Cyprus-Forum.com

[Viewpoint]

Dont know what world you're living in old man, but most TC's will only accept unification if it means they administer the north (self rule), the turkish migrants stay, turkey maintains some troop presents there and turkey's guarantor power are protected.
I dont see how that translates to TC's "wanting to live in Cyprus as part of the indigenous population at large". When both presidents sit down and start to get into the nitty gritty of a plan it will turn to shit, that is unless the GC's accept what the TC's really want.

So what you are saying BigAl is that, what the TC's want from the GC's is what the TC's have today as a illegal "state", but want to get the GC's to make it a legal state. Just what do the GC's get out of this deal BigAl, other than 7% of their own land.??

Let me know when you see some pigs flying over Cyprus BigAl, so that we can all believe in miracles.

No probs, not that the GC's are in a position to dictate terms to TC's. But my point was the talks will fail, either during the negotiation stage or referendum stage, either way they will fail and that will give the TC's the momentum required to gain recognition.

I think you need to stop being so optimistic and accept reality. After 34 years of making no progress whatsoever, you need to come to grips with the fact that your self imposed isolation will continue for many more years to come. In fact, the "trnc" will never be recognised internationally. The UN resolutions stipulate that your existence is an illegal occupation of a sovereign nation and no nation will ever give you any form of recognition. You should know, being an Australian citizen, that Australia only recognises 1 entity in Cyprus and will always do so. If you do not believe me, then go and ask your local MP for an explanation of Australia's official policy on Cyprus.

Never say never, another failure or rejection of a UN USA and EU supported solution and watch developments.

[miltiades]

Our friend expatkiwi includes Rauf Denktash as a close personal friend....what do you expect from someone that befriends psychotic fanatics?

Like folk who befriend people like Tassos Papadopoulos, or perhaps Nicos Sampson...?

Let's put things into perspective here. I have had a correspondence relationship with Mr. Denktas. I have never met him, but I have enjoyed communicating with him. He presents me his viewpoint and answers questions that I ask him. That aside, I have met the TRNC representative to Los Angeles (Mr. Mustafagolu), and the previous TRNC representative to Washington DC (Mr. Avci). What they all have said to me makes sense: That Greek Cypriots had no intention to treat Turkish Cypriots on an equal basis, that efforts were made to eliminate the Turkish Cypriot presence, and that in the end, Turkey intervened. These were reactions, not instigations. If you're looking to blame anyone for the problems on Cyprus, then blame the Enosists, and Anti-Turkish paramilitaries first.

As a G/C who , along with the overwhelming majority of Cypriots , some 80% , who supported ENOSIS as the end objective of the liberation struggle , I see absolutely nothing wrong in supporting a position that the majority of Cypriots supported. Let me say , as I have said many times before , that supporting ENOSIS was a natural disposition given that we never in our history had the freedom to choose our own destiny. I DO NOT NOW AND NEITHER DOES THE OVERWHELMING MAJORITY OF G/Cs SUPPORT ENOSIS.
You appear to be utterly blind in recognising that 80% of CYPRIOTS HAD EVERY RIGHT TO DEMAND ENOSIS. We had no other motivational spirit but the spirit of ENOSIS. Now we have , we are an independent nation , at least part of our island is , we are a full European member and we are prosperous which is more that one can say about the occupied by Turkey part of Cyprus. The entire world recognises the ROC as the ONLY legitimate authority in Cyprus.
Given the fact that we are now perhaps closer to a solution than ever before its about time that the stupidity, in political terms , that Turkey is exhibiting in her insistence that the ROC is not recognised by her ONLY - BUT WHAT DOES ONE EXPECT FROM A NATION THAT IS DEBATING ENDLESLY THE WEARING OR NOT OF A SCARF !!- and begin to accept that apart from Turkey there are more than 200 nations on this planet or does she perhaps also beleive that just as on Turk is worth 1000 non Turks so does one Turkish nation worth all others ??
As Turkey struggles internally with her own inadequacies , her own ludicrous identity crises then perhaps she ought to realize that she will never be allowed to remain on European ground for ever. As for Mr Plonker BigAl with his bravado talk let him be aware that it is his type that have been the cause of the Cypriot conflict , the fanatics and irresponsible G/Cs and T/Cs with their faces embedded deep up the arses of their respective motherlands. Let these NON CYPRIOTS realise that this island with a history of 10 thousand years belongs to the true Cypriots . They can of course assimilate totaly with their motherlands , easy and cheap just a one way ticket out of this island , my country not theirs.

Take it easy old man, you're telling us that you supported Enosis because at the time you had a natural disposition to it, let me tell you now old man, i, along with thousands of other TC's do not want to live with GC's, be governed by them or have anything to do with them. We would rather become an island belonging to the Republic of Turkey....lets just call it our "natural disposition".
By supporting Enosis you supported the murder of TC civilians and now you want us to live with you??? wake up old man

You are in the minority Boy , most T/Cs want to live in Cyprus as part of the indigenous population at large. You and the likes of you ARE NOT Cypriots.
Turkeys occupation of a part of Cyprus will come to an end , Europe and the T/Cs will see to it . You and the rest of foreigners will just have to accept it or go suck Turkeys arse.

Dont know what world you're living in old man, but most TC's will only accept unification if it means they administer the north (self rule), the turkish migrants stay, turkey maintains some troop presents there and turkey's guarantor power are protected.
I dont see how that translates to TC's "wanting to live in Cyprus as part of the indigenous population at large". When both presidents sit down and start to get into the nitty gritty of a plan it will turn to shit, that is unless the GC's accept what the TC's really want.

You are making one big mistake Boy , the T/Cs are fed up to the teeth with the likes of you , they want to live in Cyprus as free people NOT under the occupation of Turkey. Mr Talat understands this but has his hand tied by Turkey .
Those that want things to remain as they are the very people that will suffer greatly financially when a solution is found . You do not represent the majority of T/Cs and neither do you have the foresight and intelligence to comprehend that this little island , all of it , is now a part of Europe and Europe ain't going to sit back and accept a part of its territory under foreign occupation.
Just remember that you and your type ARE THE FANATICS , the very people that are detested by your average decent Cypriot .

[miltiades]

Dont know what world you're living in old man, but most TC's will only accept unification if it means they administer the north (self rule), the turkish migrants stay, turkey maintains some troop presents there and turkey's guarantor power are protected.
I dont see how that translates to TC's "wanting to live in Cyprus as part of the indigenous population at large". When both presidents sit down and start to get into the nitty gritty of a plan it will turn to shit, that is unless the GC's accept what the TC's really want.

So what you are saying BigAl is that, what the TC's want from the GC's is what the TC's have today as a illegal "state", but want to get the GC's to make it a legal state. Just what do the GC's get out of this deal BigAl, other than 7% of their own land.??

Let me know when you see some pigs flying over Cyprus BigAl, so that we can all believe in miracles.

No probs, not that the GC's are in a position to dictate terms to TC's. But my point was the talks will fail, either during the negotiation stage or referendum stage, either way they will fail and that will give the TC's the momentum required to gain recognition.

Recognition........ NO, just because the talks collapse. Any idiot can make the talks fail if they thought they can get recognition at the end of it. This was a warning given to the GC's in 2004, as well as economic benefits to the TC's from the EU, and yet, it did not happen when the GC's said NO to the Annan Plan.

One thing you forget is, the GC's do control the legality of the north being part of Cyprus, a EU member, and the British have already said in the memorandum that Brown signed a month ago, that Cyprus can only remain as ONE COUNTRY and no other EU members are going to go against one of it's own, and the USA will not go against the UK and the EU, not to mention all other UN resolutions that will not allow a recognition to the north, and Russia will see to it, if in the future any new "trnc" recognition proposals are put in front of the UN security counsel will not pass.

The only thing the TC's have in the north in their favour at the moment, is the 40,000 Turkish Army. You throw in the RoC's EU veto vote over Turkey's EU acceptance plans, and that pretty much leaves the TC's with nothing to negotiate with, other than a Fair and Just peace for all Cypriots in a True Democracy under True Federation. Anything else, the answer will once again be a NO from the GC's, assuming of course, that there even be a referendum, because, I can assure you, that Christofias is not going to agree to put a referendum up for a vote, unless he can get a YES vote from the GC's, no matter what Talat does with the TC's. This is why Christofias, very cleverly, did not agree on any time frames as to when these talks end and a vote is taken. I would say, that it is up to the TC's to forget about the "pie in the sky dream" what the Annan Plan gave them, and start thinking as a Cypriot and find a common ground with the GC's and don't worry about what Turkey or the settlers want.

Absolutely 100% correct . You and I Kikapu as well as thousands of other true Cypriots share a viable and a realistic approach to the Cyprob.
This Monday gone , I had lunch at Ais Yorkies by the sea just past Kyrenia with 3 Cypriots who all believe that we can live and share Cyprus as one people . Two I had met previously the other , a lecturer , had just met . It pleases me beyond imagination that there are so many Cypriots who are prepared to accept that we can live together .
The restaurateur was a Turkish Cypriot who along with his wife and two little children welcomed us and provided us with a superb lunch. Ordinary Cypriot folk who want nothing more than what you and I want .

[Viewpoint]

Dont know what world you're living in old man, but most TC's will only accept unification if it means they administer the north (self rule), the turkish migrants stay, turkey maintains some troop presents there and turkey's guarantor power are protected.
I dont see how that translates to TC's "wanting to live in Cyprus as part of the indigenous population at large". When both presidents sit down and start to get into the nitty gritty of a plan it will turn to shit, that is unless the GC's accept what the TC's really want.

So what you are saying BigAl is that, what the TC's want from the GC's is what the TC's have today as a illegal "state", but want to get the GC's to make it a legal state. Just what do the GC's get out of this deal BigAl, other than 7% of their own land.??

Let me know when you see some pigs flying over Cyprus BigAl, so that we can all believe in miracles.

No probs, not that the GC's are in a position to dictate terms to TC's. But my point was the talks will fail, either during the negotiation stage or referendum stage, either way they will fail and that will give the TC's the momentum required to gain recognition.

Recognition........ NO, just because the talks collapse. Any idiot can make the talks fail if they thought they can get recognition at the end of it. This was a warning given to the GC's in 2004, as well as economic benefits to the TC's from the EU, and yet, it did not happen when the GC's said NO to the Annan Plan.

One thing you forget is, the GC's do control the legality of the north being part of Cyprus, a EU member, and the British have already said in the memorandum that Brown signed a month ago, that Cyprus can only remain as ONE COUNTRY and no other EU members are going to go against one of it's own, and the USA will not go against the UK and the EU, not to mention all other UN resolutions that will not allow a recognition to the north, and Russia will see to it, if in the future any new "trnc" recognition proposals are put in front of the UN security counsel will not pass.

The only thing the TC's have in the north in their favour at the moment, is the 40,000 Turkish Army. You throw in the RoC's EU veto vote over Turkey's EU acceptance plans, and that pretty much leaves the TC's with nothing to negotiate with, other than a Fair and Just peace for all Cypriots in a True Democracy under True Federation. Anything else, the answer will once again be a NO from the GC's, assuming of course, that there even be a referendum, because, I can assure you, that Christofias is not going to agree to put a referendum up for a vote, unless he can get a YES vote from the GC's, no matter what Talat does with the TC's. This is why Christofias, very cleverly, did not agree on any time frames as to when these talks end and a vote is taken. I would say, that it is up to the TC's to forget about the "pie in the sky dream" what the Annan Plan gave them, and start thinking as a Cypriot and find a common ground with the GC's and don't worry about what Turkey or the settlers want.

Absolutely 100% correct . You and I Kikapu as well as thousands of other true Cypriots share a viable and a realistic approach to the Cyprob.
This Monday gone , I had lunch at Ais Yorkies by the sea just past Kyrenia with 3 Cypriots who all believe that we can live and share Cyprus as one people . Two I had met previously the other , a lecturer , had just met . It pleases me beyond imagination that there are so many Cypriots who are prepared to accept that we can live together .
The restaurateur was a Turkish Cypriot who along with his wife and two little children welcomed us and provided us with a superb lunch. Ordinary Cypriot folk who want nothing more than what you and I want .

Never forget we to have the right to say No to anything we do feel comfortable with and we are not afraid to use it, there are 2 sides to these negotiations and trying to make the GCs say yes will push the TCs towards a no, compromise is the key word neither side will get 100% of their demands.

[miltiades]

How right you are VP , perhaps I can meet you next time Im in Cyprus !!

[Viewpoint]

How right you are VP , perhaps I can meet you next time Im in Cyprus !!

You never know you may have already met me.

[zan]

Has anyone got pictures of the people protesting??? I am interested to nsee how many turned up with those Greek orthodox type beards that I saw in London.

[miltiades]

How right you are VP , perhaps I can meet you next time Im in Cyprus !!

You never know you may have already met me.

Surely not VP !!

[Viewpoint]

How right you are VP , perhaps I can meet you next time Im in Cyprus !!

You never know you may have already met me.

Surely not VP !!

I have met many GCs.