Cyprus-Forum.com

[Paphitis]

Here you are talking rubbish again. For a start the church, (the mosque, whatever), has no business in the schools. Secondly, the government has never said that the schools will not be teaching about EOKA, if this is what you mean. What the Ministry is doing is to change certain things so that the next generations of Cypriots are not turned into blind bigots, like you and perhaps your parents!

Whilst I am not religious by any stretch of the imagination, and am what you may consider a very open minded and sceptical person, I do respect the church for instilling a good moral mindset within the community. Therefore it is beneficial for the church or the mosque to play a limited role in school and not to the detriment of proven scientific facts such as evolution. Proper sex education is also important as many parents are incapable of speaking to their children on this most important aspect of life. I favour a very open and complete educational system, where nothing is held back or suppressed.

All aspects of Cypriot history need to also be taught. This includes EOKA and all events thereafter, including the turbulent 60s, the coup and the barbaric Turkish Invasion. You cannot change history. And teaching this history has nothing to do with being a bigot.

I know you far too well Bananiot, as I have analysed your posts thoroughly, and you bring a very cold shiver down my spine. You do not want the church involved as you know that this will weaken our very fibre and result in us to more quickly submit to Turkish servitude and slavery, as this is clearly "what we deserve". According to you we should only have what others more powerful are willing to give us and we do not have a blanket right for proper democracy and freedom.

You have made a sweeping statement about our text books turning children into blind bigots and racists. Please post an example of such a text book by providing a link.

[psycho]

I take it you condone such practices of restricting Freedom of Speech and perpetuating ignorance ....

No... but if I wanted to find out about such things I would visit web sites dedicated to the subject...

Well I do not happen to believe something as fundamental as freedom of speech has to be restricted to a "dedicated" website (although I agree it deserves dedicated attention), and be excluded from everyday discussion because it tires someone's brain out to talk about more than Chlorine sources for one's swimming pool!

.... But to make this topic more Cyprusgrump friendly; where would we be if not for Science, but swimming in germ ridden pools

Happy now, Grump dear

It is a tiresome shame that your concerns about freedom of speech and other such issues is restricted to Turkey...

Well now you have flipped into over-generalized whinges .... My concerns are many, but on this forum the Turkey/Cyprus/Greece/UK/US are the main countries of interest (for reasons I know I do not have to spell out to you).

Now if at the present time (and these are highly topical and of the moment) there is more media attention because Turkey is systematically banning left right and centre (cue for CopperLine to blow a fuse!), then there is ample rich fodder for easy pickings.

However, I would not moan if someone wrote about Tibet or The Democratic Republic of the Congo, for us to discuss ... so why don't you go ahead and enrich us .....

Would you moan about Scotsmen wearing skirts/kilts??

No I love hunky men in Kilts and the whole Tartan and Clan culture. I also like the Greek Evzones and the Cypriot Vraka ... But so what?

Why don't you start a thread?

You married to a Jock then??

[Oracle]

Evolution is not that difficult to understand and it is a ridiculous notion to suggest that it is not taught in Greek Cypriot schools because it is difficult. We teach photosynthesis and tissue respiration to the level of Campbell and beyond in the 3rd form in Lyceums and there are no problems with students. However, RI is taught in all forms from kindergarden onwards and quite rightly many children look in dibelief when a teacher ever dares to tell them that perhaps God is not responsible for everything that is taking place.

The Greek Orthodox church plays a huge part in the Greek Cypriot school system. It is involved in everything that happens in schools and the latest ourburst of the Archbishop pays testament to this.

As my great mentor Dawkins often duly notes, it is those who sweepingly declare Evolution as "not that difficult", who have failed to grasp its depth.

I did not however say it is not taught in Cypriot schools because it is so difficult, but that even in UK schools it is not really dealt with until "A" level. Unless you think mentioning dinosaurs sums up Evolution!

However the foundations for Evolution need to be taught as early as possible, and this is where many creationists fail our children. Because they do not allow the scientific rigour to be developed.

Again though Bananiot, you are missing the point. Nowhere in the GC syllabus is there any hint of an anti-scientific approach.

Even if the Church played a hand in moral teaching or whatever they are good for ... no way can you tar the Orthodox Church with that same brush as swept in religious-led countries.

At the moment there is great furore as UK University lecturers are uninspired to teach many of these foreign students subjects such as Medicine, because they refuse to attend lectures dealing with Evolution.

[Bananiot]

What about the shivers you send down my spine Paphidis? I know you and your likes very well because your kind of thinking has brought nothing but disaster to the Greek nation which you profess you adore, just because you happened to be born a Greek Cypriot. In 1897, your likes brought on a Turko - Greek war and the Turkish army soon reached Athens, only to be prevented from going in by Czar Nicholas the second of Russia.

You came to this forum asking to "find out" about the glorious struggle of 1955-1959, but of course this was just your excuse. You knew all the answers right from the beginning. You have learned nothing and you did not even bother to read what we wrote for you. On top, you want to tell the whole world that we, the Greek side, has justice on our side 100% and all others are the bad guys. Well, I have no respect for such childish behaviour.

[Paphitis]

What about the shivers you send down my spine Paphidis? I know you and your likes very well because your kind of thinking has brought nothing but disaster to the Greek nation which you profess you adore, just because you happened to be born a Greek Cypriot. In 1897, your likes brought on a Turko - Greek war and the Turkish army soon reached Athens, only to be prevented from going in by Czar Nicholas the second of Russia.

You came to this forum asking to "find out" about the glorious struggle of 1955-1959, but of course this was just your excuse. You knew all the answers right from the beginning. You have learned nothing and you did not even bother to read what we wrote for you. On top, you want to tell the whole world that we, the Greek side, has justice on our side 100% and all others are the bad guys. Well, I have no respect for such childish behaviour.

My kind of thinking is the kind that finds any half baked unfair solution unacceptable. I prefer more traditional forms of democracy just like you find in any other EU country, where all citizens are EQUAL. Your kind of thinking thinks that the Cypriot people do not deserve this and should only accept the SCRAPS thrown down to them, just like a mutt waiting eagerly at your dinner table. That’s the difference between you and I.

I did not join this forum to learn about the EOKA struggle. I have an excellent knowledge of this era, and of Cypriot history. Admittedly, I am still searching for many answers in regards to the Cyprus Problem. But the main reason I am here is because I enjoy putting myself in Cypriot shoes and learning as much as I can about Cyprus, her people and culture. I am almost as foreign as any Brit here, educated in Australia, and probably will not fit in your society, but I am here, and consider myself a Cypriot as much or even more than I consider myself Australian.

I also accept that responsibility lies on both sides, however, it is Turkey who has maintained her 34 year occupation of Cyprus, and has snubbed her nose against countless UN resolutions. It is Turkey once again who has contravened the Treaty of Guarantee by not returning the island back to the 1960 Zurich Agreement state of play and respecting the Territorial integrity and sovereignty of Cyprus. So the country that is solely to blame for this present day impasse is Turkey.

[SSBubbles]

What a lot of Freud's we have!

[Oracle]

What a lot of Freud's we have!

How long have you been suffering from these visions, Bubbles?

[SSBubbles]

What a lot of Freud's we have!

How long have you been suffering from these visions, Bubbles?

cheeky!

[Bananiot]

Andreas Polydorou was until recently an Inspector at the Ministry of Education and Culture. Furthermore, he wrote the history book that is still taught at our primary schools. A few days ago he was asked what he thought about the so called changing of the history books. This is what he said:

“If I were to take critical look at the work I did, I would recognise that the Greek element in my book, the Greeks if you prefer, monopolise history. The life and history of the Turkish Cypriot community and the other ethnic communities that live in Cyprus are basically ignored and I do consider this a major flaw of my book. In the book I presented some atrocities committed by Turkish Cypriots against Greek Cypriots but there is no mention in my book of the atrocities committed by the Greek Cypriots against Turkish Cypriots. My book is biased and lacks in objectivity. It was written at a time when we endeavoured to raise the national consciousness. We need to expose all the aspects of the lives of people, the good and the bad, the achievements and the mistakes. More so we need to expose the mistakes because this is the way to make sure that they are not repeated”.

Paphidis, in case you think that I wrote the above for you then let me tell you straight away that I wrote it for everybody else except you. As I said before you have already made up your mind and I would be the last person to try to make you see reality.

[Nikitas]

"In 1897, your likes brought on a Turko - Greek war and the Turkish army soon reached Athens, only to be prevented from going in by Czar Nicholas the second of Russia. "

Not so Bananiot. It reached Larisa. Several hundred kilometers north of Athens. And in 1912 the whole area north of Larisa, that is Epirus and Macedonia was liberated by the Greek army.

Does that make the `1912 attempt right because it succeded and the 1897 campaign wrong because it failed? The goals were the same as I read.