Cyprus-Forum.com

[Piratis]

enough said!

[PEACE]

You are caputilating to us with fifth Annan Plan?

In order to say "YES" to Annan Plan which ones you want?

1)All Turkish troops drown out?

2)All settelers have to be send back? or 45.000 can stay?

3)Turkey,Greece and England musn't be quarantors of Cyprus?

4)All refugees should return to North ?

5)All refugees of 1974 should take their properties completely ? This should be not in a time period but immediately after solution day?

6)There shouldn't be any limitations about residence and political rights in Turkish Cypriot State?

7)Seneta should be built up among cypriot senators but not Turkish Cypriot senators and Greek Cypriot Senators which will be 24-24?

There should be East Germany style unification ?

9)Turkish Cypriots shouldn't have veto power in any subject? or in important subjects they can ?

10)Each state's economy should be seperated?


or there is something i forgot to write Piratis?

[PEACE]

or simply you expect from us to say "Yes,we accept being minority in political rights !So minority rights are enough(or they are too much even?) to us.Let's make peace."

[/b]

[mehmet]

Ok, put some publicity so we can all read and make up our own minds. Exactly what facts are you disputing and let us see what the alternative points of view are. Just to say 'I don't believe' is not enough.

[Piratis]

1)All Turkish troops drown out?

Yes

2)All settelers have to be send back? or 45.000 can stay?

Only those that (by today) are married with T/C or where born here.

3)Turkey,Greece and England musn't be quarantors of Cyprus?

Preferably no, the EU and UN should be. But even if they are, for any action to be taken all 3 of them should agree.

4)All refugees should return to North ?

Not all refugees want to return. Actually a minority among them is willing to return under T/C administration. Those that want should be allowed, but a limit can be put for a some time.

5)All refugees of 1974 should take their properties completely ? This should be not in a time period but immediately after solution day?

Some time is needed. Immediately is not feasible. If they do not take it all, they should be compensated for the rest.

6)There shouldn't be any limitations about residence and political rights in Turkish Cypriot State?

It depends on what you mean "residence" is this what Annan calls "citizenship" or you mean something else?

7)Seneta should be built up among cypriot senators but not Turkish Cypriot senators and Greek Cypriot Senators which will be 24-24?

Senators can be 24-24, but this should not allow for indirect veto on everything.

8)There should be East Germany style unification ?

We are not East Germany.

9)Turkish Cypriots shouldn't have veto power in any subject? or in important subjects they can ?

Important subjects, but not everything.

10)Each state's economy should be seperated?

No.

[Piratis]

Why you don't answer your own questions, always keeping in ming what can be acceptable, not necessarily optimal?

[PEACE]

Only those that (by today) are married with T/C or where born here.

What about their human rights? A setteler that lived here for 30 years,had children here...And you show them the door!? Also remember they are about 41.000 ! If they reject the plan its so hard to be accepted by tc side!

Some time is needed. Immediately is not feasible. If they do not take it all, they should be compensated for the rest.

This is Annan Plan!

It depends on what you mean "residence" is this what Annan calls "citizenship" or you mean something else?

citizenship & using political rights!

Important subjects, but not everything.

For example subject that are releated with constituent state sovereignty or identity of tcs?

[Piratis]

What about their human rights? A setteler that lived here for 30 years,had children here...And you show them the door!? Also remember they are about 41.000 ! If they reject the plan its so hard to be accepted by tc side!

The settlers are illegal here. Turkey by bringing them here knew it was but what they cared about is Turkey's strategic interests and not the future human rights of some people.

Now you say that without them a plan can not be accepted by TC side because they will vote against it. This is one of the reasons why we don't want them here. Because the same way they can control you now, they will be able to control the whole Cyprus.

So both TC and GC should insist that those people are illegal and that only TC should vote and not them.

This is Annan Plan!

I never said that everything in Annan plan is wrong. The plan we want will not be worst for you than the Annan plan. It will be worst for Turkey and UK, and better for GC, but not worst for TC (and in some cases it will even be better for TC also).

citizenship & using political rights!

I disagree that component states should have their own citizenships. But I agree that we could arrange it in such way that TC are always the majority in the TC component state government. (and the GC in the GC state)

For example subject that are releated with constituent state sovereignty or identity of tcs?

I am not sure what you mean by "constituent state sovereignty". If you mean "sovereignty" as independence then this is not the case since in federations states are not independent. But if you mean about the autonomy that TC and GC can have within their states then yes. This should be made clear in the constitution and to change the constitution both sides should agree.

Other important matters can be joining alliances (e.g. NATO), going to war (if we have army to do this), and other things we can agree.

[MicAtCyp]

Hi,Γεια,Merhaba,
Just joined this forum.
Sad day today, aint't it? I mean we cannot vote the long desired yes.
Thats how the Anglo Amaricans screwed up the Anan Plan.....

[mehmet]

Thats how the Anglo Amaricans screwed up the Anan Plan.....[/quote]

Keep blaming the foreigners eh? That's how to change the future? Cypriot's need to take responsibility for their own failures instead of forever claiming to be victims. Papadpopoulos and Denktas had the opportunity to take charge of the talks. They prefer to let Greeks, Turks form the mainland and the UN finish a process they had main responsibility. Now they are both united in wanting referundum to fail. One says the other gains too much, the other says the other gains too much.

When, as I expect Plan fails, let's see what Papadopoulos and Denktas come up with as an alternative. Let's see whether as leaders they take responsibility for failure of Plan and see what alternative is on offer.

By the way, when you are in EU you will have plenty of htings to blame foreigners for. Did you think when you joined you would not give up soverienty anmd decision making to Brussels? You may not want to share the island with the Turkish Cypriots, that's your choice. You will have to share your part with the rest of EU. That's what being part of it is about.