Cyprus-Forum.com

[Raymanoff]

try this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6A2-wz1shE

works for me

[Oracle]

try this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6A2-wz1shE

works for me

... it says .. This video is not available in your country ..

What is happening to Freedom of Speech

[Nikitas]

The Foreign Minister of Belgium yesterday said:

"Only an idiot would do what Saakasvili did......"

The man must have read the posts here. On the other hand he did not need to read anything to understand the caliber of this Harvard man. What was he thinking of I wonder when he decided to take on the Russians.

[CopperLine]

This was in today's Grauniad by Mikhail Gorbachev, the guy who we should be thankful for preventing the war to end all ... life.

We had no choice
Leaders in the Caucasus must stop flexing military muscle and develop the grounds for lasting peace

o Mikhail Gorbachev
o The Guardian,
o Wednesday August 13 2008

The past week's events in South Ossetia are bound to shock and pain anyone. Already, thousands of people have died, tens of thousands have been turned into refugees, and towns and villages lie in ruins. Nothing can justify this loss of life and destruction. It is a warning to all.

The roots of this tragedy lie in the decision of Georgia's separatist leaders in 1991 to abolish South Ossetian autonomy. Each time successive Georgian leaders tried to impose their will by force - both in South Ossetia and in Abkhazia, where the issues of autonomy are similar - it only made the situation worse.

Nevertheless, it was still possible to find a political solution. Clearly, the only way to solve the South Ossetian problem on that basis is through peaceful means. The Georgian leadership flouted this key principle.

What happened on the night of August 7 is beyond comprehension. The Georgian military attacked the South Ossetian capital of Tskhinvali with multiple rocket launchers designed to devastate large areas. Russia had to respond. To accuse it of aggression against "small, defenceless Georgia" is not just hypocritical but shows a lack of humanity.

The Georgian leadership could do this only with the perceived support and encouragement of a much more powerful force. Georgian armed forces were trained by hundreds of US instructors, and its sophisticated military equipment was bought in a number of countries. This, coupled with the promise of Nato membership, emboldened Georgian leaders.

Now that the military assault has been routed, both the Georgian government and its supporters should rethink their position. When the problems of South Ossetia and Abkhazia first flared up, I proposed that they be settled through a federation that would grant broad autonomy to the two republics. This idea was dismissed, particularly by the Georgians. Attitudes gradually shifted, but after last week it will be much more difficult to strike a deal even on such a basis.

Small nations of the Caucasus do have a history of living together. It has been demonstrated that a lasting peace is possible, that tolerance and cooperation can create conditions for normal life and development. Nothing is more important. The region's political leaders need to realise this. Instead of flexing military muscle, they should devote their efforts to building the groundwork for durable peace.

Over the past few days, some western nations have taken positions, particularly in the UN security council, that have been far from balanced. As a result, the security council was not able to act effectively from the very start of this conflict. By declaring the Caucasus, a region that is thousands of miles from the American continent, a sphere of its "national interest", the US made a serious blunder. Of course, peace in the Caucasus is in everyone's interest. But it is simply common sense to recognise that Russia is rooted there by common geography and centuries of history. Russia is not seeking territorial expansion, but it has legitimate interests in this region.

The international community's long-term aim could be to create a sub-regional system of security and cooperation that would make any provocation, and the very possibility of crises such as this one, impossible. Building this type of system would be challenging and could only be accomplished with the cooperation of the region's countries themselves. Nations outside the region could perhaps help, too - but only if they take a fair and objective stance. A lesson from recent events is that geopolitical games are dangerous anywhere, not just in the Caucasus.

· Mikhail Gorbachev was the last president of the Soviet Union; he was awarded the Nobel peace prize in 1990

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/aug/13/russia.georgia1

[Filitsa]

The Foreign Minister of Belgium yesterday said:

"Only an idiot would do what Saakasvili did......"

The man must have read the posts here. On the other hand he did not need to read anything to understand the caliber of this Harvard man. What was he thinking of I wonder when he decided to take on the Russians.

Whoever started the rumor that Saakashvili is a Harvard grad., didn't do his homework. Saakashvili graduataed from the School of International Law of the Kiev State University, Ukraine. He then earned an LLM (Master of Laws) a from Columbia Law School and then a S.J.D. (Doctor of Juridical Science) from George Washington University Law School. Then he earned a diploma from the International Institute of Human Rights in Strasbourg, France. Harvard does not appear in any of his bios or resumes.

[Bananiot]

Michail Gorbachov is a wise man Copperline. I go along with you that he saved the world from destruction in 1989. The collapse of the Soviet Union should have started a war with nukes, normally. We should all cherish a picture oh him, in our wallet. He has all my respect.

Does the greediness of the Georgians who were it seems encouraged by the west or perhaps they thought they could blackmail the west to come to their side, remind you of the recent history of Cyprus? There seem to exist many similarities. Our reckless leaders did a Shakasvili, it seems, a long time before Shakasvili.

[CopperLine]

Bananiot,
As you say, though the parallels are not exact, the similarities are worth thinking about. For what it is worth, the common conceit of 'small countries' is that they tend to over-inflate their importance to the wider world and to great powers in particular. And then, as if surprised, when their presumed leverage doesn't work or they're sold down the river, they bemoan their fate.

Moving from Georgia to Cyprus, the thirty five year stalemate of division simply is of no interest or worry to the 'great powers'. Neither RoC nor TRNC have leverage over their respective 'patrons', whether these be Turkey, EU, US or whoever. And the 'patrons' (ironically with the possible exception of Turkey) have got zero incentive to rush into a settlement. And who suffers for this ? Cypriots.

[Bananiot]

Agree, but have you seen any Cypriot worry? We seem to live for today and hope that by some magic turn of luck (the ancient Greeks used to call it "από μηχανής θεός" or "deus ex machina" in Latin) our misfortunes will one day be blown into the wind.

[Oracle]

Size-ists

David and Goliath ....

[RichardB]

Summary of the Georgian debacle…

GRs Summary of this may be found here.......

....Interesting!!

http://letsmoanaboutcyprus.myfreeforum. ... ut111.html