Cyprus-Forum.com

[CanDiaz]

What about their offspring, who were born in Cyprus?

Hard nut to crack. I'd like to say born in Cyprus = Cypriot. But some will stay, some will not. It depends on many factors, too many to list here. I've already created a thread with possible scenarios.

However. If one wish to belong to Turkey it's easy to arrange. I reckon it's possible to swim to the southern coast of the motherland if you're a dedicated Kemalist enough.

I'm not certain, but I think that the EU has a law regarding birth right, as an EU member Cyprus wouldn't have a choice in the matter.

I started to do some research about that in connection with another thread on this point. It seems that Poland does not grant citizenship to the children of non-Polish immigrants born in Poland because they are not of "Polish blood". So I do not know if EU regulations are cut and dried on this matter.

An important point to consider is that we are now seeing the emergence of a third generation among settler families in the north. I contend that an EU member state will find it very difficult to deport people on the grounds that their grandparents, not their parents, were illegal immigrants to the country.

Not to mention the fact that Cyprus is ( allegedly) paradise on Earth & if born there all the more so.
Wouldn't have a link to the Polish thing you mention, would ya?Thnks.

I can't find anything just now, but the following story is highly relevant.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3801839.stm

Yes, I can see what you mean now, thanks for that. But can I ask what your personal feelings are about this issue, if you love your land of birth, then what about others who have been born in Cyprus? Would you demand that this most basic of rights, which you had no choice about anyway, be taken from someone because of who their parents are?

[Tim Drayton]

What about their offspring, who were born in Cyprus?

Hard nut to crack. I'd like to say born in Cyprus = Cypriot. But some will stay, some will not. It depends on many factors, too many to list here. I've already created a thread with possible scenarios.

However. If one wish to belong to Turkey it's easy to arrange. I reckon it's possible to swim to the southern coast of the motherland if you're a dedicated Kemalist enough.

I'm not certain, but I think that the EU has a law regarding birth right, as an EU member Cyprus wouldn't have a choice in the matter.

I started to do some research about that in connection with another thread on this point. It seems that Poland does not grant citizenship to the children of non-Polish immigrants born in Poland because they are not of "Polish blood". So I do not know if EU regulations are cut and dried on this matter.

An important point to consider is that we are now seeing the emergence of a third generation among settler families in the north. I contend that an EU member state will find it very difficult to deport people on the grounds that their grandparents, not their parents, were illegal immigrants to the country.

Not to mention the fact that Cyprus is ( allegedly) paradise on Earth & if born there all the more so.
Wouldn't have a link to the Polish thing you mention, would ya?Thnks.

I can't find anything just now, but the following story is highly relevant.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3801839.stm

Yes, I can see what you mean now, thanks for that. But can I ask what your personal feelings are about this issue, if you love your land of birth, then what about others who have been born in Cyprus? Would you demand that this most basic of rights, which you had no choice about anyway, be taken from someone because of who their parents are?

I don't see from a moral point of view how you can punish somebody for a crime committed by their parents or grandparents. This will prove to be one of the hardest issues to settle, I think.

[CanDiaz]

What about their offspring, who were born in Cyprus?

Hard nut to crack. I'd like to say born in Cyprus = Cypriot. But some will stay, some will not. It depends on many factors, too many to list here. I've already created a thread with possible scenarios.

However. If one wish to belong to Turkey it's easy to arrange. I reckon it's possible to swim to the southern coast of the motherland if you're a dedicated Kemalist enough.

I'm not certain, but I think that the EU has a law regarding birth right, as an EU member Cyprus wouldn't have a choice in the matter.

I started to do some research about that in connection with another thread on this point. It seems that Poland does not grant citizenship to the children of non-Polish immigrants born in Poland because they are not of "Polish blood". So I do not know if EU regulations are cut and dried on this matter.

An important point to consider is that we are now seeing the emergence of a third generation among settler families in the north. I contend that an EU member state will find it very difficult to deport people on the grounds that their grandparents, not their parents, were illegal immigrants to the country.

Not to mention the fact that Cyprus is ( allegedly) paradise on Earth & if born there all the more so.
Wouldn't have a link to the Polish thing you mention, would ya?Thnks.

I can't find anything just now, but the following story is highly relevant.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3801839.stm

Yes, I can see what you mean now, thanks for that. But can I ask what your personal feelings are about this issue, if you love your land of birth, then what about others who have been born in Cyprus? Would you demand that this most basic of rights, which you had no choice about anyway, be taken from someone because of who their parents are?

I don't see from a moral point of view how you can punish somebody for a crime committed by their parents or grandparents. This will prove to be one of the hardest issues to settle, I think.

Me too, particularly if being Turkish & living on Cyprus is perceived as a crime.

[Agios Ionas]

I'm not certain, but I think that the EU has a law regarding birth right, as an EU member Cyprus wouldn't have a choice in the matter.

I think this has been answered already but since this was a reply to my post I might just as well say it again. There is no such law in the EU. Each and every country within the EU have their own say when it comes to birth right laws. Some countries have it, like Ireland (but they will vote about whether to keep it or not). I think most countries in the EU don't have this kind of law.

[Kifeas]

What about their offspring, who were born in Cyprus?

Hard nut to crack. I'd like to say born in Cyprus = Cypriot. But some will stay, some will not. It depends on many factors, too many to list here. I've already created a thread with possible scenarios.

However. If one wish to belong to Turkey it's easy to arrange. I reckon it's possible to swim to the southern coast of the motherland if you're a dedicated Kemalist enough.

I'm not certain, but I think that the EU has a law regarding birth right, as an EU member Cyprus wouldn't have a choice in the matter.

I started to do some research about that in connection with another thread on this point. It seems that Poland does not grant citizenship to the children of non-Polish immigrants born in Poland because they are not of "Polish blood". So I do not know if EU regulations are cut and dried on this matter.

An important point to consider is that we are now seeing the emergence of a third generation among settler families in the north. I contend that an EU member state will find it very difficult to deport people on the grounds that their grandparents, not their parents, were illegal immigrants to the country.

Tim, following your way of thinking and had Turkey been "clever enough" to have allowed half a million of her own people to enter Cyprus, during the early years of its illegal occupation of Cyprus, and all these people would have subsequently given birth to children, by now we GCs would have been a minority in our own country, with the majority of its citizens originating from Turkey! In other words, Turkey would have "legalized" its occupation of Cyprus by converting it into an ethnically Turkish territory, by majority! Your assumptions are faulty, because according to the 3rd Geneva Convention, an occupying entity is not allowed to transfer its own people into the occupied area, in an attempt to change the demographics of that area in the expense of the indigenous people. And as you know, in law an illegality cannot possibly produce legitimacy, on the basis of another law, no matter if this is a human rights law or anything else!

It is a fact of natural law, both national and international, that you cannot use the product or the by-product of an illegality, in order to later on claim that this illegally produced outcome has produced a right on the basis of another law! No one says that those peoples' whatever human rights (which they indeed have) must necessarily be violated. They can be paid by Turkey some very decent compensation, and I can assure you their vast and overwhelming majority will voluntarily choose to be repatriated on this consideration! Turkey may choose to buy 15 less F16’s in the future, since it already has some 300 ones, and use the (to be saved) money to give these anyway poor people 10,000 euros per head, and you will see how happy they will be to forget Cyprus and run to take the money once they arrive back in Turkey. Those married with TCs, or the offspring of one TC parent, may of course stay here and even obtain citizenship. No objection to that!

[Oracle]

I can see why the EU has to stand firm against colonisation issues by invading forces.

Especially as the EU becomes more and more desirable at its borders, extending towards third world countries that would wish nothing more, than a slow, surreptitious way of sneaking their people into Europe.

In order for the EU to minimise these nations that think they can get away with such colonising actions, they need to make Turkey an example of how they cannot get away with this dated, expansionist method ....

Punish Turkey hard and fast!

[Nikitas]

Tim said:

"I don't see from a moral point of view how you can punish somebody for a crime committed by their parents or grandparents. This will prove to be one of the hardest issues to settle, I think."

Yes, that sounds like a moral and humanitarian approach, but it is a non argument. The third generation of settlers in the north is displacing the people who lived there before 1974 and their heirs today. The bringing of settlers is an international crime as per primary international law, ie the Charter of the UN and international agreements. The settlers are a consewuence of that crime. Allowing settlers to remain is llike punishing those displaced who are the victims of the crime.

SOlving the settler problem is easy. First you kick out (sorry there is no polite way to say it) all those who are on the island illegally. Refuse renewal of residence permits of those on the island legally when the permits expire. This deals with the temporary residents and so called seasonal workers.

Others are given financial incentives to leave. The remainder who have both parents born abroad do not get Cypriot nationality. They will keep the nationality of their country of origin which means they will never be elgibile for elective office or civil service jobs.

Those married to Cypriots can seek Cypriot nationality if they so desire. Like the USA, Cyprus can impose an oath of allegiance, which by itself would oblige people to declare openly and publicly their allegiance to Cyprus as a nation.

Doing it any other way can result in Cyprus having a mainlad Greek president and a mainland Turk vice president and similar results in the make up of the cabinet and parliament. Is this what Cypriots want? Accepting such a possibility is tantamount to allowing double union via a side door and maintaining the grounds for hostility and conflict in the future.

[Viewpoint]

Does this approach include all people given citizenship after 1974 both north and south? or will it be double standards in the EU yet again.

[DT.]

Does this approach include all people given citizenship after 1974 both north and south? or will it be double standards in the EU yet again.

Yes, if you agree it will work for both north and south. NO PROBLEMO

[Viewpoint]

Does this approach include all people given citizenship after 1974 both north and south? or will it be double standards in the EU yet again.

Yes, if you agree it will work for both north and south. NO PROBLEMO

Cool just wanted to get that clear as the "ROC" have granted plenty of citizenships to pontiacs who will also have to go back to where they came from.