Cyprus-Forum.com

[Tim Drayton]

Cyprus can not entire any union etc, etc, legally, without ALL of its guarantor member countries being a part of. Blah Blah Blah -

Can anybody explain the meaning of the above utterance?

[Get Real!]

Cyprus can not entire any union etc, etc, legally, without ALL of its guarantor member countries being a part of. Blah Blah Blah -

Can anybody explain the meaning of the above utterance?

It's why I keep telling her to stick to her kitchen.

[Nikitas]

By accepting Cyprus as a member the EU gave Turkey a very loud message. Obviously it has not been understood. There are limits to what Turkey will be allowed to do, and controlling other countries is will not be accepted.

The phrasing in the constitution of 1960 about joining political organizations was obviously directed at things other than the EU, as proven by the acceptance into the EU by the votes of two other guarantor states, Greece and the UK.

[Nikitas]

Tim in a post above, far above by now, cites the Goldman Sachs forecasts for the Turkish economy.

Today a piece of news surfaced which shows how easily things can be derailed. Swedish Scania is set to build a truck factory in Iraq. Considering Iraq's cheaper labor than Turkey's, even lower environmental controls, highly trained work force, its proximity to cheap energy and easier access to developing markets, it is likely that the transient manufacturing investement in Turkey could move further south.

You would be amazed at how quickly factories can be moved. Pirelli moved its Greek manufacturing plant in weeks, not months.

[Kifeas]

Get Real!

Turkey, a guarantor power of Cyprus, along with Greece and the UK have their signatures firmly indented on the 1960 Agreement(s). Cyprus can not entire any union etc, etc, legally, without ALL of its guarantor member countries being a part of. Blah Blah Blah - Come on Get Real, this is obvious O'Level Law stuff, even the Liberal Democrats know it!

MrH, did anyone ever explain to you that Cyprus (RoC,) Turkey, Greece and the UK, are all independed, sovereign and UN member nation-states, and thus they are all bound by the UN Charter's articles and provisions?

Did anyone ever explain to you that any aspects of those 1960 so-called agreements that contradict and are in conflict with the UN Charter, are invalid and non-binding due to article 103 of the UN Charter?

Did anyone ever explain to you that both the provision of the 1960 treaty of “guarantee” for “guarantor” powers’ unilateral intervention “rights,” as well as the provision that Cyprus cannot join any international organization to which Turkey is not a member, contradict with the UN Charter's article 2, and thus they are invalid and non-binding under international law?

If not, then learn it now, so that you and your Turkey know where you are standing! As far as I am concerned, but also as far as international law is concerned, you and your Turkey and its so called rights in Cyprus, are all standing on a big pile of shit! If you and your Turkey have any guts, you are already invited to go together with RoC to the ICJ of The Hague, to find this out by first hand! So far, your Turkey refuses to pick up the challenge, and guess why!

[subfire91]

Never under estimate the Turks and Turkish Cypriots you did this in 1974 and paid the price. You have to compromise just like we do and the only viable solution has been 2 parts north and south all we have to do is agree the rights each individual has in those states allowing the people the right to choose which state they wish to live in.

how is possible a 600K state underestimate a 50 million state. Even with these huge analogies you would have never enter cyprus if the greek Junta was not ordering a retreat. Your mighty 40.000 invading troops were pinned down at the beaches for three days before managing to proceed after the deliberate retreat of the greek and cypriot army (CIAs plan).

[subfire91]

Never under estimate the Turks and Turkish Cypriots you did this in 1974 and paid the price. You have to compromise just like we do and the only viable solution has been 2 parts north and south all we have to do is agree the rights each individual has in those states allowing the people the right to choose which state they wish to live in.

You take your 18% which you have a right to and build 9 meter tall walls so you can't come across the south and I personally do not have a problem

Please provide examples where the population ratios determine the land split???

BECAUSE THAT'S HOW DEMOCRACY WORKS

[Viewpoint]

"all this suffering has been for nothing."

You mean that it was all done so Turkey could join the EU. My above post refers to Turkey's real problems in joining the EU. Cyprus is not a problem, there are many other bigger obstacles in the way.

In fact believe it or not for the Cypriots on both sides of the divide, to much water has passed under the bridge to go back to how it was, which was hell on earth for us and heaven fot you guys who took control of the government recognition and all the benefits.

[Viewpoint]

Never under estimate the Turks and Turkish Cypriots you did this in 1974 and paid the price. You have to compromise just like we do and the only viable solution has been 2 parts north and south all we have to do is agree the rights each individual has in those states allowing the people the right to choose which state they wish to live in.

You take your 18% which you have a right to and build 9 meter tall walls so you can't come across the south and I personally do not have a problem

Please provide examples where the population ratios determine the land split???

BECAUSE THAT'S HOW DEMOCRACY WORKS

Dont hide under the democracy veil, provide examples.

[Nikitas]

Examples of imposed partition are India and Pakistan and the population ratios were applied there. Palestine is another case and as the original maps show the ratios were applied there too.

Other cases often cited here are insances of volutary separation, like the division in Chechoslovakia, Montenegro and Serbia, Bosnia etc, and not imposed partitions. In every case the individual rights of property etc have not been affected by the result.

Often in this forum the process of devolution within countries, like the creation of the Scottish parliament are cited as examples of partition and this is total nonsense. Local autonomy is not partition and Scotland is not about to gain a seat at the UN or have representation at the EU separate from the United Kingdom.

Those that like to highlight these cases, should think of the situation with the Kurds in Turkey and draw parallels with cases like Chechoslovakia. We are all waiting with baited breath for Kurdish autonomy to prove to us that Turkey is a truly enlightened nation.