Cyprus-Forum.com

[Nikitas]

How does any of the above require virgin birth, two states, separate self determination and permanent presence of Turkish troops? If you are talking secret agendas then look at all the above and say it is not the first step towards annihilating the GCs!

[Viewpoint]

How does any of the above require virgin birth, two states, separate self determination and permanent presence of Turkish troops? If you are talking secret agendas then look at all the above and say it is not the first step towards annihilating the GCs!

Did the "Roc" work with both communities involved? arent you the ones crying you were forced into the "RoC" and had no intention of making it work because you did not believe it to be fair?

A virgin birth is a new start with something that will stand a good chance of working.

650 vs 950 soldiers you have more yet you are a larger population, dont we need more to protect ourselves? do you prefer 650 or 40.000?

Self determinaiton also means administering your own state and not being forced to live amongest GCs thus providing people a choice, have you ever looked at the above issues from another angle?

[Oracle]

We TCs are looking for an agreement that will not leave us exposed to GC will under the camflouge of "democracy in numbers", there has to be a system where can stop anything that will effect TCs or the north state more negatively, why do the GCs fear these safeguards if they have no intention of exploiting them. If they are so confident and act inline with rules and regulations these safeguards will become redundent in a very period of time. Your approach reveals that you have hidden agendas to push us into oblivion and take control fo the whole island under the guise of democracy once again resurecting your ideology of turning the island into a GC state run by GCs.

It is a whole Island .. but currently partly under occupation.

I thought the present process was to make it whole once again as it always was before the previous Turkish invasion; and the obvious Western-style of Government to re-employ is as a Democracy.

[Nikitas]

You can have 12000 TC soldiers and no mainland Turks. Have you ever thought of that possibility? IT is not the soldier that are the problem, it is their origin and the country they belong to.

Self determination separately expressed, as a principle, was rejected by Denktash and Clerides in the same agreements which said that the solution would be BBF. Now we are faced with a backtracking on that as well as the issue of the unitary state.

[Oracle]

How does any of the above require virgin birth, two states, separate self determination and permanent presence of Turkish troops? If you are talking secret agendas then look at all the above and say it is not the first step towards annihilating the GCs!

Did the "Roc" work with both communities involved? arent you the ones crying you were forced into the "RoC" and had no intention of making it work because you did not believe it to be fair?

A virgin birth is a new start with something that will stand a good chance of working.

650 vs 950 soldiers you have more yet you are a larger population, dont we need more to protect ourselves? do you prefer 650 or 40.000?

Self determinaiton also means administering your own state and not being forced to live amongest GCs thus providing people a choice, have you ever looked at the above issues from another angle?

So if the original constitution just needed a slight improvement ... yet you were so unhappy with such minor modifications that you ditched the whole thing!

But you now expect to re-design a whole new Constitution (or two) from scratch and that is supposedly sensible and preferable?

[Viewpoint]

You can have 12000 TC soldiers and no mainland Turks. Have you ever thought of that possibility? IT is not the soldier that are the problem, it is their origin and the country they belong to.

Self determination separately expressed, as a principle, was rejected by Denktash and Clerides in the same agreements which said that the solution would be BBF. Now we are faced with a backtracking on that as well as the issue of the unitary state.

I am totally against armies in Cyprus but a symbolic amount appears to be the compromise both sides will have to made so 650 TC and 950 GC appears to exactly that, but I still have problems understand why 650 for the smaller population sure they need more to protect them from the larger population?

Local self determinaiton is paramount for TCs as they want the option of being able to live either south or north, neither side should be forced to live under just one local administration, if this was the case TCs would reject such a formatiom immediately, as previously agreed by our leaders BBF is the key, veering from this would cause a negative response from TCs and just when the GCs have come to terms with what was previously agreed, that would also show yet again that GC renege on their compromise and that would not give much condfidence to overall agreement.

[Nikitas]

"Local self determinaiton is paramount for TCs "

so that negates the agreement between Denktash and Clerides, and if you go back on one part you go back on the whole, including the part about BBF. Since we are talking about self determination by each side separately then surely the GCs have a right not to have their country guaranteed by Turkey, Greece, or anyone else.

[eracles]

I am totally against armies in Cyprus but a symbolic amount appears to be the compromise both sides will have to made so 650 TC and 950 GC appears to exactly that, but I still have problems understand why 650 for the smaller population sure they need more to protect them from the larger population?

I hope that you will concede that Mother Turkey with one of the biggest armies in the world is but minutes away - Long lost Mother Greece who couldn't give two hoots about Cyprus is a good deal further, so perhaps GC should have even more???

[Viewpoint]

"Local self determinaiton is paramount for TCs "

so that negates the agreement between Denktash and Clerides, and if you go back on one part you go back on the whole, including the part about BBF. Since we are talking about self determination by each side separately then surely the GCs have a right not to have their country guaranteed by Turkey, Greece, or anyone else.

You are right maybe thats a way forward on the gurantee issue, Turkey only guaratees the north state.

[Viewpoint]

I am totally against armies in Cyprus but a symbolic amount appears to be the compromise both sides will have to made so 650 TC and 950 GC appears to exactly that, but I still have problems understand why 650 for the smaller population sure they need more to protect them from the larger population?

I hope that you will concede that Mother Turkey with one of the biggest armies in the world is but minutes away - Long lost Mother Greece who couldn't give two hoots about Cyprus is a good deal further, so perhaps GC should have even more???

If Turkey vacates North Cyprus another intervention would be near enough impossible allowing for the fact that the EU as a whole would have to defend one of its member states.