Cyprus-Forum.com

[Murtaza]

I always think my bad english is simply the product of a mis-spent youth

[suetoniuspaulinus]

I always think my bad english is simply the product of a mis-spent youth

Mr Murtaza

This may be quite true. but you manage very effectively, nonetheless, to convey meaning with honesty and integrity. This IS communication

[garbitsch]

Mr garbitsch

Yes I can see this now

I managed to add the letter "e" to my previous post and I'm more confusedthan ever. However, this too will pass.

As for my English I'm afraid it is simply the product of a mis-spent youth.

I under stand you very well Mr garbitsch. Thank you.

Lemmi guess... born in Cyprus and then moved to UK or born in UK and later came back to Cyprus. by mis-spent youth I reckon you mean the war in Cyprus. am i right?

[suetoniuspaulinus]

Mr garbitsch

Yes I can see this now

I managed to add the letter "e" to my previous post and I'm more confusedthan ever. However, this too will pass.

As for my English I'm afraid it is simply the product of a mis-spent youth.

I under stand you very well Mr garbitsch. Thank you.

Lemmi guess... born in Cyprus and then moved to UK or born in UK and later came back to Cyprus. by mis-spent youth I reckon you mean the war in Cyprus. am i right?

Mr garbitsch

Not exactly sir

Neither born in UK or Cyprus but in another country within Her Majesty's Commonwealth.

In 74 I was living in London and a good school friend of mine was a GC, who was flown out of Cyprus at that time in an RAF Hercules ( With Anthony Valentine ).

My roots are Turkish. my father was born in Cyprus, and I live here now.

[suetoniuspaulinus]

However

Back to the point

Settlor Citizens Rights re Annan VI

Thoughts?

[Murtaza]

Mr garbitsch

Yes I can see this now

I managed to add the letter "e" to my previous post and I'm more confusedthan ever. However, this too will pass.

As for my English I'm afraid it is simply the product of a mis-spent youth.

I under stand you very well Mr garbitsch. Thank you.

Lemmi guess... born in Cyprus and then moved to UK or born in UK and later came back to Cyprus. by mis-spent youth I reckon you mean the war in Cyprus. am i right?

Mr garbitsch

Not exactly sir

Neither born in UK or Cyprus but in another country within Her Majesty's Commonwealth.

In 74 I was living in London and a good school friend of mine was a GC, who was flown out of Cyprus at that time in an RAF Hercules ( With Anthony Valentine ).

My roots are Turkish. my father was born in Cyprus, and I live here now.

Mr suetoniuspaulinus

Which country did you born? (If you dont mind)
And I will just want to ask same question.
Problem with settlers is just property holdings? Or are there other problems too?

I dont think you mis-spent your youth.
You are completly educated yourself.

[Kifeas]

Kifeas, in my absence Erolz just said exactly what I believe also. Yes, those who settled in the years following the invasion and those who followed during the 1980s to become TRNC citizens should stay... it may be unpalatable for GCs, but to forcibly expel them from their home (which Cyprus now is), would be to violate their rights in the same way that GC rights were violated during the invasion. These people did not come as agents of Turkey, they came because of promises of a better life and were encouraged by the TRNC leaders to do so. If anyone should be blamed, it is the government leaders, not them.

I also agree with Erolz on the property issue. Where this people are in possession of GC owned property, yes, they should be moved on to new accommodation. But this movement cannot be imposed immediately, there must be suitable and equivalent property found.

You've got to see both sides Kifeas, these aren't merely settlers, they are human beings like you and me. If you'd been born a Turk in northern Anatolia and someone had come to you with promises of a job, land and a house, wouldn't you have snatched their arm off? I think so. We can't arbitrarily generalise and say that all settlers are bad and aim at the Turkification of the island. As fully-fledged Cypriot citizens (I feel that if they are granted citizenship, they should abandon their Turkish passports as a sign of this), they could potentially contribute greatly to the economy and social structure of the island, ultimately becoming, as many of their children have, Cypriots rather than Turks.

Cannedmoose,

Thanks for the educational counselling regarding treatment of humans.

I have a hypothetical question to make.
Should Turkey had allowed 500,000 people from Anatolia to settle in Cyprus during all these 30 years, would you still have the same opinion, assuming that whatever incentive given to them would not convince them to live Cyprus?

The same question extends to Erol for answering as well.

[cannedmoose]

I have a hypothetical question to make.
Should Turkey had allowed 500,000 people from Anatolia to settle in Cyprus during all these 30 years, would you still have the same opinion, assuming that whatever incentive given to them would not convince them to live Cyprus?

It's a good question and one that I'm struggling with... but ultimately the same argument counts and the argument for their non-removal is even greater given the vast numbers involved...

Let me say this... I fundamentally disagree with the policy that both the Turkish governments and TRNC have pursued in importing citizens from the mainland, rather than trying to improve the situation of the TCs, who have been forced en masse to emigrate in order to improve their economic lot. Had resources instead been channelled into developing the infrastructure and economic opportunities available to TCs, the differential between north and south would not be so great AND I doubt GCs would be so perturbed about measures to assist them.

However, as of today, we aren't faced with hypothetical, we are faced with the real prospect of the forced repatriation of tens of thousands of people should a solution along current lines be found. I've already explained my problem with this, and I continue to stand by what I said.

[suetoniuspaulinus]

Mr Murtaza

For more detailed personal information either e-mail me or PM me.

The Settlers are not a major problem to the TC's.They are however a major problem for the GC's since these are "New Citizens" and so any future agreement will have to take into account the rights of these citizens.

Let me put it another way. You will have seen posts where 18% and 82% are being used because this was apparently the distribution of population in 60's and so we see some GC's posting that in any future agreement that the amount of land under TC control should only be 18%. Obviously these New Citizens upset this arithmetic equation in favour of the TC's

We now compare something like 200.000 to 650.000. I am not sure of the exact figures but even if it were 200k to 800k then the proportion would be something like 20%, For this reason they are a problem for GC's

In the north the "problem" is a social one. One of differing cultures and view points. The Settlers are more right wing and tend to be influenced by Turkey much more. Some still feel Turkish rather than Cypriot.

I'm not sure you can blame them since they are exploited and tend to be in the lower income bracket. Please understand this is how I see it, and I am generalising. Always a dangerous thing to do.

I hope that makes things a little clearer for you.

[suetoniuspaulinus]

I have a hypothetical question to make.
Should Turkey had allowed 500,000 people from Anatolia to settle in Cyprus during all these 30 years, would you still have the same opinion, assuming that whatever incentive given to them would not convince them to live Cyprus?

It's a good question and one that I'm struggling with... but ultimately the same argument counts and the argument for their non-removal is even greater given the vast numbers involved...

Let me say this... I fundamentally disagree with the policy that both the Turkish governments and TRNC have pursued in importing citizens from the mainland, rather than trying to improve the situation of the TCs, who have been forced en masse to emigrate in order to improve their economic lot. Had resources instead been channelled into developing the infrastructure and economic opportunities available to TCs, the differential between north and south would not be so great AND I doubt GCs would be so perturbed about measures to assist them.

However, as of today, we aren't faced with hypothetical, we are faced with the real prospect of the forced repatriation of tens of thousands of people should a solution along current lines be found. I've already explained my problem with this, and I continue to stand by what I said.

Mr cannedmoose

You may address me as suet any time you like ( Although I do prefer SP)

A Yiddish word from my North London days springs to mind sir, as a fit description for you. "Mensch".