Cyprus-Forum.com

[miltiades]

no one forced Zan and his family out of cyprus they chose to leave
utu has made a very claer and corrext point.

My father could not feed six children you piece of shit, because of the siege that Makarios had on us....You keep talking crap mate and you can kiss goodbye to 37% of Cyprus...WE WILL NOT LISTEN TO ANY MORE OF YOUR PROPAGANDA SHIT.......A deliberate attempt to make Cypriots leave their homes and country was exercised by Greeks......We are back to claim our country and our rights...You will not win on this issue...Be sure of that!!!!

You blithering idiot , how the HTF can you claim back YOUR country , you have told us on more than one occasion that your country is Turkey , what on earth are you on about stupid !!

You are the blithering idiot...First time I have used tthat one...Nice

I have done nothing of the sort..I said Turkey is our mother country just like Greece is yours..No matter how you try to put a spin on that is the way it is.....


How am I going to claim my island of Cyprus...I am doing it here and now and there is nothing you can do about it.....Who the hell do you think you are telling me what I can and can't do...Grivas??????

No Im not Grivas , but I'm the one whose brains are in the place where nature destined them to be , unlike you who stores them in your arse !
You detest me , its obvious , because Im the one that can see right through you , Im the one that knows a lot more T/Cs than you ever will , Im the one that exposes you as the fanatic piece of crap that you are mate since you believe that the 180 or so thousands who left their ancestral homes so that the settlers would move in , the property speculators would rip the benefits , the Grey Wolves would enjoy the financial rewards , and you have the audacity to come on the forum and claim that these 180 thousand Cypriots STOLE YOUR ISLAND while at the same time telling us that your motherland is TURKEY.
You have got it wrong mate , very very few G/Cs consider any other nation as their motherland other than CYPRUS.
Stupid you most certainly are , there is no doubt that your mental faculties are heavily infested with propaganda shit , but when you , a bloody foreigner , claims that your "island was stolen from you " then you have reached new heights of stupidity.
This island Plonker is called Cyprus , it belongs to the G/Cs , the T/Cs , the Armenian Cypriots and all other Cypriots , it fucking well does not belong to the Anatolian peasants or the Pontious car thieves.

[miltiades]

no one forced Zan and his family out of cyprus they chose to leave
utu has made a very claer and corrext point.

My father could not feed six children you piece of shit, because of the siege that Makarios had on us....You keep talking crap mate and you can kiss goodbye to 37% of Cyprus...WE WILL NOT LISTEN TO ANY MORE OF YOUR PROPAGANDA SHIT.......A deliberate attempt to make Cypriots leave their homes and country was exercised by Greeks......We are back to claim our country and our rights...You will not win on this issue...Be sure of that!!!!

You blithering idiot , how the HTF can you claim back YOUR country , you have told us on more than one occasion that your country is Turkey , what on earth are you on about stupid !!

You are the blithering idiot...First time I have used tthat one...Nice

I have done nothing of the sort..I said Turkey is our mother country just like Greece is yours..No matter how you try to put a spin on that is the way it is.....


How am I going to claim my island of Cyprus...I am doing it here and now and there is nothing you can do about it.....Who the hell do you think you are telling me what I can and can't do...Grivas??????

[Murataga]

Those settlers do need to be repatriated back to Turkey in a final settlement - at least those with no Cypriot family ties. The Ankara government brought them over illegally, so they have the moral resonsibility to repatriate and compensate them.

Do you think that the "RoC" should then give all voting rights back to the displaced TCs all over the world utu.......From the 1963 period on???? And should we also review all settlers from their side as well from the same period on.....

Zan,

The Turkish settlers were brought in purely as a political tactic. It was also an illegal move, as defined by the United Nations. Those settlers without Cypriot roots (such as family) really have no legal right to be there. Compensated repatriation needs to be done. As for the Turkish Cypriot diaspora, they should be encouraged to Cyprus.
As far as Greek 'settlers' go, well... since the RoCy is the recognized government in Cyprus, if they bring 'em in, then it is - in the eyes of the law - lawful immigration. It sounds sad and unfair, but since the internation rejection of the 1983 UDI of the north, your side is technically speaking an outlaw juristiction.

So forcing me and my family out of Cyprus to change the demography of Cyprus was legal? We should also forget about the moral side of the Cyprob in these talks also????..The Cyprob has been in and out of courts for 40 years plus....and nothing.......

Again Zan is full of shit.

There was no kind of demographic change during the inter-communal conflict:

According to the censuses which took place in Cyprus before the factual partition of the island, the Greek Cypriot community amounted to 447,901 (78,2%) in 1960, and to 498,511 (78,9%) in 19734. The Turkish Cypriot community numbered 103,822 (18,1%) people in 1960, and 116 000 (18,4%) in 1973. The total population of Cyprus was 572,707 in 1960 and 631,778 in 1973 (see Appendix 3, Table 1). An average rate of annual growth for both communities between 1960 and 1973 was similar and amounted to 0,8%. In consequence, the ethnic distribution of the population did not change between 1960 and 1974 and the proportion of each community remained stable.

http://assembly.coe.int/Documents/Worki ... OC9799.htm

The poverty in Cyprus and the conflict had affected both communities, and people from both communities emigrated abroad. In fact there are far more Greek Cypriots abroad than Turkish Cypriots.

The number (Appendix 3, Table 1) is provided by the Department of Statistics and Research of the "RoC" of the time (`73), an entity usurped by GCs and utilized as a tool in their inter-communal conflict against the TCs. In `73, the conflict was ongoing, no TC was allowed to participate in state (unless they accepted as a community the unconstitutional changes dictated by the GCs outlined in corresponding U.N. reports), TCs could not move freely unless they submitted to GC police and military control, and the GCs had limited access to the TC community. So in a language that you can understand: the number coming from that source does not even mean shit.

Yet, even if this number was correct to the last digit, it still does not mean much in retrospect, for the conflict had created drastic differences in the lives of ordinary TCs and a GCs. It is a disgraceful manipulation of the circumstances to make it sound like both communities were affected on similar grounds. In this period, almost all of the TC population was displaced from their homes and cut off from the government (for these no TC ever received any credible financial aid or compensation from any institution in the world - besides a limited one from the Rep. of Turkey); and many were at one time or another enclaved and surrounded by illegal GC "National Guard" and Greek troops. The GC side paradoxically benefited financially in the general sense from their failure to resolve the conflict. To begin with, a quarter of the population of the island had been eliminated from the state budget. The GCs pocketed virtually all money spent by the UNFICYP (that is why the Archbishop liked referring to them as his 'permanent tourists'). Even the financial aid from Turkey for the TCs had to be transferred through the GC-controlled Central Bank (resulting in substantial hard currency) and when the TCs could use the money it was again in the GC market because all ports were in the GC hands and no other market was available to the TCs. By the early 70s, there were a real boom in the GC trade and industry, particularly in the field of tourism. These are conditions far from which the TCs lived in.

[zan]

no one forced Zan and his family out of cyprus they chose to leave
utu has made a very claer and corrext point.

My father could not feed six children you piece of shit, because of the siege that Makarios had on us....You keep talking crap mate and you can kiss goodbye to 37% of Cyprus...WE WILL NOT LISTEN TO ANY MORE OF YOUR PROPAGANDA SHIT.......A deliberate attempt to make Cypriots leave their homes and country was exercised by Greeks......We are back to claim our country and our rights...You will not win on this issue...Be sure of that!!!!

You blithering idiot , how the HTF can you claim back YOUR country , you have told us on more than one occasion that your country is Turkey , what on earth are you on about stupid !!

You are the blithering idiot...First time I have used tthat one...Nice

I have done nothing of the sort..I said Turkey is our mother country just like Greece is yours..No matter how you try to put a spin on that is the way it is.....


How am I going to claim my island of Cyprus...I am doing it here and now and there is nothing you can do about it.....Who the hell do you think you are telling me what I can and can't do...Grivas??????

No Im not Grivas , but I'm the one whose brains are in the place where nature destined them to be , unlike you who stores them in your arse !
You detest me , its obvious , because Im the one that can see right through you , Im the one that knows a lot more T/Cs than you ever will , Im the one that exposes you as the fanatic piece of crap that you are mate since you believe that the 180 or so thousands who left their ancestral homes so that the settlers would move in , the property speculators would rip the benefits , the Grey Wolves would enjoy the financial rewards , and you have the audacity to come on the forum and claim that these 180 thousand Cypriots STOLE YOUR ISLAND while at the same time telling us that your motherland is TURKEY.
You have got it wrong mate , very very few G/Cs consider any other nation as their motherland other than CYPRUS.
Stupid you most certainly are , there is no doubt that your mental faculties are heavily infested with propaganda shit , but when you , a bloody foreigner , claims that your "island was stolen from you " then you have reached new heights of stupidity.
This island Plonker is called Cyprus , it belongs to the G/Cs , the T/Cs , the Armenian Cypriots and all other Cypriots , it fucking well does not belong to the Anatolian peasants or the Pontious car thieves.

I don't detest you Miltiades..I pity you.....

You still come out with the same old crap....The property issue is not the only problem in Cyprus...You holding on to my country and telling the world that that is Cyprus for Cypriots is the crap....You then wanting the return of land and not returning my rights is the crap...You are a crook...How can I detest a crook.....Behind every crook lies a sad story of a corrupted mind..I cannot only feel sorry for you..You hapless pitiful man......As for seeing through me.....You cannot see past your corrupt nose so how the hell are you going to see through me...

[zan]

Those settlers do need to be repatriated back to Turkey in a final settlement - at least those with no Cypriot family ties. The Ankara government brought them over illegally, so they have the moral resonsibility to repatriate and compensate them.

Do you think that the "RoC" should then give all voting rights back to the displaced TCs all over the world utu.......From the 1963 period on???? And should we also review all settlers from their side as well from the same period on.....

Zan,

The Turkish settlers were brought in purely as a political tactic. It was also an illegal move, as defined by the United Nations. Those settlers without Cypriot roots (such as family) really have no legal right to be there. Compensated repatriation needs to be done. As for the Turkish Cypriot diaspora, they should be encouraged to Cyprus.
As far as Greek 'settlers' go, well... since the RoCy is the recognized government in Cyprus, if they bring 'em in, then it is - in the eyes of the law - lawful immigration. It sounds sad and unfair, but since the internation rejection of the 1983 UDI of the north, your side is technically speaking an outlaw juristiction.

So forcing me and my family out of Cyprus to change the demography of Cyprus was legal? We should also forget about the moral side of the Cyprob in these talks also????..The Cyprob has been in and out of courts for 40 years plus....and nothing.......

Again Zan is full of shit.

There was no kind of demographic change during the inter-communal conflict:

According to the censuses which took place in Cyprus before the factual partition of the island, the Greek Cypriot community amounted to 447,901 (78,2%) in 1960, and to 498,511 (78,9%) in 19734. The Turkish Cypriot community numbered 103,822 (18,1%) people in 1960, and 116 000 (18,4%) in 1973. The total population of Cyprus was 572,707 in 1960 and 631,778 in 1973 (see Appendix 3, Table 1). An average rate of annual growth for both communities between 1960 and 1973 was similar and amounted to 0,8%. In consequence, the ethnic distribution of the population did not change between 1960 and 1974 and the proportion of each community remained stable.

http://assembly.coe.int/Documents/Worki ... OC9799.htm

The poverty in Cyprus and the conflict had affected both communities, and people from both communities emigrated abroad. In fact there are far more Greek Cypriots abroad than Turkish Cypriots.

The number (Appendix 3, Table 1) is provided by the Department of Statistics and Research of the "RoC" of the time (`73), an entity usurped by GCs and utilized as a tool in their inter-communal conflict against the TCs. In `73, the conflict was ongoing, no TC was allowed to participate in state (unless they accepted as a community the unconstitutional changes dictated by the GCs outlined in corresponding U.N. reports), TCs could not move freely unless they submitted to GC police and military control, and the GCs had limited access to the TC community. So in a language that you can understand: the number coming from that source does not even mean shit.

Yet, even if this number was correct to the last digit, it still does not mean much in retrospect, for the conflict had created drastic differences in the lives of ordinary TCs and a GCs. It is a disgraceful manipulation of the circumstances to make it sound like both communities were affected on similar grounds. In this period, almost all of the TC population was displaced from their homes and cut off from the government (for these no TC ever received any credible financial aid or compensation from any institution in the world - besides a limited one from the Rep. of Turkey); and many were at one time or another enclaved and surrounded by illegal GC "National Guard" and Greek troops. The GC side paradoxically benefited financially in the general sense from their failure to resolve the conflict. To begin with, a quarter of the population of the island had been eliminated from the state budget. The GCs pocketed virtually all money spent by the UNFICYP (that is why the Archbishop liked referring to them as his 'permanent tourists'). Even the financial aid from Turkey for the TCs had to be transferred through the GC-controlled Central Bank (resulting in substantial hard currency) and when the TCs could use the money it was again in the GC market because all ports were in the GC hands and no other market was available to the TCs. By the early 70s, there were a real boom in the GC trade and industry, particularly in the field of tourism. These are conditions far from which the TCs lived in.

Besides that Murat..Piratis is happy to contradict himself even....He one minute says that more GCs than TCs left the island and with this little baby he says that practically no one left.....

[Piratis]

Those settlers do need to be repatriated back to Turkey in a final settlement - at least those with no Cypriot family ties. The Ankara government brought them over illegally, so they have the moral resonsibility to repatriate and compensate them.

Do you think that the "RoC" should then give all voting rights back to the displaced TCs all over the world utu.......From the 1963 period on???? And should we also review all settlers from their side as well from the same period on.....

Zan,

The Turkish settlers were brought in purely as a political tactic. It was also an illegal move, as defined by the United Nations. Those settlers without Cypriot roots (such as family) really have no legal right to be there. Compensated repatriation needs to be done. As for the Turkish Cypriot diaspora, they should be encouraged to Cyprus.
As far as Greek 'settlers' go, well... since the RoCy is the recognized government in Cyprus, if they bring 'em in, then it is - in the eyes of the law - lawful immigration. It sounds sad and unfair, but since the internation rejection of the 1983 UDI of the north, your side is technically speaking an outlaw juristiction.

So forcing me and my family out of Cyprus to change the demography of Cyprus was legal? We should also forget about the moral side of the Cyprob in these talks also????..The Cyprob has been in and out of courts for 40 years plus....and nothing.......

Again Zan is full of shit.

There was no kind of demographic change during the inter-communal conflict:

According to the censuses which took place in Cyprus before the factual partition of the island, the Greek Cypriot community amounted to 447,901 (78,2%) in 1960, and to 498,511 (78,9%) in 19734. The Turkish Cypriot community numbered 103,822 (18,1%) people in 1960, and 116 000 (18,4%) in 1973. The total population of Cyprus was 572,707 in 1960 and 631,778 in 1973 (see Appendix 3, Table 1). An average rate of annual growth for both communities between 1960 and 1973 was similar and amounted to 0,8%. In consequence, the ethnic distribution of the population did not change between 1960 and 1974 and the proportion of each community remained stable.

http://assembly.coe.int/Documents/Worki ... OC9799.htm

The poverty in Cyprus and the conflict had affected both communities, and people from both communities emigrated abroad. In fact there are far more Greek Cypriots abroad than Turkish Cypriots.

The number (Appendix 3, Table 1) is provided by the Department of Statistics and Research of the "RoC" of the time (`73), an entity usurped by GCs and utilized as a tool in their inter-communal conflict against the TCs. In `73, the conflict was ongoing, no TC was allowed to participate in state (unless they accepted as a community the unconstitutional changes dictated by the GCs outlined in corresponding U.N. reports), TCs could not move freely unless they submitted to GC police and military control, and the GCs had limited access to the TC community. So in a language that you can understand: the number coming from that source does not even mean shit.

Yet, even if this number was correct to the last digit, it still does not mean much in retrospect, for the conflict had created drastic differences in the lives of ordinary TCs and a GCs. It is a disgraceful manipulation of the circumstances to make it sound like both communities were affected on similar grounds. In this period, almost all of the TC population was displaced from their homes and cut off from the government (for these no TC ever received any credible financial aid or compensation from any institution in the world - besides a limited one from the Rep. of Turkey); and many were at one time or another enclaved and surrounded by illegal GC "National Guard" and Greek troops. The GC side paradoxically benefited financially in the general sense from their failure to resolve the conflict. To begin with, a quarter of the population of the island had been eliminated from the state budget. The GCs pocketed virtually all money spent by the UNFICYP (that is why the Archbishop liked referring to them as his 'permanent tourists'). Even the financial aid from Turkey for the TCs had to be transferred through the GC-controlled Central Bank (resulting in substantial hard currency) and when the TCs could use the money it was again in the GC market because all ports were in the GC hands and no other market was available to the TCs. By the early 70s, there were a real boom in the GC trade and industry, particularly in the field of tourism. These are conditions far from which the TCs lived in.

The numbers presented are facts that are accepted by all. (Except maybe the Turkish propagandists). If you dispute them then let me see what more reliable source than the Council of Europe you have to contradict them.

Yes, there was a conflict, and yes people suffered. This conflict was started by you in 1958 so what did you want from us? To just allow you to attack us and collaborate with the British in order to deny to Cyprus its freedom, and not to fight back? Furthermore, the Greek Cypriots didn't suffer only during that mere decade. They also suffered for 3+ centuries, and had 10s of thousands of casualties under your brutal rule, as well as the last 34 years that our lands are occupied by you.

Basically since the time you set your foot on our island you never stopped oppressing us, except from a short period of 80 years between 1878 and 1958. And then you, the aggressors and invaders of our island who have killed 10s of thousands of Cypriots, come here to present yourselves as the victims because you had a few 100s of casualties during a mere decade in a conflict which you started against us?? Ridiculous!

[Piratis]

Those settlers do need to be repatriated back to Turkey in a final settlement - at least those with no Cypriot family ties. The Ankara government brought them over illegally, so they have the moral resonsibility to repatriate and compensate them.

Do you think that the "RoC" should then give all voting rights back to the displaced TCs all over the world utu.......From the 1963 period on???? And should we also review all settlers from their side as well from the same period on.....

Zan,

The Turkish settlers were brought in purely as a political tactic. It was also an illegal move, as defined by the United Nations. Those settlers without Cypriot roots (such as family) really have no legal right to be there. Compensated repatriation needs to be done. As for the Turkish Cypriot diaspora, they should be encouraged to Cyprus.
As far as Greek 'settlers' go, well... since the RoCy is the recognized government in Cyprus, if they bring 'em in, then it is - in the eyes of the law - lawful immigration. It sounds sad and unfair, but since the internation rejection of the 1983 UDI of the north, your side is technically speaking an outlaw juristiction.

So forcing me and my family out of Cyprus to change the demography of Cyprus was legal? We should also forget about the moral side of the Cyprob in these talks also????..The Cyprob has been in and out of courts for 40 years plus....and nothing.......

Again Zan is full of shit.

There was no kind of demographic change during the inter-communal conflict:

According to the censuses which took place in Cyprus before the factual partition of the island, the Greek Cypriot community amounted to 447,901 (78,2%) in 1960, and to 498,511 (78,9%) in 19734. The Turkish Cypriot community numbered 103,822 (18,1%) people in 1960, and 116 000 (18,4%) in 1973. The total population of Cyprus was 572,707 in 1960 and 631,778 in 1973 (see Appendix 3, Table 1). An average rate of annual growth for both communities between 1960 and 1973 was similar and amounted to 0,8%. In consequence, the ethnic distribution of the population did not change between 1960 and 1974 and the proportion of each community remained stable.

http://assembly.coe.int/Documents/Worki ... OC9799.htm

The poverty in Cyprus and the conflict had affected both communities, and people from both communities emigrated abroad. In fact there are far more Greek Cypriots abroad than Turkish Cypriots.

The number (Appendix 3, Table 1) is provided by the Department of Statistics and Research of the "RoC" of the time (`73), an entity usurped by GCs and utilized as a tool in their inter-communal conflict against the TCs. In `73, the conflict was ongoing, no TC was allowed to participate in state (unless they accepted as a community the unconstitutional changes dictated by the GCs outlined in corresponding U.N. reports), TCs could not move freely unless they submitted to GC police and military control, and the GCs had limited access to the TC community. So in a language that you can understand: the number coming from that source does not even mean shit.

Yet, even if this number was correct to the last digit, it still does not mean much in retrospect, for the conflict had created drastic differences in the lives of ordinary TCs and a GCs. It is a disgraceful manipulation of the circumstances to make it sound like both communities were affected on similar grounds. In this period, almost all of the TC population was displaced from their homes and cut off from the government (for these no TC ever received any credible financial aid or compensation from any institution in the world - besides a limited one from the Rep. of Turkey); and many were at one time or another enclaved and surrounded by illegal GC "National Guard" and Greek troops. The GC side paradoxically benefited financially in the general sense from their failure to resolve the conflict. To begin with, a quarter of the population of the island had been eliminated from the state budget. The GCs pocketed virtually all money spent by the UNFICYP (that is why the Archbishop liked referring to them as his 'permanent tourists'). Even the financial aid from Turkey for the TCs had to be transferred through the GC-controlled Central Bank (resulting in substantial hard currency) and when the TCs could use the money it was again in the GC market because all ports were in the GC hands and no other market was available to the TCs. By the early 70s, there were a real boom in the GC trade and industry, particularly in the field of tourism. These are conditions far from which the TCs lived in.

Besides that Murat..Piratis is happy to contradict himself even....He one minute says that more GCs than TCs left the island and with this little baby he says that practically no one left.....

What the report says is that "the ethnic distribution of the population did not change". What this means is that the amount of people that left from Cyprus was proportionally equal for both sides, and not that "no one left".

Since GCs are more, and since the same % of GCs and TCs left from Cyprus, this exactly supports what I said that there are more GCs abroad. E.g if 1% of the approximately 500000 GCs left, it is 5000 people, while if proportionality the same amount of TCs left (1% of less than 100000) it is less than 1000 people.

Furthermore a lot more GCs left after the Turkish invasion.

[Viewpoint]

We were being systmatically cleansed by your religious leader.

[zan]

It does not mention anyone leaving Piratis...Was this on purpose???? Do the figures also show how many babies were being born ton each side....The TCs just had bigger families in those days....And who did you say did the survey????

The pioint of the matter is that in 1974 there were at least 10,000 makarios supporters that were destined for murder....Makarios came back...What do you think would have happened to those Coupist supporters do you think????

The fact still remains that my father could not find work like thousands more and food was in short supply because of isolation and siege.....TCs left because of that reason...I ddo not have to find anything or look at numbers to tellme that...We are living facts of that....

[Piratis]

We were being systmatically cleansed by your religious leader.

As much as we were systematically cleansed by you, the ones who started that conflict in the first place. The numbers are clear. So why do you blame Makarios for the conflict and not your TMT who started it? Or did you want us to just sit their and let you attack us, kill us and impose your will on us with your collaboration with the British and not to fight back for our rights?

And now we are talking just for that decade. Not counting the 10s of thousands of Cypriots that you killed before AND after that decade.

It is really ridiculous from your part to present yourselves as the innocent victims when it is you who invaded our island in the first place and then oppressed us for centuries, and you who started both the inter communal conflict of 1958-1968 and the war of 1974.