Cyprus-Forum.com

[halil]

TURKISH FM BABACAN EXPRESSED THE HOPE THAT COMPREHENSIVE TALKS WILL SOON BEGIN IN CYPRUS.

The Turkish Foreign Minister Ali Babacan has expressed the hope that comprehensive negotiations on resolving the Cyprus problem will begin soon.

Speaking at a joint press conference with his Luxembourgian counterpart Jean Asselborn this morning, the Turkish Foreign Minister reiterated Turkey’s continued support to the President of the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus Mehmet Ali Talat; and said `it is Turkey’s wish that comprehensive discussions aimed at reaching a comprehensive solution to the Cyprus problem will begin as soon as possible`.
“It goes without doubt that this is the picture we would like to see at the first place” he said, in reply to a question.

He expressed the view that the Cyprus problem will move into a path of solution only after the two leaders in Cyprus themselves manage to converge their views on the issue.

He said: “There are many reasons to be hopeful, and it is also a fact that similar to the conditions in 2004, today, both Turkey and the Turkish Cypriot People are displaying very strong political will towards supporting a solution to the Cyprus problem”.

For his part, the Luxembourgian foreign minister Jean Asselborn pointed to what he called a “similarly strong wish” across the European Union for a solution to the Cyprus problem.

[Rebel.Without.A.Pause]

TURKISH FM BABACAN EXPRESSED THE HOPE THAT COMPREHENSIVE TALKS WILL SOON BEGIN IN CYPRUS.

The Turkish Foreign Minister Ali Babacan has expressed the hope that comprehensive negotiations on resolving the Cyprus problem will begin soon.

Speaking at a joint press conference with his Luxembourgian counterpart Jean Asselborn this morning, the Turkish Foreign Minister reiterated Turkey’s continued support to the President of the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus Mehmet Ali Talat; and said `it is Turkey’s wish that comprehensive discussions aimed at reaching a comprehensive solution to the Cyprus problem will begin as soon as possible`.
“It goes without doubt that this is the picture we would like to see at the first place” he said, in reply to a question.

He expressed the view that the Cyprus problem will move into a path of solution only after the two leaders in Cyprus themselves manage to converge their views on the issue.

He said: “There are many reasons to be hopeful, and it is also a fact that similar to the conditions in 2004, today, both Turkey and the Turkish Cypriot People are displaying very strong political will towards supporting a solution to the Cyprus problem”.

For his part, the Luxembourgian foreign minister Jean Asselborn pointed to what he called a “similarly strong wish” across the European Union for a solution to the Cyprus problem.

Turkey's idea of a 'comprehensive soloution' is to have a permanent hold onto what they stole in 1974 - hence the situation we are still at today.

[Kifeas]

I take the point. All I am trying to do is show that the TCs are indeed making a linguistic distinction between a "constituent state / oluşturucu devlet” and a “founding state- kurucu devlet."

Well, if they are indeed making this distinction, why then in their English language press, both in Turkey and in the north, they speak of two "founding" states in the joined communique. Is it because their bulimic attitude has resulted in brainwashing and fanaticizing their people to such an extent, that they cannot afford now to tell them what the true merits of a solution can possibly be?

Devoted to Tim Drayton...

“Turkish, Greek Cypriot leaders almost agree on direct talks schedule
The Turkish Cypriot president said on Sunday that he had almost reached an agreement with the Greek Cypriot leader on the schedule of direct negotiations.
………………………
Talat said Greek Cypriot leader Dimitris Christofias and he had agreed ( ) on "a bi-communal and bi-zonal federation established by two founder states." ( )
"This federation will be set up by the Greek Cypriot administration and the KKTC," he also said.”


From Zaman newspaper
http://www.todayszaman.com/tz-web/detay ... &bolum=104

[Tim Drayton]

I take the point. All I am trying to do is show that the TCs are indeed making a linguistic distinction between a "constituent state / oluşturucu devlet” and a “founding state- kurucu devlet."

Well, if they are indeed making this distinction, why then in their English language press, both in Turkey and in the north, they speak of two "founding" states in the joined communique. Is it because their bulimic attitude has resulted in brainwashing and fanaticizing their people to such an extent, that they cannot afford now to tell them what the true merits of a solution can possibly be?

Devoted to Tim Drayton...

“Turkish, Greek Cypriot leaders almost agree on direct talks schedule
The Turkish Cypriot president said on Sunday that he had almost reached an agreement with the Greek Cypriot leader on the schedule of direct negotiations.
………………………
Talat said Greek Cypriot leader Dimitris Christofias and he had agreed ( ) on "a bi-communal and bi-zonal federation established by two founder states." ( )
"This federation will be set up by the Greek Cypriot administration and the KKTC," he also said.”


From Zaman newspaper
http://www.todayszaman.com/tz-web/detay ... &bolum=104

I take your point. However, this is a poor translation of an article originally written in Turkish - what is a "founder state" for Pete's sake? - as was the example you previously quoted from a hashed up translation of an article by Niyazi Kızılyürek originally published in Turkish inYeni Düzen.

The fact remains that in Turkish the distinction between "founding state" and "constituent state" is being made using "kurucu devlet" and "oluşturucu devlet". The problem that you have identified is a failure on the part of translators to check their terminology properly.

It just goes to show that there are many atrocious translators out there.

[Kifeas]

No Tim, it is not a translation mistake! It is not a mere accident! It is not an accidental mistake, but an intentional claim of the Turkish side that what has been agreed is indeed what they fervently aim to achieve politically, which is that before a solution, a vindication and an acknowledgment of the legitimacy of the 1974 and afterwards fait accomplices of their side. If you read further, in the very next sentence I quoted, Talat goes one step further to claim that the two "founding" states will in essence be the "Trnc" and the "Greek Cypriot administration," i.e. the "presently existing" two (according to them) "legitimate" entities in Cyprus. He already gives substance to what he means by "founding states" in the previous sentence, therefore the term "founding" was not used accidentally, or out of poor translation!

The worst of all is that they misinform their public that such a thing has already been “agreed” in the “May 21st” meeting between him (Talat) and Christofias, in a profound twist of the joined communiqué’s meaning. They do so in order to later blame Christofias and the GC side, internally, for “backtracking” from their “agreement!” I do not know for how long you know the Turks, but I happen to know them for 34 odd years already, or ever since I was 8 years old and have been kicked out of my properties and had them usurped from me! If these people’s ideologically originating deceitfulness, had allowed them to convincingly sell to their public the idea that the “3rd Vienna” agreement of 1975 between Clerides and Denktash, was a “population exchange” agreement between what had in this way “legitimately” become a “TC north” and a “GC south;” then everything else is possible from their behalf! Everything and anything, since they have no limits! Indeed, I have read so many things already, that I have come to the conclusion that Turkish (Kemalist) nationalism’s Goebbelistic deceitfulness, falsification and distortionism has absolutely no limits!

[Viewpoint]

No Tim, it is not a translation mistake! It is not a mere accident! It is not an accidental mistake, but an intentional claim of the Turkish side that what has been agreed is indeed what they fervently aim to achieve politically, which is that before a solution, a vindication and an acknowledgment of the legitimacy of the 1974 and afterwards fait accomplices of their side. If you read further, in the very next sentence I quoted, Talat goes one step further to claim that the two "founding" states will in essence be the "Trnc" and the "Greek Cypriot administration," i.e. the "presently existing" two (according to them) "legitimate" entities in Cyprus. He already gives substance to what he means by "founding states" in the previous sentence, therefore the term "founding" was not used accidentally, or out of poor translation!

The worst of all is that they misinform their public that such a thing has already been “agreed” in the May 21st meeting between him (Talat) and Christofias, in a profound twist of the joined communiqué’s meaning. They do so in order to later blame Christofias and the GC side, internally, for “backtracking” from their “agreement!”

Have the Gcs now back tracked? are we no longer going to be 2 founding states, the TRNC and "RoC".

[Kifeas]

No Tim, it is not a translation mistake! It is not a mere accident! It is not an accidental mistake, but an intentional claim of the Turkish side that what has been agreed is indeed what they fervently aim to achieve politically, which is that before a solution, a vindication and an acknowledgment of the legitimacy of the 1974 and afterwards fait accomplices of their side. If you read further, in the very next sentence I quoted, Talat goes one step further to claim that the two "founding" states will in essence be the "Trnc" and the "Greek Cypriot administration," i.e. the "presently existing" two (according to them) "legitimate" entities in Cyprus. He already gives substance to what he means by "founding states" in the previous sentence, therefore the term "founding" was not used accidentally, or out of poor translation!

The worst of all is that they misinform their public that such a thing has already been “agreed” in the May 21st meeting between him (Talat) and Christofias, in a profound twist of the joined communiqué’s meaning. They do so in order to later blame Christofias and the GC side, internally, for “backtracking” from their “agreement!”

Have the Gcs now back tracked? are we no longer going to be 2 founding states, the TRNC and "RoC".

I will let Tim Drayton to explain to you what the truth is!

Tim, could you please explain to VP what you have been trying to explain to me, on the issue of the "accidental" wrongful translation of the term "constituent" in the joined communiqué? Can you please explain to VP this thing about the "... failure on the part of translators to check their terminology properly?"

[miltiades]

VP persists in presenting the "TRNC" as the legitimate state in Cyprus while he still considers the ROC as a non entity , macabre to say the least since the "TRNC" is recognised by NONE as he very well knows.

[Viewpoint]

VP persists in presenting the "TRNC" as the legitimate state in Cyprus while he still considers the ROC as a non entity , macabre to say the least since the "TRNC" is recognised by NONE as he very well knows.

I have told you this before the whole world can recognize you but is that important when you have to agree a solution? can you agree a solution with those nations? No you cannot we the TCs and Turkey matter here and neither of us recognize the "RoC" get that in your head as its us you sit down to find a solution not the rest of the world.

[miltiades]

VP persists in presenting the "TRNC" as the legitimate state in Cyprus while he still considers the ROC as a non entity , macabre to say the least since the "TRNC" is recognised by NONE as he very well knows.

I have told you this before the whole world can recognize you but is that important when you have to agree a solution? can you agree a solution with those nations? No you cannot we the TCs and Turkey matter here and neither of us recognize the "RoC" get that in your head as its us you sit down to find a solution not the rest of the world.

That's rather belligerent and utterly absurd. You are presenting an entity created by force as legitimate and yet the ONLY one recognised by every single nation on earth you declare illegal !!!!!
You say it is with Turkey that we have to negotiate , ( I say we because I include those T/Cs who also feel that Turkey is occupying their nation too ) every one agrees here but its like saying that the hijackers of an aircraft appoint their own captain and recognise him as the ONLY legal entity on that hijacked aircraft which to the entire world it is an illegally hijacked plane but since the legal authorities have to negotiate with the hijackers it makes the hijackers legal !!!
Like it or not , Turkey is the occupier and the ONLY nation recognising their creation.
60 plus thousand of T/Cs are in possession of Cypriot passports , I can assure you the ROC passport contains NO inverted commas , Turkeys position is farcical and just as ludicrous as their recent deliberations as to whether university female students should or should not wear scarves , face facts VP.