Cyprus-Forum.com

[Murtaza]

Correction: You understood nothing, as you understand very little things about you OWN history, let alone the history of the west.
You just met a guy who knows a small part of your history, yet enough to draw the conclusion that the Hellenic Civilization's impact on global life and thinking was way more significant than the Ottoman/Turkish/Turkomongolic or you name it. Way too much blood in that history for my taste brother, and very little impact on what most of the world is experiencing now.

Sad to see that several TUrkish members are still sunk into the depths of ignorance and fictitious history. Hopefully, the Turkish educational system will start working towards the opposite direction and start telling the story from a more spherical prespective. Until then, God bless the blind...

You have a nice day yourself.[/quote]

"You just met a guy who knows a small part of your history, yet enough to draw the conclusion that the Hellenic Civilization's impact on global life and thinking was way more significant than the "

To the west world. If you look east you will see a lot Turks influence. Everypart of east you will see Turks and their culture.
And yes you know small part realy a small part. Because our culture is more more bigger than your greece limited culture. Even I know small part of my culture. Because it is so vast, you can see Turks in china,India,Egypt,Balkains,Middle Asia, Russia, Anatolia. And we didnt steal any history from the others.

And Democracy, Do you think it is just greeks applyed democrasy (Infact it is aristocracy in greece with all their slaves) from Greece. Turks have their aristocracy in the waste barren lands of middle Asia .We have our Kurultays. We choose our leaders. And we have no slaves. Even Osman and his father Ertugrul ( founder of Ottomans Empire ) choosen by their people.(All people, no one exceptional. No slave)

So you know nothing no small part. You just know how to hate Turks culture.And I dont call this "small part".

No you dont know even small part of our history. You just know your history. and dont forget All world is not west.

[Murtaza]

Achilles wrote:

blah blah blah

Please take you and your racist views along with you on your journey towards nirvana. We do not need such neo-nazi Hellenes in our forum. If someone has a few info about Greek culture, don't overgeneralize this to whole Turkish society and education system. OK? If you keep this, then you will simply be ignored.

Lol he accuse us for we have few info about Greek culture? He dont ever have any idea of Turkish and eastern culture.

And Infact most Turks know more helenic culture than their Turkish culture. Because of our education system. And because of our wast culture.

[achilles]

Achilles wrote:

blah blah blah

Please take you and your racist views along with you on your journey towards nirvana. We do not need such neo-nazi Hellenes in our forum. If someone has a few info about Greek culture, don't overgeneralize this to whole Turkish society and education system. OK? If you keep this, then you will simply be ignored.

Another fine piece of i-dont-know-what-i-am-talking about...
Neo-Nazi?
In order to back up such a serious accussation you have to do the following:
Carefully define what 'neo-nazi' stands for and then demonstrate IN DETAIL that my posts fullfill the requirements for someone to be called like that.
Until then, you do nothing but tossing shit at the fan hoping that they will reach me. Your characterizations are not only groundless but also pathetic.

And pay attention again to what i have said so far, and dont make the discussion go into neo-nazi circles. I am talking about inferiority of cultures, not the genetic base of people. Clear?

[achilles]

I am attempting to add nothing. Your whole 'thesis' is about the superiority of Greek culture vs Turkish culture. The racist elemement of this thesis is inherent.

Indeed, you have attempted to do so, but lets get over it. The racist element of this thesis MIGHT be inherent, depending on how you interpret it. Apparently, your interpretation does not match what i mean.

you also said

Can anyone name ONE great think that humanity owes to the Ottoman/Turkish culture/'civilization'? Apart from '1000+1 methods to eradicate homo sapiens', that is...

Sarcasm is the making of remarks intended to mock the person referred to (who is normally the person addressed), a situation or thing. It is often used in a humorous manner and expressed through particular vocal intonations. This is often done by simply over-emphasizing the actual statement, or particular words of it.

Obviously you missed the sarcasm and tried to make a story out of it. Dont worry, i am not generalizing.

Of course any interpretation by me that this can be represented as you saying nothing good came out of ottoman heritage or of your 'argument' having a racist element is just active attempts on my part to distort what you have said.

No not necessarily. But it your attempts to paint my posts as 'ultra-generilizing' and 'racist' appeared to be quite 'active'. Anyway, lets get over that one too, if this is also fine with you...

Saying that I have manipulated and distorted you views to highlight that there is a racist element in your thesis and your proof for your thesis is replying in a straighforward manner?

What i meant, was that i didnt try to make an obscure story about anti-Hellenism or 'racism' based on what you said, or my potentially erroneous interpretation of it.

That would be welcome. I would still like to know what you think the point or value is in this whole thesis (of the superiority of Greek culture and inferiority of Turkish culture) for example.

The point of value is exactly the same point of value when someone expressed his/her opinion about anything. Do you express your opinion only when there is a practical, tangible applicability of doing so? I believe not, and frankly i hope not!

Let me make the long story short. I have said what i have said and i am still entitled to that thesis. I spoke of 'cultural superiority' in terms of how much the Hellenic civilization contributed and influenced the biggest part of the world, as opposed to the Ottoman civilization. One does not need to know everything about both cultures in order to express an opinion like that, hell, who does? Yet, the impact of each civilization on today's life and thinking is more or less apparent, to those who are open-minded enough to view it of course. Again, i am not saying that Turkey has not done anything good throughout her history.

'Racial superiority' of 'good and bad genes' have never belonged, and never will, to my way of thinking.

[achilles]

To the west world. If you look east you will see a lot Turks influence. Everypart of east you will see Turks and their culture.
And yes you know small part realy a small part. Because our culture is more more bigger than your greece limited culture. Even I know small part of my culture. Because it is so vast, you can see Turks in china,India,Egypt,Balkains,Middle Asia, Russia, Anatolia. And we didnt steal any history from the others.

Hmmm, whats the word? Exaggeration!

And Democracy, Do you think it is just greeks applyed democrasy (Infact it is aristocracy in greece with all their slaves) from Greece. Turks have their aristocracy in the waste barren lands of middle Asia .We have our Kurultays. We choose our leaders. And we have no slaves. Even Osman and his father Ertugrul ( founder of Ottomans Empire ) choosen by their people.(All people, no one exceptional. No slave)

No definitely democracy is an Ottoman invention brother. As well as the Olympic games. Did you guys also invent the 'Greek fire?'

So you know nothing no small part. You just know how to hate Turks culture.And I dont call this "small part".

whatever...

No you dont know even small part of our history. You just know your history. and dont forget All world is not west.

You forgot to add that Macedonia is not Greek....


God bless the blind...

[magikthrill]

Makes me laugh you won't reconise TRNC but yet you want to take them to the European court for the retriaval of Land!

Can't have your cake and eat it!!

im hoping youre incomprehensive post has to do with the fact that your english is not that good...

[Murtaza]

To the west world. If you look east you will see a lot Turks influence. Everypart of east you will see Turks and their culture.
And yes you know small part realy a small part. Because our culture is more more bigger than your greece limited culture. Even I know small part of my culture. Because it is so vast, you can see Turks in china,India,Egypt,Balkains,Middle Asia, Russia, Anatolia. And we didnt steal any history from the others.

Hmmm, whats the word? Exaggeration!

realy? Turks live in China, Russia, and Middle Asia still.
Do you know where is Taj Mahal? India
Do you know where is Mostar Bridge? Bosnia
Do you know even there was another Turkish empire before Ottoman conquered Egypt.

And Democracy, Do you think it is just greeks applyed democrasy (Infact it is aristocracy in greece with all their slaves) from Greece. Turks have their aristocracy in the waste barren lands of middle Asia .We have our Kurultays. We choose our leaders. And we have no slaves. Even Osman and his father Ertugrul ( founder of Ottomans Empire ) choosen by their people.(All people, no one exceptional. No slave)

No definitely democracy is an Ottoman invention brother. As well as the Olympic games. Did you guys also invent the 'Greek fire?'

No I didnt said Ottoman invented democracy but we had our democracies, Kurultays. Just I said you Osman And Ertugrul Bey choosen by his people. with democratic ways. without slaves.
Do you know why Chengiz Khan army stoped when he died?(We are different from mongolians but we have some common things.)
Because all army have to return their country for choosing a new leader.
Did you disappointment because you are not the only one who applied democracy? Just I said you before you have no knowledge about east. And you dont know "you know nothing". Still insist you know small idea.

So you know nothing no small part. You just know how to hate Turks culture.And I dont call this "small part".

whatever...

whatever...

No you dont know even small part of our history. You just know your history. and dont forget All world is not west.

You forgot to add that Macedonia is not Greek....

No need Macedonians know it already...

God bless the blind...

Yeah realy. So good bless will be beneficial for you.

[achilles]

The truth-loving part of this world is in desperate need for people like you, my poor friend, so stick around. You are just prooving the points of those who know and make the blind more happy

And if want to know anything about Macedonia, ask me, i am a Macedonian myself and willing to help you out with your ignorance as far as my motherland is concerned, among other things.

God bless the blind indeed...

[garbitsch]

What I am trying to say, Murtaza obviously does not know much about Greek history - sorry Murtaza but ancient Macedonia and Troia were all Greek states - but you overgeneralise this to whole Turkish education system. Likewise, you do not have much about OTtoman history and you believe the Turks only commit genocides but nothing else. Besides supporting inferiority of a nation to another is racistic approach. Discriminating peoples in terms of race, ethnic background and religion all means racism. But it's fine if you keep tricking yourself by saying "oh I am not racist but I support inferiority of Turkish nation to Greek nation". This is a very pathetic statement and deserves ZERO respect. If you haven't said that and if you dare to talk about Murtaza by not generalizing his attitude towards whole Turkish society, we would have discussed the Greek history and Turkish history together. We would have enlighetned eachother by doing so.
For your accusing of all Turkish members in this forum with ignorance, then I think you are far more ignorant than everyone else in this forum. I, myself had studied ancient Greek history, read many writings by Greek philosophers, at the same time I have studied Ottoman history from the professors who had even taught in respectful universities such as Harvard, UCLA and Princeton. Again, without knowing each person seperately, you overgeneralise them and this makes you the most biased person vis-a-vis the other forum users....

[garbitsch]

One last comment: achilles represents the notorious approach of "Orientalism", which the West has been following since the Middle Ages to justify their imperialist policies over other peoples in other parts of the world. Since people living in "oriental" territories, they have no capacity to be civilised and the West brought them "civilisation" and "modernity" by colonising them. Yeah, definitely achilles is one fine example to it!