Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oracle]

Pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and start all over again

That's life.

So what you are saying is take off your life jacket and hope for the best.

Some of us have learnt to swim .....

Gives you a better chance of pushing us under, so we need that life jacket more than ever.

Are you incapable of learning to swim? ... or are you made of stone and will just sink regardless

[Viewpoint]

Pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and start all over again

That's life.

So what you are saying is take off your life jacket and hope for the best.

Some of us have learnt to swim .....

Gives you a better chance of pushing us under, so we need that life jacket more than ever.

Are you incapable of learning to swim? ... or are you made of stone and will just sink regardless

Forget it, you are a waste of time and do not deserve an answer.

[Oracle]

Pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and start all over again

That's life.

So what you are saying is take off your life jacket and hope for the best.

Some of us have learnt to swim .....

Gives you a better chance of pushing us under, so we need that life jacket more than ever.

Are you incapable of learning to swim? ... or are you made of stone and will just sink regardless

Forget it, you are a waste of time and do not deserve an answer.

Good ... pack up and leave.

But don't forget your life jacket, in case the boat back to Turkey should sink with all those troops and settlers returning too!

[Bananiot]

Kikapu, I understand that there are elements of confederation in the Annan plan. However, you are wrong to assume that it was a partition plan.

Sure, me too would be over the moon, if a different solution was there for grabs. You will have to convince me though that it is practically possible and politically feasible to go for it. In the past, every time we ventured with the desirable we badly burnt our fingers. Only our worst enemy would advise us to go for the desirable. On the other hand, waiting for the balance of power to change would almost certainly result in the cementing of the current situation and of course, because the balance will change not in our favour, things on the ground would get much worse.

P.S. By the way, we get two months of holidays not three, but I still do not get it why people constantly dwell on my profession. No other member of the forum has had his job scutinised so much as mine. Not so long ago I was even told that I should be grateful I do not get the sack for writing against Papadopoulos. The very same people that come here pretending to be the guardians of democratic rights have proven that they can not stomach the most basic of democratic principles, the right to have a different opinion!

Kikapu, if we won the war in 1974, there would be not a Turkish soul left on the island now. I know these people, only too well.

[Nikitas]

Bananiot says:

"I cannot understand your territory shouts. Perhaps I did not read your earlier posts on this. Are you saying that even partition can be an option if the division of territory is fair?"

As for partition being an option, it is the ONLY option described by the term BIZONAL and anyone who cannot see this is fooling himself. So let us deal with the BIZONAL reality for what it is, free of all the other dressing of supposedly Federal and Bicommunal. Once you have a rotating presidency and the right of a minimum of 50 000 settlers to remain as CITIZENS of the new state there is NO Federation and no Bicommunality.

Confusing the territorial issue and making it part of the general give and take, ie with Federation we can accept less territory, while with Confederatin we want more, etc is nonsense. The territorial settlement is at the root of the problem and, much more important, at the root of the future course. If you doubt this just think of the scenario of the British vacating the Dhekelia base afer a solution is reached. Or worse, if they vacate the Akrotiri base after a solution is reached. Turkey has already indicated that it wants part of the bases (for the TCs of course!).

And think of this Bananiot: with a fair territorial agreement, the settler problem is mostly solved and prevented in the future. And this is what is VITAL to the survival of the GC community in Cyprus.

[DT.]

Talat, on a number of occasions, has said that he is not interested in virgin birth. He was venomously attacked by the right in both Cyprus and Turkey and we have to support him as much as we can, rather than call him a puppet. Remember, if there is no solution by next year at the latest, Talat will most likely lose the elections and we will be talking with Ertogruroglu.

We can not have the ideal conditions we want but we should be able to make the best with the existing state of affairs, which can not get better after Talat has gone. It will be to our detriment if we do not.

I think Simon should understand that Greek Cypriots will never agree to partition and if some are getting friendly with the idea this is basically because of the brainwashing of Papadopoulos.

Remember also that the Turkish army were on stand by in case the Annan Plan got through to bring Erdogan down and nullify the plan which they considered as disastrous for the “TRNC” and Turkey. Denktash and Eroglu together with the deep state in Turkey fought hard to prevent solution in 2004 and only reverted to plan B when Papadopoulos told them straight that he would reject the plan.
I have said on many occasions that the Annan plan left things to be desired and it could have been negotiated to a better end. Yet, because life is about options, we should have accepted it because what is installed for us could be very painful, unless of course, like the Archbishop and his fanatical right wing friends, one thinks that partition is not to be a worrying development.

You still support something which you yourself admit Turkey would have gone back on its word for. Had we all done what you and your intellectual elite dictate for us poor plebs we would now be a constituent statelet with 63% territory neighbouring another constituent statelet that has withdrwn from the federation of Cyprus. Soon as the Republic of Cyprus erased itself me and you would now be talking about the political and legal limbo that the progressives of this island had convinced us to vote for.

Remeber Bananiot, you admit it yourself that turkey would renege on its word.

[Bananiot]

So what DT? Are you saying that we should not talk with Turkey because they are not trustwothy? Can you suggest what else we do?

[DT.]

So what DT? Are you saying that we should not talk with Turkey because they are not trustwothy? Can you suggest what else we do?

I'll ignore the fact that you brush off a complete and utter disaster for Cyprus as a simple "so what".

Thats not what I;m saying at all. ALl I'm saying is that when negotiating with Turkey you need to pretend that they will renege on the deal no matter what. This will help you structure a deal where if things fall apart we are not left holding the keys to a town hall instead of a presidential palace.

This means staying firm on issues such as virgin birth and territory, things that you are too quick to brush off in your haste to accept the first deal that hits us in the face. Because when turkey actually carries out what you said it nearly did with the Annan Plan then we will be positioned to cope with the new circumstances a lot better.

Your recklessness with the way you formulate your opinions about our country really concerns me.

[Bananiot]

Don't be too concerned DT because there was a clause in the Annan Plan that took care of exactly what you are saying. So, had Turkey gone back on her word it would have been as you were before signing. Therefore, we should be frank and admit that what we do not like is not the Annan plan itself but the philosophy behind it. BBF is our only chance to find a solution and in my eyes reckless people are those that do not see this simple plain truth. And, you can stop patronising me because I can formulate my opinions in any way I like. The same applies to you and every body else, but I will not call you names for it.

[pantheman]

So what DT? Are you saying that we should not talk with Turkey because they are not trustwothy? Can you suggest what else we do?

OMG! I cannot believe you just said that. You openly admit that we are dealing with dirty double crossing low lifes who have no intention of keeping there side of the bargain and thats OK for you. Bloody hell Bananiot, you are a danger to society, you need locking up.

What sort of negotiations do you expect to have with them then? perhaps we shouldn't even nogotiate, just let them tell us what they want and 'go with the flow' are you for real??

If you have to ask this questions :

Are you saying that we should not talk with Turkey because they are not trustwothy?

then you are a bigger prat than I took you for, god help us all!

I would certainly like to hear what your mate Milti has to say about this, since he gives you so much credit for being a 'what does he call it? 'A True Cypriot' I think he may now need to reconsider.

Bananiot you cannot be for real re, surely?