Cyprus-Forum.com

[denizaksulu]

Now here's someone who is realistic fair and just. Why isn't he the leader that can bring GC's and TC's together representing the interests of the TC's?

Security of Greek and Turkish Cypriots not a Guarantee Treaty Issue
The security of the Turkish and Greek Cypriot communities is not a directly relevant in the Guarantees Treaty, says Erel
8 Ekim 2008, Çar?amba 18:37 Yorum Yaz Yazd?r Arkada??na Gönder

In a written announcement, Chairman of the Cyprus EU Association Mr Ali Erel spilled the beans on recent calls in the north of Cyprus by some politicians to maintain Turkey’s Guaranteeship. Referring to the Guarantees and Alliance Treaties of the Constitution of the Republic of Cyprus of 1960, Erel noted that the security of the Turkish and Greek Cypriot communities is not a direct issue in the content of the Guarantees Treaty. Erel noted: “The Treaty and the Guarantors could not safeguard the security of the Turkish Cypriot community who were compelled to live under very poor conditions between 1963 and 1974. In 1974 Turkey militarily intervened under the provision to “take action with the sole aim of re-establishing the state of affairs created by the Treaty”. It is hard to say that the security of hundreds for thousands of Greek Cypriots living in the northern part of Cyprus and tens of thousands of Turkish Cypriots living in the southern part were simultaneously secured and the state of affairs was re-established by the Turkish intervention.” Erel also raised further questions about Turkey’s intervention: “The new state of affairs created by this operation has been declared unacceptable and illegal by the UN Security Council resolutions and the European Court of Human Rights judgements. In 2008, it is still hard to say that the simultaneous and parallel security needs of both communities are safeguarded.”

The Association asked that the arrangement of the security issue that will be found in the solution must be different from the current one at the Guarantees Treaty. The Association also asked that the need for a new arrangement must be accepted to meet the needs of the two communities. Erel wrote: “If an acceptable solution by both communities is to be found, the new security arrangement should be different. “An arrangement where the right to “re-establishing the state of affairs” could not be abused and its only success is not to safeguard the security and strategic interests of the Guarantors, is a must and cannot be overlooked for the sake of the communities living in Cyprus,” he said. Erel continued that a new arrangement must meet the simultaneous and parallel security of both communities and the red lines in the negotiations taking place in aim of finding a solution to the Cyprus problem should be to the satisfaction of the interests and security needs of both communities.”

http://www.toplumpostasi.net/index.php/ ... in_ENGLISH

Another brave man. I hope his voice is heard and heeded by more realists.

[observer]

"a fundamental revision of the governmental system of the Republic of Cyprus is necessary to provide the conditions in which the Greek Cypriot and Turkish Cypriot communities will be able to coexist "

The use of the word Republic shows that there was an implicit desire to retain the Republic of Cyprus and simply make changes to the system of government, which was already figured out in the 1973 negotiations between Denktash and Clerides. Something which changed 48 hours later. Someone was being tricky or did Dentktash express something not approved by Turkey?

OK, here's what Denktaş said in his press statement:

1. Mr Glafkos Klerides and Mr Rauf Denktaş, having met within the framework of the Geneva Declaration of 30th July from 10-12 August, agreed that a fundamental revision of the Constitutional structure of the Republic of Cyprus is necessary to ensure that the tragic events of the past should not repeat themselves, and in order to provide the minimum conditions in which the Greek and Turkish communities can permanently coexist together in the Republic in full confidence so that the security of each is safeguarded.
2. Bearing in mind the existence in practice in the Republic of Cyprus of two autonomous administrations, they agreed that this revision should result in the establishment of a federal system of government based on the following fundamental elements:
a. The Republic of Cyprus shall be an independent bi-national state.
b. The Republic shall consist of two federated states with full control and autonomy within their respective boundaries.
c. In determining the competence to be left to the federal government, the bi-national nature of the State shall be taken into account and the federal competence shall be exercised accordingly.
d. The area of the Turkish Cypriot Federated State shall cover 34% of the territory of the Republic falling north of a general line starting from the Limnitis-Lefka area in the west and running towards the east, passing through the Turkish controlled part of Nicosia, including the Turkish part of Famagusta and ending at the port of Famagusta.
3. Pending an agreement on the final Constitutional structure of the Republic, the two autonomous administrations shall take over the full administrative authority within their respective areas as defined above and shall take steps to normalize and stabilize life in the Republic and refrain from acts of violence, harassment and discrimination against each other.
4. Mr Klerides and Mr Denktaş further agreed:
a. At once to hold discussions between them in Nicosia, without the participation of the representatives of Greece and Turkey in order to elaborate as a matter of urgency the constitutional structures envisaged above, and,
b. To report to the Foreign Ministers of Greece, Turkey and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, at a further meeting to be held on 1st September 1974, on the conclusions reached.

I don't think anything has fundementaly changed over the years. It's just that no one has been able to agree on the exact details.

[Oracle]

"a fundamental revision of the governmental system of the Republic of Cyprus is necessary to provide the conditions in which the Greek Cypriot and Turkish Cypriot communities will be able to coexist "

The use of the word Republic shows that there was an implicit desire to retain the Republic of Cyprus and simply make changes to the system of government, which was already figured out in the 1973 negotiations between Denktash and Clerides. Something which changed 48 hours later. Someone was being tricky or did Dentktash express something not approved by Turkey?

OK, here's what Denktaş said in his press statement:

1. Mr Glafkos Klerides and Mr Rauf Denktaş, having met within the framework of the Geneva Declaration of 30th July from 10-12 August, agreed that a fundamental revision of the Constitutional structure of the Republic of Cyprus is necessary to ensure that the tragic events of the past should not repeat themselves, and in order to provide the minimum conditions in which the Greek and Turkish communities can permanently coexist together in the Republic in full confidence so that the security of each is safeguarded.
2. Bearing in mind the existence in practice in the Republic of Cyprus of two autonomous administrations, they agreed that this revision should result in the establishment of a federal system of government based on the following fundamental elements:
a. The Republic of Cyprus shall be an independent bi-national state.
b. The Republic shall consist of two federated states with full control and autonomy within their respective boundaries.
c. In determining the competence to be left to the federal government, the bi-national nature of the State shall be taken into account and the federal competence shall be exercised accordingly.
d. The area of the Turkish Cypriot Federated State shall cover 34% of the territory of the Republic falling north of a general line starting from the Limnitis-Lefka area in the west and running towards the east, passing through the Turkish controlled part of Nicosia, including the Turkish part of Famagusta and ending at the port of Famagusta.
3. Pending an agreement on the final Constitutional structure of the Republic, the two autonomous administrations shall take over the full administrative authority within their respective areas as defined above and shall take steps to normalize and stabilize life in the Republic and refrain from acts of violence, harassment and discrimination against each other.
4. Mr Klerides and Mr Denktaş further agreed:
a. At once to hold discussions between them in Nicosia, without the participation of the representatives of Greece and Turkey in order to elaborate as a matter of urgency the constitutional structures envisaged above, and,
b. To report to the Foreign Ministers of Greece, Turkey and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, at a further meeting to be held on 1st September 1974, on the conclusions reached.

I don't think anything has fundementaly changed over the years. It's just that no one has been able to agree on the exact details.

Observer ... would you kindly provide a link to the above (and Klerides's statement over the page) or a reference to the actual source.

Thank you.

[halil]

"a fundamental revision of the governmental system of the Republic of Cyprus is necessary to provide the conditions in which the Greek Cypriot and Turkish Cypriot communities will be able to coexist "

The use of the word Republic shows that there was an implicit desire to retain the Republic of Cyprus and simply make changes to the system of government, which was already figured out in the 1973 negotiations between Denktash and Clerides. Something which changed 48 hours later. Someone was being tricky or did Dentktash express something not approved by Turkey?

OK, here's what Denktaş said in his press statement:

1. Mr Glafkos Klerides and Mr Rauf Denktaş, having met within the framework of the Geneva Declaration of 30th July from 10-12 August, agreed that a fundamental revision of the Constitutional structure of the Republic of Cyprus is necessary to ensure that the tragic events of the past should not repeat themselves, and in order to provide the minimum conditions in which the Greek and Turkish communities can permanently coexist together in the Republic in full confidence so that the security of each is safeguarded.
2. Bearing in mind the existence in practice in the Republic of Cyprus of two autonomous administrations, they agreed that this revision should result in the establishment of a federal system of government based on the following fundamental elements:
a. The Republic of Cyprus shall be an independent bi-national state.
b. The Republic shall consist of two federated states with full control and autonomy within their respective boundaries.
c. In determining the competence to be left to the federal government, the bi-national nature of the State shall be taken into account and the federal competence shall be exercised accordingly.
d. The area of the Turkish Cypriot Federated State shall cover 34% of the territory of the Republic falling north of a general line starting from the Limnitis-Lefka area in the west and running towards the east, passing through the Turkish controlled part of Nicosia, including the Turkish part of Famagusta and ending at the port of Famagusta.
3. Pending an agreement on the final Constitutional structure of the Republic, the two autonomous administrations shall take over the full administrative authority within their respective areas as defined above and shall take steps to normalize and stabilize life in the Republic and refrain from acts of violence, harassment and discrimination against each other.
4. Mr Klerides and Mr Denktaş further agreed:
a. At once to hold discussions between them in Nicosia, without the participation of the representatives of Greece and Turkey in order to elaborate as a matter of urgency the constitutional structures envisaged above, and,
b. To report to the Foreign Ministers of Greece, Turkey and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, at a further meeting to be held on 1st September 1974, on the conclusions reached.

I don't think anything has fundementaly changed over the years. It's just that no one has been able to agree on the exact details.

Observer ... would you kindly provide a link to the above (and Klerides's statement over the page) or a reference to the actual source.

Thank you.

have a look below link
http://www.kktcb.eu/upload/pdf/61421.pdf

[halil]

The story of Cyprus' - 'virgin birth'
Under the above title Turkish Daily News (12.03.08) publishes the following commentary by Yusuf Kanli:
While the so-called Annan Plan the last U.N.-sponsored peace plan rejected by Greek Cypriots and accepted by Turkish Cypriots in simultaneous referenda on April 24 and which was named after the then U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan was still being drafted and senior U.N., U.S. as well as British diplomats were busy trying to feel the pulse of the two sides on the island, as well as Greece and Turkey, and trying to make sure that the peace plan would not be rejected by either of the sides, it had become clear that the deepest rift between the two sides on the island was regarding how the new state to be established should be defined.

According to the Greek Cypriot side, there was already a Cyprus Republic on the island and under international law the new state to be established must be its successor. That is, Greek Cypriots were stressing that the new state should just be a rehashed new version of the republic that the two peoples, Britain, Turkey and Greece established on the island with the 1959-1960 treaties.

The Turkish Cypriot side, on the other hand, was stressing that although the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus as well as the preceding Turkish Cypriot autonomous administration and the federated state was unrecognized since it was declared, the Turkish Cypriot Parliament adopted many resolutions, government has taken many decisions, courts have passed many verdicts, there have been marriages and divorces. Thus, if the new state was not considered a successor of the Turkish Cypriot state and before the creation of the new state even for one second the Turkish Cypriot state was recognized, there would be a serious legal vacuum.

Subtitle: Clerides steps in

Though Turkish Cypriots and U.N. officials might not even think about such a development in their wildest dreams, the solution to that key issue came all of a sudden from former Greek Cypriot leader Glafcos Clerides who on May 13, 2002 presented a non-paper titled, This non-paper does not represent a proposal of the G/C (Greek Cypriot) side but to overcome the debate on visions and begin at last negotiations on core issues.

It was in that non-paper that Clerides suggested for the first time the abrogation of the Cyprus Republic as well as the 1960 Constitution that he described as falling short of reflecting the new arrangements on the island and that the new state would be a virgin birth or parthenogenesis, that is, it will not be a successor of either of the existing two states on the island.

Now, Greek Cypriot opponents of a virgin birth or creation of a new common state on the island through parthenogenesis are complaining that the Turkish Cypriot side was making unacceptable demands and that the new state must definitely be a continuation of the Republic of Cyprus. They charge that accepting virgin birth would mean providing legality to the 1974 Turkish intervention and the results it produced on the island.

What is worse is the fact that those Greek Cypriots objecting to virgin birth include those people who had supported the Annan Plan process or were somehow involved in the preparation of the Annan Plan and who indeed are very much aware of the May 13, 2002 proposal of Clerides which besides virgin birth included elaborated ideas regarding description of political equality, powers and functions of the component states, security arrangements and measures to boost the economic level of the Turkish Cypriot people.

What Clerides offered, and which was accepted by both Turkish Cypriots who were involved in the Annan Plan negotiations, as well as the U.N., U.S. and British contributors was a revolutionary way out, providing a new description to the succession problem, and indeed stressing that the new common state would acquire its sovereignty from its own existence, while the two founding entities would be considered successor of the two-state pre-settlement reality. Thus, there will no longer be a succession problem.

The Greek Cypriot side is now having some allergy in accepting the Annan Plan as a reference document for fresh talks. However, they have to bear in mind that the Annan Plan is nothing less than an accumulation of decades of negotiations and whatever name one may attribute to it has to constitute the backbone of any new talks.

http://www.hri.org/cgi-bin/brief?/news/ ... .tcpr.html

[Tim Drayton]

By the way, what is a "Guarantee Treat"? Is this an example of a Freudian slip?

[repulsewarrior]

...so if "Greek Cypriots" found a governance equal to that which exists for "Turkish Cypriots" in the north, it will be possible for the two Assemblies to receive the recognition they need from a State which is sovereign.

...please read my manifesto.