Piratis, and now you cannot answer my simple questions!

Back to the drawing board for you methinks!

Paphitis? …he claims that Cypriots are of Minoan descend!

He posted a blurred little map hiding its caption and hoping for the best followed by a junk link infested with adware/mulware…

He hasn’t got a clue about the successors/predecessors of "Greeks” over the millenniums and most likely only skimmed through about Minoans, Mycenaeans, and Dorians in the last 48 hours, and I’ll wager he’s clueless about “Hellenism” on Cyprus between the Roman and Ottoman conquests if we were to press on...

Basically, anyone driven by ego alone is a useless debater who jumps around like a rabbit on heat.

Piratis though is both knowledgeable and experienced.

[Paphitis]

He hasn’t got a clue about the successors/predecessors of "Greeks” over the millenniums and most likely only skimmed through about Minoans, Mycenaeans, and Dorians in the last 48 hours, and I’ll wager he’s clueless about “Hellenism” on Cyprus between the Roman and Ottoman conquests if we were to press on...

Basically, anyone driven by ego alone is a useless debater who jumps around like a rabbit on heat.

GR!, I never profess to knowing everything about Cyprus, but I have read enough to be your match. In fact your ideologies are now bordering on the ridiculous.

I am more that willing to discuss all facets of Cypriot History with you anytime.

You are a fine one to be talking about my ego, because quite frankly, no one here has a bigger ego than yourself. You are an untrustworthy slime, and anyone should think twice about turning their back on you.

ATM, you urgent attention is required in Cyprus Problem.

[michalis5354]

My friend If you tell to an Australian or to an American he is British he willl throw you into the ocean straight away and this is my point here. While you are an Australian in Australia you are a Greek in Cyprus? Some people need to pay tax just for positing in the internet as the only thing they do is to downgrade the island into a puppet state and semi dependent state.

Why do they have the British flag in their own flag then?

And the main point here is that the Australians chose to have an independent country because that would serve their own interests better.

Cyprus and Greece were forced to be separate so we would be weaker and the UK/Turkey would serve their interests on our loss.

Would you make the same argument to an East or West German before the unification of Germany? Would you say to them: "It doesn't matter that some others forced you to be separate, now you have a separate state and you should therefore always be separate"?

We discussed this before Piratis. The option of Indepenedence was not put in front of the people to decide. The Options that people were forced to choose were only 2 Enosis and british rule so they were forced to accept the less evil of the 2 as proper independence was missing as an option. Dont you agree that they option of Indepenedence should had been as a legal option for people to choose in a proper refernedum and not be forced by a group (EOKA) for Enosis. And why do you thing some GCs were killed who t were opposed to ENOSIS ALONG with MANY others who were forced to remain SILENT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The vast majority of people supported Enosis with Greece. But of course there will be always the "royalists" and "loyalists" in every revolution. Until Makarios proposed independence nobody else did. So those that opposed Enosis where not those that wanted independence, but those who supported the Turkish and British interests on the island.

A referendum is something we asked for and it was denied to us. Long before we started our revolution we had been asking to have a democratic referendum so the people could decide peacefully what they want for their own island. But the British didn't allow any referendum to take place because they decided that they should be the ones taking the decisions for Cyprus, and that the Cypriot people themselves have no right to decide the destiny of their own island.

So why have we been denied the referendum Michalis?

Lets compare the number of people seeking ENOSIS pre and post 1960 . Maybe ENOSIS was high on the agenda pre 1960 but it declined after 1960 .So the people voice was different pre and post 1960. If two referendum were carried out pre and post 1960 they would had revealed two different outcomes.

It depends on how much after 1960 you are talking about. People knew very well that what was given to us in 1960 was not a complete freedom and independence, we were not even allowed to write our own constitution, and they were definitely not satisfied with this.

So if a referendum took place in 1960 or or 1962, the result would again be in favor of enosis. If the referendum took place in 1968, when Greece was ruled by military dictators, then obviously most people would vote against enosis. If a referendum is made today, when in many respects we are in better economic condition than Greece, and when we are already united with Greece thought EU, then again people will reject Enosis.

These are naive assumptions . A proper referendum under fully democratic conditions and listing all available options was denied by EOKA as the only option available was that of ENOSIS - ENOSIS or DEATH. I dispute that the majority wanted ENOSIS simply because there was no democratic referendum for people to choose . So this is just assumptions with no official declaration.

When a proper referendum was not taken place you can not overgenerilise that the majority backed the EOKA B terrorist after 1960. People realised that the option of Independence had been denied to them by EOKA.