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The future of TCs.

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby Viewpoint » Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:55 pm

Agios Ionas wrote:A new war is the last thing this island is in need of. The scars of yesteryear can and will heal eventually although it will take a long time. The 34 years of no solution is proof enough that time is needed badly. But a new war will open an ugly bleeding wound that won't heal in a foreseeable future. New generations will be poisoned by hate and violence, not in the form of tales of the past, but rather first hand experience. Enough people have suffered already, and many are still suffering. I mean, seriously, who the f*ck cares about a plot of land if you've lost your child to a bomb or bullet? It doesn't matter if that plot of land is worth £5 million. The lives of your children has no price tag!

As much as I want Turkish forces out of Cyprus and a reunited island where GC and TC can co-exist peacefully and equally I would never call for a war. The only war I'd possibly condone would be if GC and TC alike joined forces and tried to expel Turkish forces from the island in order to free Cyprus and give it back to its natural citizens. Still, the price would be very high. Personally, although I have no death wish, I'd be willing to risk my life for something bigger than me. But I would never allow a situation where my family is put to danger. I would engage an entire army on my own if necessary. But I would make sure my wife and children are in a safe place first. Quite frankly, I think the chances of a GC/TC joint effort to fight off Turkey and win are less than Turkey collapsing on her own one day. So I guess it's better to wait and watch her destroy herself than to challenge her and end up with Cyprus being 100% Turkish. The Cypriots (GC/TC) surviving would be in for a very hard time. Because Turkey would oppress and punish as if there was no tomorrow.
A new war would ruin the whole of Cyprus for a very long period, long enough for us, our children and grandchildren to be miserable for our entire lives. A new war would cause instability in the whole EU. Forget about a flourishing tourist business for a considerable amount of years. It will take much longer than it did last time to achieve some kind of trustworthy stability to allow for the "outer world" to want to do business with and visit Cyprus.

Some people keep harping about the Ottoman connection and seem stuck in 1571. +400 years is a long time, no one of us were existing back then. I would say that if your family have been in a country for that long, you belong in said country. No matter if you're a descendant of an invader. Anyone must admit that +400 years down the line the descendants are hardly responsible of what their ancestors did. We can hardly choose where to be born and by whom.

We can keep blaming people for what they did 34 years ago because it's still quite recent and people involved in the atrocities are still alive. But +400 years ago? Come on, somewhere a line must be drawn and some things must be considered history. I mean, where would the UK be if people were still fighting about who's Saxon and Norman?

What are you people asking for war thinking? It's enough suffering in the world already. Why are you so keen on bringing it on your own doorstep? Cyprus is in need of peace, not war.


Great post I would like to high light your feelings about living in a Cyprus run by Turkey, we feel exactly the same about living in a GC state run by GCs with us just as another minority. I hope you can appreciate why we need a BBF with political equality of the 2 states.
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Postby Oracle » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:03 pm

OK! ..... So we have a Lame Duck for a President and we have to rely on the EU to get us out of Turkey's stranglehold ... :?

Are we to just ignore all the gifts he gives to them now? How retractable will these offerings to the Turks be in future?

Are his sights set for a Nobel Peace Prize and sod the GCs?

I want a real President :(
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Postby Nikitas » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:06 pm

The TC community is going through a process of self appraisal, pretty much what the GC community went through in the 70s. It is anything but an easy time for them. We GCs were forced into choices through sudden disaster. For TCs it is a more gradual process, but still radical.

Many choices are coming to a head- EU in or out, Turkish or Cypriot, independent or subjugated to Turkey, united or partitioned, secular or Islamic. They have to decide all this while there are 40 000 soldiers on their side of the fence and thousands of settlers, many of whom are politically organized to undermine the TCs.

It is doubtful whether any political analyst can make any sense of what is going on in the north or how things will work out. One thing is for sure, Talat has to be very agile to balance all these choices and come out on top.

Perhaps this is what Chrstofias senses and opens some of his cards apparently prematurely. Every "concession" is a push to act.
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Postby Viewpoint » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:10 pm

If these 2 leaders cannot workout a deal we have no hope of a solution. The alternative leaders are hardliners and would rather continue with the current status quo. If the GCs have an ounce of sense they would seize the opportunity.
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Postby Oracle » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:15 pm

No!
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Postby Kifeas » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:22 pm

Viewpoint wrote:If these 2 leaders cannot workout a deal we have no hope of a solution. The alternative leaders are hardliners and would rather continue with the current status quo. If the GCs have an ounce of sense they would seize the opportunity.


VP, Talat or any other TC leader, hardliner or not, is only a puppet! Talat is a puppet! He cannot make any decision, unless he is able to first sell it to the military and the hardline bureaucrats of the Turkish foreign ministry!
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Postby Viewpoint » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:25 pm

Kifeas wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:If these 2 leaders cannot workout a deal we have no hope of a solution. The alternative leaders are hardliners and would rather continue with the current status quo. If the GCs have an ounce of sense they would seize the opportunity.


VP, Talat or any other TC leader, hardliner or not, is only a puppet! Talat is a puppet! He cannot make any decision, unless he is able to first sell it to the military and the bureaucrats of the Turkish foreign ministry!


Then he is the man in the most difficult position so Christofiyas would serve the GCs best if he was flexible enough to accomadate Talat so the he may perform the balancing acting to clinch a solution.
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Postby miltiades » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:26 pm

Viewpoint wrote:
miltiades wrote:There is indeed a time for war , but right now time is for peace . The Cypriot people will NEVER accept any negotiated agreement put on the table that offers Turkey a part of Cyprus on the plate and neither will the people of Cyprus will accept that the occupier has a right to intervene at its pleasure. This land is European land , Turkey is not , yet , a European nation , and the EU will not sit back and accept a situation whereby Turkey is in the driving seat as regards a member nation.
A couple of years back I posted that the only people that can force Turkey out of Cyprus are the T/Cs , now it is also the EU. We are witnessing right now the beginning of the end of the Turkish occupation of a part of Cyprus . We have heard from T/Cs stating clearly that they are proud T/Cs they do NOT want to become extinct in their own country . Our fight must remain a political one and it must be intensified but not at the expense of our T/C compatriots to whom we must reach out with olive brances not guns.
Our hospitals provide care for all that require it , let the people know that any T/C can demand and receive health care , let them claim it as their entitlement and let Turkey know that this nation of Cypriots is compassionate , caring , peace loving , decent folk but determined not to capitulate and accept the loss of their sovereignty.
I opposed the AP , I hope that the next plan will be palatable to say the least .


Did you know that in a recent poll 76% trust the Turkish army so the few bandits you are so proud of do no weild much support.

Did the poll include the settlers too , if so 24% mistrusting Turkey must have been T/Cs so out of a poll of 1000 lets say , T/Cs amounted to about 300 , therefore 240 is a huge majority of T/Cs !!
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Postby Kifeas » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:28 pm

Oracle wrote:OK! ..... So we have a Lame Duck for a President and we have to rely on the EU to get us out of Turkey's stranglehold ... :?

Are we to just ignore all the gifts he gives to them now? How retractable will these offerings to the Turks be in future?

Are his sights set for a Nobel Peace Prize and sod the GCs?

I want a real President :(


Not yet! Let's wait a bit more to see where he is heading! As things stand now, both of them are in a show game of who will receive the international community's blame for the inevitable failure of the negotiations.
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Postby Kifeas » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:30 pm

Viewpoint wrote:
Kifeas wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:If these 2 leaders cannot workout a deal we have no hope of a solution. The alternative leaders are hardliners and would rather continue with the current status quo. If the GCs have an ounce of sense they would seize the opportunity.


VP, Talat or any other TC leader, hardliner or not, is only a puppet! Talat is a puppet! He cannot make any decision, unless he is able to first sell it to the military and the bureaucrats of the Turkish foreign ministry!


Then he is the man in the most difficult position so Christofiyas would serve the GCs best if he was flexible enough to accomadate Talat so the he may perform the balancing acting to clinch a solution.


I do not think you should have much to complain about, when it comes to Christofias role, so far!
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