Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oracle]

or the trnc. turkish republic of northern cyprus. i have been to turkey and don't see the trnc as part of turkey at all. also my turkish friends don't see cyprus as part of turkey either. in fact most turkish people i meet don't like cyprus or cypriot people.

Glad to hear that even a Brit living in the occupied part has not foolishly conceded part of Cyprus into a mini Turkey.

But seriously, which people do Turks like?

[Oracle]

juliesewell you have made a really interesting and thorough analysis of the problem at hand.

I must admit I have heard a number of people refer to TRNC as the "Turkish" half....

There is no TRNC, only Turkish occupied Cyprus. It is not recognised as a separate entity by any country other than Turkey, but clearly they are managing to make too many people think otherwise.

taking a couple of trips to Kyrenia and getting off the harbour area, it does look and feel very much like any of the resorts we visited in Turkey.

So it sounds like the Turkification of the occupied area is proving effective.

A lot of TCs deny this ongoing Turkification, firmly suggesting they are keeping it Cypriot.

It doesn't help that the names of the resorts, streets etc have all been changed.

This is a very powerful tool! The quick establishment of their language has eroded the very substance of thousands of years as a Hellenic Island.

Is it a War crime to do this, akin to the colonisation?

We've only ever visited for a few hours at a time and there's nothing there that would encourage me to stay for any length of time. We've been about 4 times since we came to live in Cyprus and other than more building work, nothing much has changed.

The massive amount of building work, we are now finding out, is to replace ancient Churches and erode an obviously Hellenic heritage.

. A lot of travellers coming on holiday have no idea Cyprus is still a divided country - that's if they ever knew it was divided in the first place.

It's not really a divided country, Julieswell. It is a country currently under occupation, by no means a fait accompli. Very much reversible and not something we have given up on.

We really need to change the mind-set of the average person from perceiving the Island as divided with half belonging to Turkey; and present the reality of an EU member country still under illegal Turkish occupation which needs help to remove the enemy.

The very first time we crossed into the TRNC was at Ledra Palace UN point in 1992 on foot, when you had to pay Cy£1 to the police checkpoint.

Julie .... do you appreciate the difference between the "TRNC" and the TRNC?

[juliesewell]

Don't you just hate it when everyone just fills up pages with keep quoting other people's posts????

And sorry Orac's - I did mean to say divided "city" rather than country

[Oracle]

Don't you just hate it when everyone just fills up pages with keep quoting other people's posts????

And sorry Orac's - I did mean to say divided "city" rather than country

I had already suggested (a while back) to Admin that they limit the carry-over of quotes to 3 to limit those endless ones. But no one has done that here. One or two carry overs don't bother me, so that things are kept connected. So no problem her julie

You weren't been chastised regarding your view of a divided city / country. It clearly is a view that is seeping through to those that listen more to the Turkish propaganda. As Spanish_spinney said it is a commonly held view in Spain.

I take it all the other Brits are content with accepting the occupied north as being part of Turkey, or do not care; so long as they can retire in peace....

[juliesewell]

Oracle

It's not part of Turkey, which I and many British people or otherwise are fully aware of. But, it most definitely feels like it when you go there.

Hopefully one day, the island will be reunited - but to be honest, I cannot see it happening in my lifetime. There is still much propaganda from both sides. Children are indoctrinated with the events in school today and each believe the 2 sides are hateful people.

You have to allow the lifespan of those involved in the uprising to end, and allow children in school to see it as a historical event. But that takes a long time...

My personal feeling is Cyprus is too small an island for a natural disassociation to happen, it's just too close to home. Whereas, if you look at the events of WWI and WWII, which involved other countries and nationalities, it's more widely spread and probably doesn't have quite the same impact or isn't "in your face" quite so much.

I don't know what the solution is but obviously, I am not directly involved, having no Cypriot family and it's much easier to remain objective. I see Cyprus as a whole, but everyday life makes sure we are aware of the north and south divide.

I sincerely wish we didn't have to be reminded on a daily basis and I can fully appreciate the view of a Cypriot friend who will never cross the line whilst he has to show his ID in his own country. I'm sure I would feel the same if it had happened to me and mine.

Now, that's enough from me on this matter. I do usually try to stay clear of discussions on the Cyprus Problem.

[Spanish_spinne]

Also about how propaganda goes I have to tell you all that here in Spain its "normal" that our press reflects the north as somenthing like it belongs to Turkey, first of all because as you all surely know our president is a close friend of Mr. Erdogan (or at least it looks like) and second and more important here its normal to accept that a ·strong· state takes the land of a small one and integrates it in to their country, sends settlers and made it a part of them. If they start supporting other visions maybe we the Catalans, and the Basques will start thinking .... (don't want to bore you with our political problems, but I'm sure you understand what I'm trying to say)

[halil]

for a moment Cyprus is divided in two .Turkish Cypriot and Greek Cypriot Sites . We all know why and how divided .
we people of the north we show our good will to solve this problem by saying yes to UN's Annan plan .

Now both sides are talking again how to solve the Cyprus Problem which we are having since 1963 .

Last agreement between both sides are pointed out that we can have Bi-zonal ,bi-communal solution in Cyprus ... Up to solution what is the point to stopping the peoples relation with TC's and You are waiting from us that we can understand you ....İ am sorry ......

Before 74 TC's were also living in North as they are own lands . How can you try to stop other people not to contact with us .This is only blackmailing and Expansions over others .

İt is true TRNC not recognize by world but TRNC has got her own parliament and other civil organisations . Parliamentarians are elected by people of the North .
North has got very tide relationship with Turkey because it is the only one country who supports them politically and financially ,what do you except that we can do . Till we find the solution there is no way for Turkish Cypriots .

None of you questioning the losses of Turkish Cypriots since 1963 .
how many or how many percentage of the Turkish Cypriots were left they are homes at 1963 and 1974 .

before 74 Turkish Cypriots populations were 120 000 .

at 63 from this population 25000 of them became refugees .
at 74 from this population 65000 more became refugees too .
nearly 90000 of them left they are homes and these peoples must be isolated and they must not do any busyness or travel freely like rest of the world people .

[DT.]

for a moment Cyprus is divided in two .Turkish Cypriot and Greek Cypriot Sites . We all know why and how divided .
we people of the north we show our good will to solve this problem by saying yes to UN's Annan plan .

Now both sides are talking again how to solve the Cyprus Problem which we are having since 1963 .

Last agreement between both sides are pointed out that we can have Bi-zonal ,bi-communal solution in Cyprus ... Up to solution what is the point to stopping the peoples relation with TC's and You are waiting from us that we can understand you ....İ am sorry ......

Before 74 TC's were also living in North as they are own lands . How can you try to stop other people not to contact with us .This is only blackmailing and Expansions over others .

İt is true TRNC not recognize by world but TRNC has got her own parliament and other civil organisations . Parliamentarians are elected by people of the North .
North has got very tide relationship with Turkey because it is the only one country who supports them politically and financially ,what do you except that we can do . Till we find the solution there is no way for Turkish Cypriots .

None of you questioning the losses of Turkish Cypriots since 1963 .
how many or how many percentage of the Turkish Cypriots were left they are homes at 1963 and 1974 .

before 74 Turkish Cypriots populations were 120 000 .

at 63 from this population 25000 of them became refugees .
at 74 from this population 65000 more became refugees too .
nearly 90000 of them left they are homes and these peoples must be isolated and they must not do any busyness or travel freely like rest of the world people .

Are you complaining about the way the invasion was carried out? Did it disturb you? Would you have wished for a way were you could kick the GC's out from the north and still find a way for TC's to stay in the south?

Did the Turkish Invasion inconvenience you Halil?

[Oracle]

for a moment Cyprus is divided in two .Turkish Cypriot and Greek Cypriot Sites . We all know why and how divided .
we people of the north we show our good will to solve this problem by saying yes to UN's Annan plan .

Now both sides are talking again how to solve the Cyprus Problem which we are having since 1963 .

Last agreement between both sides are pointed out that we can have Bi-zonal ,bi-communal solution in Cyprus ... Up to solution what is the point to stopping the peoples relation with TC's and You are waiting from us that we can understand you ....İ am sorry ......

Before 74 TC's were also living in North as they are own lands . How can you try to stop other people not to contact with us .This is only blackmailing and Expansions over others .

İt is true TRNC not recognize by world but TRNC has got her own parliament and other civil organisations . Parliamentarians are elected by people of the North .
North has got very tide relationship with Turkey because it is the only one country who supports them politically and financially ,what do you except that we can do . Till we find the solution there is no way for Turkish Cypriots .

None of you questioning the losses of Turkish Cypriots since 1963 .
how many or how many percentage of the Turkish Cypriots were left they are homes at 1963 and 1974 .

before 74 Turkish Cypriots populations were 120 000 .

at 63 from this population 25000 of them became refugees .
at 74 from this population 65000 more became refugees too .
nearly 90000 of them left they are homes and these peoples must be isolated and they must not do any busyness or travel freely like rest of the world people .

Halil ... you have totally missed the point here ... although any excuse for you to churn out your verbatim manifesto.

I am more interested in whether the Brits living/holidaying in the RoC, view the occupied part of Cyprus as already part of Turkey.

Clearly SSBubbles does as she has stated she wants to go there for a "taste of Turkey" and to buy the type of jewellery like they sell in Turkey.

I would have liked to determine how prevalent this view is, of the occupied part having succumbed completely to Turkification.

And I am not asking for your view, I know it ... please spare me.
I wanted to hear from Brits whose country of origin is a main player in the Solution of the Cyprus Problem.

[koritsi]

I'm not sure if the Brits will ever have a hand in resolving the Cyprus problem, although I do think they had a hand before by doing nothing.
I am not Greek or Cypriot despite my tag, which is what I was called by a taxi driver, even though well over 50. I liked it and it stuck
I visit/stay in Cyprus frequently. I know it is occupied illegally and that only Turkey recognises the "country".
I think many holidaymakers neither know nor care.
I hope for a solution as many of my neighbours in the village where I stay are refugees, some living in former Turkish Cypriot property allocated by the government and some in refugee housing.
I was there last week when there were discussions about Kokkino, but none of this appeared in the British press. In fact, the opening of Ledra Street - something monumental, having been closed since the 60s, made a small article inside the Times - nothing more.
Cyprus isn't Saudi Arabia or Palestine or Israel or Iraq or Iran. It doesn't have oil and it is no longer strategically important although the sovereign bases remain.
This post sounds rather dismal, I know but it's what I think.
The Cypriots are the most wonderful, friendly and generous people I know.
I hope and pray for a resolution that will please all - surely that will be possible one day?