Cyprus-Forum.com

[BirKibrisli]

I can indeed be a fool at times GR,but if your understanding of the Cyprus Problem comes down to "Denktash Ordered Turkey to Invade and they DID" you are a much bigger fool than I am...You should in fact be locked up and not allowed to insult anyone with your simplistic,hateful,disgusting attacks on your compatriots whose pain and suffering were at least as big as yours...

Your problem might indeed be that you were caught in the middle of it back in 1974,and you are suffering from PTSD (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder)...One symptom of this mental illness is that the sufferer has seriouly distorted cognitive functions...Another symptom is irrational,grandoise plans and ambitions when going though a manic state...All I want to tell you now is get yourself to a competent psychiatrist as soon as possible...You are on the verge of blowing your mind up...The bill is in the mail,by the way..

And what would I tell the psychiatrist? That I’m presenting you with evidence that you’re dismissing? Here’s some more for you to dismiss…

Turkish Cypriots greeting Turkish invaders and offering them refreshments…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjGKnvXzm30

There are more videos showing Turkish Cypriots carrying military equipment for the invader and/or climbing on Turkish tanks and other military vehicles heading south…

…but they’re all lies aren’t they because your people are the misunderstood victims and all Greek Cypriots should just visit a psychiatrist.

And what does your "evidence" tell us,GR...???
Could it be that these poor sods were so petrified of their lives under Sampson that they would welcome the devil with open arms????

Or perhaps they looked back to the events of 1963-74,how they were made to feel second class,unwanted citizens in their own country and thought they were being liberated from a life of fear and indignity?????

Unless you are prepared to look at the whole picture and see how much the TCs suffered and kept on suffering under their "liberators" you have no moral authority to pass judgement on us...I know many Greek and Armenian Cypriots who have no need of a psychiatrist..You, on the other hand, are a basket case..Get thee to a Psychiatrist at once...

While your “poor sods” were petrified and on the phone calling Turkey to come, our sods were actually fighting off the coupists and shedding their blood…

…that’s the difference between a poor sod and a stupid one.

If you really think the TCs were in any position to help fight off the coupists then your cognitive distortions are much much worse than I thought...You might indeed be beyond help,dear GR..A long mental hospital sejourn is urgently indicated...

If they were more than capable of creating self-ruled enclaves on the island and deterring any attacks against them in 1963-64, why was it so hard for them to call up the Makarios supporters and offer their assistance to protect the sovereignty of Cyprus?

No amount of crying smileys can ever excuse your people’s treasonous schemes…

And no amount of historical fact and logic will convince you to shed your hatred and prejudice towards the TCS...If you can't see that we spent 10 years in survival mode,fearing real and imaginary pursecution from the GSs led by President Makarios,and can't see that we were on high alert expecting to be attacked and killed on mass,you seriously need to get real,mate...Viewpoint is right on this matter... It would've been jumping from the frying pan into the fire for the TCs to attempt to help anyone..There was nothing we could do but hope and pray that Turkey would get there before the GCs stopped killing each other and came for us...... This was not just a suspicion at the time,it was taken as Koranic gospel...Nothing Makarios did between 1964-74 gave us confidence that he looked at us as anything other than pests frustrating his great dream of Enosis...It would've taken a Messiah to convince the TCs to go to the aid of Makarios..We didn't have a Messiah,we had Mr R.R.Denktash telling us we would be dinner for GCs unless Turkey came to rescue us...

[Piratis]

Bir, I have to agree to Get Real that you need to stop presenting the TCs as the innocent victims. They have a big share of responsibility for what happened, and they continue having their share for what continues to happen today.

First of all, the TCs didn't drop from the sky the day that the British took over the island. The TCs were those who benefited during the previous 3+ centuries on the expense of the majority of the Cypriot people, with gross discriminations against us. If you think that 63-74 (a mere decade) was bad for you and therefore everything and anything can be excused because of that, then what can we say that you treated us 100 times worst for 30 times longer period? The question here is: Can past events be used as an excuse? If your answer is yes, then you should apply the same answer always, not only when it suits the TCs.

But the responsibilities of TCs didn't stop there. While the Greek Cypriots have shown an enormous amount of forgiveness and just within a few years after the end of the Ottoman rule, GCs and TCs were living peacefully along with each other, in 1958 (just 80 years after the end of Ottoman rule) the TCs decided to attack the GCs again, and start a new conflict with the excuse that Cypriots dared to ask for their self-determination! So just like on 9th of July 1821 they slaughtered us for daring to ask for our freedom, in 1958 they were again doing the exact same thing by attacking us and helping the British to oppress our revolution.

At the same time they started to demand that Greek Cypriots should be exterminated from the north part of their homeland, so some "Turkish Republic" can be artificially created there on land stolen from us.

All the above happened before any "63-74". In fact those events were the cause of "63-74". So how can you present "63-74" as the reason why the TCs acted the way they did in 1974? The TCs showed their aggression against GCs and their desire to exterminate us from the north part of Cyprus and achieve partition since the 50s. And even before that we had again experienced centuries of oppression and aggression by them which were totally unprovoked.

So please stop trying to excuse the TCs and justify their actions. Just like in the 3+ centuries of Ottoman rule they were happy to benefit on the loss of the vast majority of the Cypriot people, in the years after they were again happy to help foreign rulers so they would again have gains on the loss of the vast majority of the Cypriot people.

So, since the very beginning, the TCs help foreigners impose their rule over Cyprus (or part of it since 1974), and as a reward those foreigners grand to this TC minority unfair and disproportional share of power/land/rights on the expense of the majority of Cypriots.

And while the vast majority of the Cypriot people have been slaughtered by the 1000s and were being discriminated against in the worst kind of ways, the worst time for TCs was 1963 when it was asked from them to drop some of the unfair gains that the foreigners had granted to them on the expense of the Cypriot people! Apparently the TCs were so used in being the privilaged people with more rights than anybody else, that asking from them to be just equal with others was something so unacceptable for them that they didn't even discuss it and they started yet another conflict instead!

So the reasons that TCs collaborate with Ottomans/Turks/British is not because of fear but because of self - interests hoping that those foreigners will grand to them unfair gains of land/power/rights on the expense of the rest of Cypriots people, as a reward for helping those foreigners serve their own interests in Cyprus. The only fear that the TCs can have is that they will lose the unfair gains that those foreigners have granted to them.

[bigOz]

Bir, I have to agree to Get Real that you need to stop presenting the TCs as the innocent victims. They have a big share of responsibility for what happened, and they continue having their share for what continues to happen today.

First of all, the TCs didn't drop from the sky the day that the British took over the island. The TCs were those who benefited during the previous 3+ centuries on the expense of the majority of the Cypriot people, with gross discriminations against us. If you think that 63-74 (a mere decade) was bad for you and therefore everything and anything can be excused because of that, then what can we say that you treated us 100 times worst for 30 times longer period? The question here is: Can past events be used as an excuse? If your answer is yes, then you should apply the same answer always, not only when it suits the TCs.

But the responsibilities of TCs didn't stop there. While the Greek Cypriots have shown an enormous amount of forgiveness and just within a few years after the end of the Ottoman rule, GCs and TCs were living peacefully along with each other, in 1958 (just 80 years after the end of Ottoman rule) the TCs decided to attack the GCs again, and start a new conflict with the excuse that Cypriots dared to ask for their self-determination! So just like on 9th of July 1821 they slaughtered us for daring to ask for our freedom, in 1958 they were again doing the exact same thing by attacking us and helping the British to oppress our revolution.

At the same time they started to demand that Greek Cypriots should be exterminated from the north part of their homeland, so some "Turkish Republic" can be artificially created there on land stolen from us.

All the above happened before any "63-74". In fact those events were the cause of "63-74". So how can you present "63-74" as the reason why the TCs acted the way they did in 1974? The TCs showed their aggression against GCs and their desire to exterminate us from the north part of Cyprus and achieve partition since the 50s. And even before that we had again experienced centuries of oppression and aggression by them which were totally unprovoked.

So please stop trying to excuse the TCs and justify their actions. Just like in the 3+ centuries of Ottoman rule they were happy to benefit on the loss of the vast majority of the Cypriot people, in the years after they were again happy to help foreign rulers so they would again have gains on the loss of the vast majority of the Cypriot people.

So, since the very beginning, the TCs help foreigners impose their rule over Cyprus (or part of it since 1974), and as a reward those foreigners grand to this TC minority unfair and disproportional share of power/land/rights on the expense of the majority of Cypriots.

And while the vast majority of the Cypriot people have been slaughtered by the 1000s and were being discriminated against in the worst kind of ways, the worst time for TCs was 1963 when it was asked from them to drop some of the unfair gains that the foreigners had granted to them on the expense of the Cypriot people! Apparently the TCs were so used in being the privileged people with more rights than anybody else, that asking from them to be just equal with others was something so unacceptable for them that they didn't even discuss it and they started yet another conflict instead!

So the reasons that TCs collaborate with Ottomans/Turks/British is not because of fear but because of self - interests hoping that those foreigners will grand to them unfair gains of land/power/rights on the expense of the rest of Cypriots people, as a reward for helping those foreigners serve their own interests in Cyprus. The only fear that the TCs can have is that they will lose the unfair gains that those foreigners have granted to them.

Piratis your ignorance make me want to cry and laugh at the same time - HAVE YOU BEEN LIVING ON A DIFFERENT PLANET TO EVERYONE ALL YOUR LIFE???

You are a classic example of bad schooling and history in the south. Yeah! sure, the Greeks were so forgiving they murdered and buried TCs in mass graves UNPROVOKED - unless you claim 6 month old babies and 80 year old women were provoking TCs outside their village! Why don't you cross over and I shall personally take you to these villages. There are just as many villages that are now in the South. HOW MANY GREEK VILLAGES DID TCs DESTROY AND BURY THEIR INHABITANTS - answer that if you can before you shove your fanatic propaganda!

If you want to really know about it, I suggest you read and find out about the plight of TCs after the British annexed the island in late 1800s. Yes, in line with their divide and rule policy and also with using their colonial subject to fight their wars British did employ TCs as auxiliary police, and did use them against the EOKA at the time - but whose fault was that?

If you are ignorant about the historical facts, I shall supply you with enough history that will make your eyes fall out of your head. A year ago I did tell many that the best way forward is to leave history to one side unless you learn both sides' stories. History should be used so as not to make the same mistakes and to find a way forward for peaceful existence. NOT to preach hatred or more possible losses to the country's inhabitants.

As for foreigners granting "privilaged rights" to TCs, I guess the Cyprus Republic was created as a direct result of the heroic actions of Greek mainland during 1960, and it meant a Greek Cyprus that was an extension of Greece! Wake up my man and read more history OUTSIDE YOUR BOX!
Even your greatest leader Makarios had realised the facts, and accepted during the beginning of the 74 troubles when he stated publicly "...threat from Turkey is the lesser evil than the threat from Greece"

[Murataga]

Bir, I have to agree to Get Real that you need to stop presenting the TCs as the innocent victims. They have a big share of responsibility for what happened, and they continue having their share for what continues to happen today.

First of all, the TCs didn't drop from the sky the day that the British took over the island. The TCs were those who benefited during the previous 3+ centuries on the expense of the majority of the Cypriot people, with gross discriminations against us. If you think that 63-74 (a mere decade) was bad for you and therefore everything and anything can be excused because of that, then what can we say that you treated us 100 times worst for 30 times longer period? The question here is: Can past events be used as an excuse? If your answer is yes, then you should apply the same answer always, not only when it suits the TCs.

But the responsibilities of TCs didn't stop there. While the Greek Cypriots have shown an enormous amount of forgiveness and just within a few years after the end of the Ottoman rule, GCs and TCs were living peacefully along with each other, in 1958 (just 80 years after the end of Ottoman rule) the TCs decided to attack the GCs again, and start a new conflict with the excuse that Cypriots dared to ask for their self-determination! So just like on 9th of July 1821 they slaughtered us for daring to ask for our freedom, in 1958 they were again doing the exact same thing by attacking us and helping the British to oppress our revolution.

At the same time they started to demand that Greek Cypriots should be exterminated from the north part of their homeland, so some "Turkish Republic" can be artificially created there on land stolen from us.

All the above happened before any "63-74". In fact those events were the cause of "63-74". So how can you present "63-74" as the reason why the TCs acted the way they did in 1974? The TCs showed their aggression against GCs and their desire to exterminate us from the north part of Cyprus and achieve partition since the 50s. And even before that we had again experienced centuries of oppression and aggression by them which were totally unprovoked.

So please stop trying to excuse the TCs and justify their actions. Just like in the 3+ centuries of Ottoman rule they were happy to benefit on the loss of the vast majority of the Cypriot people, in the years after they were again happy to help foreign rulers so they would again have gains on the loss of the vast majority of the Cypriot people.

So, since the very beginning, the TCs help foreigners impose their rule over Cyprus (or part of it since 1974), and as a reward those foreigners grand to this TC minority unfair and disproportional share of power/land/rights on the expense of the majority of Cypriots.

And while the vast majority of the Cypriot people have been slaughtered by the 1000s and were being discriminated against in the worst kind of ways, the worst time for TCs was 1963 when it was asked from them to drop some of the unfair gains that the foreigners had granted to them on the expense of the Cypriot people! Apparently the TCs were so used in being the privilaged people with more rights than anybody else, that asking from them to be just equal with others was something so unacceptable for them that they didn't even discuss it and they started yet another conflict instead!

So the reasons that TCs collaborate with Ottomans/Turks/British is not because of fear but because of self - interests hoping that those foreigners will grand to them unfair gains of land/power/rights on the expense of the rest of Cypriots people, as a reward for helping those foreigners serve their own interests in Cyprus. The only fear that the TCs can have is that they will lose the unfair gains that those foreigners have granted to them.

You illiterate bum... (1) The TCs had no influence on the rule of the state, it was a dynasty, i.e. they decided on nothing just as the rest of the people living within the empire; (2) at the time of the Ottoman arrival to the island, GCs were not allowed to own land - all land you owned were given to you by the Ottomans; (3) Ottomans gave you religious and communal autonomy, unprecedented during the era; (4) the Ottomans charged you with higher taxes, true, but the muslims were banned from practicing trade (due to religous law) and obligated to serve in the military upon the calling of the emperor (which was quite frequent and longlasting during those 3+ centuries) - GCs were allowed trade and did not serve in the army.

Memorize this fact: TCs along with the rest of the Turks within the empire got FUCKED forward and backward by the Ottoman dynasty during those 3+ centuries; you got rights and privileges you did not have and you got rich.

[EPSILON]

Very brave man Mr Levent.

Persons can be critisized only by history. Lets see what history will prove after 50 years about this Gentleman!!!!

[denizaksulu]

The TCs did not have to move to be under Turkish occupation, but the promise of free property, and perhaps the fear instilled in them by the over-zealous slaughter of GCs by Turkey, gave them the carrot and the stick that does the trick for donkeys.

I cannot believe that you are totally ignorant of the sad history of Cyprus..
So i think you are simply hate-mongering for some reason you only know...By doing this you are betraying Cyprus and you are betraying your fellow Cypriots....I'd like to think you are not doing it on purpose,to make sure GCs and TCs will never want to live together...But I have been wrong in the past...And I might be wrong again...

As we say, 'Goodmorning yegen'.

[Tim Drayton]

Very brave man Mr Levent.

Persons can be critisized only by history. Lets see what history will prove after 50 years about this Gentleman!!!!

He has been behind prison bars for his views. Doesn't that tell you anything?

[DT.]

Very brave man Mr Levent.

Persons can be critisized only by history. Lets see what history will prove after 50 years about this Gentleman!!!!

He has been behind prison bars for his views. Doesn't that tell you anything?

It tells me there's no democracy in the occupied areas.

[denizaksulu]

Very brave man Mr Levent.

Persons can be critisized only by history. Lets see what history will prove after 50 years about this Gentleman!!!!

He has been behind prison bars for his views. Doesn't that tell you anything?

It tells me there's no democracy in the occupied areas.

................and?

[DT.]

Very brave man Mr Levent.

Persons can be critisized only by history. Lets see what history will prove after 50 years about this Gentleman!!!!

He has been behind prison bars for his views. Doesn't that tell you anything?

It tells me there's no democracy in the occupied areas.

................and?

Levent speaks out against the regime?