Cyprus-Forum.com

[Brittania]

double..

Thats no Ballerina - thats a whirling Dervish and its DENIZ not Denise!!!

who are you? Her mother?

No!! I am her Grandfather of course

Tess, better be gentle with Tania. I have come to the conclusion she cannot read. Hence previous replies to her posts.

Take it easy Nureyev. I'm only playing with ya.

Can someone answer my question? When did the Greeks arrive to the island?

[halil]

double..

Thats no Ballerina - thats a whirling Dervish and its DENIZ not Denise!!!

who are you? Her mother?

No!! I am her Grandfather of course

Tess, better be gentle with Tania. I have come to the conclusion she cannot read. Hence previous replies to her posts.

Take it easy Nureyev. I'm only playing with ya.

Can someone answer my question? When did the Greeks arrive to the island?

never They are just looking from away ....... away from Cyprus 600 miles

[Tim Drayton]

I was challenged on another thread to back up my claim that there exists a distinct Turkish Cypriot culture.

I thought that this was such a broad topic that it deserved a thread of its own. I also didn't feel that I was the best qualified person to respond so I have waited to see what others have to say.

Well, I would now like to add some thoughts of my own.

I have no doubt that there exists a unique Turkish Cypriot culture. Anybody who is familiar with both mainland Turks and Turkish Cypriots is well aware of the difference. Just as everybody who knows, say, the Americans and the British realises that there are cultural differences between the two. However, how do you actually qualify and quantify this cultural difference that one so easily perceives viscerally? Culture manifests itself in so many ways: forms of dress, way of speaking, mannerisms, rules of social interaction, attitudes ... The list is never ending. It would take a book to do justice to this question.

Four areas immediately come to my mind where there are clear cultural differences between mainland Turks and Turkish Cypriots:

1 Language
Language and culture are considered to be closely related to one another. The dialect of Turkish traditionally spoken by Turkish Cypriots differs greatly from standard Turkish. So much so that some would argue that it is a separate language in its own right. It has only recently occured to me that this linguistic divergence does not only apply to informal language. Turkish Cypriot legal language uses quite a few terms which are not used in Turkey: some of these are anachronyms which have dropped out of use in Turkey itself while others, I think, are uniquely Cypriot. The existence of a very distinctive language is strong evidence in favour of a separate culture.

2 Traditional food, drink, music, dance, story-telling
As far as the above are concerned, I see no difference whatsoever between the two communities in Cyprus. These are all different from what you will find in Turkey. This is all strong evidence that over the milenia Turkish Cypriots integrated into a wider Cypriot culture.

3 Religion
The thing that most strikes mainland Turks who come to the north of Cyprus is that religion plays virtually no role whatsoever in the daily lives of Turkish Cypriots. The exact reverse applies in Turkey. One consequence of this was the way that the Turkish Cypriot community totally embraced the Kemalist reforms following the founding of the Turkish Republic. Here we are talking about a direct influence from the "motherland", but even so the ready acceptance that Kemalism found among Turkish Cypriots, when the same ideology met with considerable opposition among certain sections of Turkish society, points to the existence of a different cultural environment which predisposed people to welcome modernisation with open arms. There is stark evidence of this difference when you compare the fight currently going on in Turkey between secularists and Islamists with the kind of debate which characterises Turkish Cypriot political life. Secularism is not an issue in among the latter community: Turkish Cypriot society is virtually 100% secular.

4. Social and private space
Turkish Cypriots are far more reserved than mainland Turks. They are less likely to strike up casual conversations with strangers. It takes longer to get to know them, although they often turn out to be more sincere and genuine when you do.
Mainland Turks' concept of "social space", in the sense that this term is used by sociologists, is narrower. People stand closer together when speaking and are also much more tactile. I have yet to see two Turkish Cypriot men kiss each other on the cheeks when meeting. Turkish Cypriots shake hands less, too.
I also notice a much greater respect for concepts of privacy and individualism among Turkish Cypriots. Mainland Turkish society is very normative and peer pressures to conform is strong. Turkish Cypriots have more acceptance of deviance within certain boundaries. In Cyprus, people have more of a private life and worry less about what is going on behind closed doors.
Incidentally, I find the above attributes to be very British, and wonder if this is the result of influence by the former colonial power.
For reasons that are probably related to the above, I find that Turkish Cypriots are generally more broad minded and open to fresh ideas. Disagreements are far more likely to be settled verbally and I have never seen Turkish Cypriots brawling in the street in the way that from time to time you see Turks in the mainland doing.

I will stop there. I hope people can accept the above as being the genuine comments of an outside observer, who may be mistaken in some of his perceptions. I hope I have given no offence.

[tessintrnc]

Thank you Tim that was very interesting. I was surprised myself by the differences in Turkish and Turkish Cyp language. My teacher always tells us both ways and I feel quite priviliged to be learning such a unique dialect known really by only a few.
Tess

[denizaksulu]

Thank you Tim that was very interesting. I was surprised myself by the differences in Turkish and Turkish Cyp language. My teacher always tells us both ways and I feel quite priviliged to be learning such a unique dialect known really by only a few.
Tess

I find it odd that I am learning a lot from Tim. He is very useful esp with regards tou our language.

Thanks Tim........If not already I declare you and honorary Cypriote.

[Oracle]

Thank you Tim for the waffle thus proving beyond all reasonable doubt there is no unique Turkish or by inference Turkish Cypriot culture other than the elements which have rubbed off through time from their Greek encounters ... and of course all those things they have "adapted" as their own from all the ethnic groups they have usurped along the way.

I for one will not miss them one iota.

[Oracle]

This on the other hand, whilst we are on the subject of culture is most enlightening ...

Cultural habits of chimps


A chimp in West Africa makes a tool to prepare food

By BBC News Online's Helen Briggs
Primate experts have found more evidence that chimpanzees, like humans, show cultural diversity.


Knowing that the chimpanzee is an endangered species is an even greater spur to pressing on with our studies

William McGrew, Miami University, Ohio
They say chimps living in different parts of Africa have developed distinct customs.

Habits such as grooming, and the use of stone and wooden tools, vary among nine populations in the wild.

Some chimps inspect each other for parasites, flick the bugs on to leaves, then inspect or kill them. However their neighbours show quite different behaviour, simply squashing the parasites on their forearms.

The research is the second stage of the Chimpanzee Cultures Project, an international study of chimps in Africa.


Other apes, such as the orang-utan, show cultural diversity

The project is being co-ordinated at the University of St Andrews, Scotland.

"Co-operation with the best field researchers on chimpanzees, from Europe, Japan and America, is revealing a rich diversity of cultural variation in our nearest living relatives," said William McGrew of Miami University, Ohio, US, who is spending the summer with the Scottish team.

"Knowing that the chimpanzee is an endangered species is an even greater spur to pressing on with our studies," he added.

Chimp technology

Professor McGrew said the team was starting to see new patterns of chimpanzee behaviour emerging.

This ranged from day-to-day activities like gathering food to social organisation, relationships, and the use of simple technology.

Experts have recorded over 40 different types of stone tool use in chimps. In West Africa, apes at several locations use wood or stone tools to crack nuts to feed on the kernels. In East Africa, although nuts are available, chimps don't eat them.

"We continue to be surprised at the extent of chimpanzee elementary technology," Professor McGrew told BBC News Online.

He said the differences from one population to another "cannot be accounted for either by genetic make-up or environmental influences".

"These sorts of differences seem to be the sorts of things that if they occurred in human beings we would call them traditions," he said.

There is evidence that other apes, such as gorillas and orang-utans, show cultural differences, as well as creatures such as whales and dolphins.

Chimp culture could help us understand the evolutionary origins of human culture, Professor McGrew said.

[Tim Drayton]

Thank you Tim that was very interesting. I was surprised myself by the differences in Turkish and Turkish Cyp language. My teacher always tells us both ways and I feel quite priviliged to be learning such a unique dialect known really by only a few.
Tess

I find it odd that I am learning a lot from Tim. He is very useful esp with regards tou our language.

Thanks Tim........If not already I declare you and honorary Cypriote.

I may learn to understand you *******s yet.

[Kikapu]

Here is something Turkish men do in Turkey that we Turkish Cypriots men would not dare to do anywhere, which is men walking together arm in arm. Nothing Gay about it, it's just what they do in public walking along, specially in small villages. It was the most uncomfortable feeling for me when some male friends put their arms in mine while walking with other friends. This is a man who has lived in the "Gay Capital" of the world for 25 years, San Francisco saying this.!

Does the settlers do this in the north, and if so, has the TC men caught up with the "new fashion" yet..!!

[Oracle]

Here is something Turkish men do in Turkey that we Turkish Cypriots men would not dare to do anywhere, which is men walking together arm in arm. Nothing Gay about it, it's just what they do in public walking along, specially in small villages. It was the most uncomfortable feeling for me when some male friends put their arms in mine while walking with other friends. This is a man who has lived in the "Gay Capital" of the world for 25 years, San Francisco saying this.!

Does the settlers do this in the north, and if so, has the TC men caught up with the "new fashion" yet..!!

There are some Egyptian migrant workers in our village ... men in their 20's and 30's ... and most evenings they walk hand in hand along the beach as the sun sets ...

It looks very ....... "OK" ....