Cyprus-Forum.com

[Nikitas]

Bir asked:

"So is Hasturer right when he claims Christofias is handicapped by this "preconception" held by the majority of the GCs??? "

NO, NO and NO! He is not right. I have heard Christofias castigate the Greek Cypriots for not accepting the TCs as equals on a class basis, not a racial basis.

In the not too distand future this question will be redundant. In a proper functioning society people are not judged by status, which they cannot help, but by the obligations put on them by the constitution and the law as well as those that they have taken on while exercising their freedom, to put it in legal terms societies move from status to contract.

Hasturer has a point when he says the TCs have failed to exercise and claim their rights as Cypriot citizens. But that does not answer the question as to whether the GCs regard them as inferior, any more than other segments of Cypriot society are judged as inferior, ie Cypriot women. The attitude has nothing to do with race. It is also insulting to read Hasturer's blanket statement that all GCs regard the TCs as shamishi makers. I recal an equally insulting statement by Denktash that TCs are not capable in business and if the two communities reunite the TCs are condemned , because of this inferiority, to be second class poor citizens. This is nonsense.

People prove their worth by joining in and by participating, allowing others to judge their performance. A good architect is good because he or she produces good work and not because he is male and GC. The withdrawal of TCs from most areas of life, even before the EOKA campaign prevented such assessments, but that does not lead to an automatic rejection and relegation to shamishi makers.

I am sure that once the separation is lifted, and people are judged by what they do and accompish the ethnic distinctions will fade. The able and sincere will come through and the social faults we have as Cypriots will be equally strong in both sides. ie nepotism, cronyism etc. Guaranteeing equality of opportunity will be a major transcommunal challenge.

Shamishi will be made by badly paid immigrants and that will be another story.

[BirKibrisli]

Bir asked:

"So is Hasturer right when he claims Christofias is handicapped by this "preconception" held by the majority of the GCs??? "

NO, NO and NO! He is not right. I have heard Christofias castigate the Greek Cypriots for not accepting the TCs as equals on a class basis, not a racial basis.

In the not too distand future this question will be redundant. In a proper functioning society people are not judged by status, which they cannot help, but by the obligations put on them by the constitution and the law as well as those that they have taken on while exercising their freedom, to put it in legal terms societies move from status to contract.

Hasturer has a point when he says the TCs have failed to exercise and claim their rights as Cypriot citizens. But that does not answer the question as to whether the GCs regard them as inferior, any more than other segments of Cypriot society are judged as inferior, ie Cypriot women. The attitude has nothing to do with race. It is also insulting to read Hasturer's blanket statement that all GCs regard the TCs as shamishi makers. I recal an equally insulting statement by Denktash that TCs are not capable in business and if the two communities reunite the TCs are condemned , because of this inferiority, to be second class poor citizens. This is nonsense.

People prove their worth by joining in and by participating, allowing others to judge their performance. A good architect is good because he or she produces good work and not because he is male and GC. The withdrawal of TCs from most areas of life, even before the EOKA campaign prevented such assessments, but that does not lead to an automatic rejection and relegation to shamishi makers.

I am sure that once the separation is lifted, and people are judged by what they do and accompish the ethnic distinctions will fade. The able and sincere will come through and the social faults we have as Cypriots will be equally strong in both sides. ie nepotism, cronyism etc. Guaranteeing equality of opportunity will be a major transcommunal challenge.

Shamishi will be made by badly paid immigrants and that will be another story.

You make a lot of sense,Nikitas...All we need to do is look at what Cypriots have achieved in the diaspora....No matter what their ethnic background,Cypriots have risen to great heights in all aspects of life,despite their handicaps of being migrants or refugees...I sometimes shake my head when I think of my own modest background,born in the Paphos mountains in a village without electricity or running water...Yet,in my country of refuge, I managed to obtain positions where meeting and dealing with international and national dignitaries were daily occurrences...

[Oracle]

Bir asked:

"So is Hasturer right when he claims Christofias is handicapped by this "preconception" held by the majority of the GCs??? "

NO, NO and NO! He is not right. I have heard Christofias castigate the Greek Cypriots for not accepting the TCs as equals on a class basis, not a racial basis.

In the not too distand future this question will be redundant. In a proper functioning society people are not judged by status, which they cannot help, but by the obligations put on them by the constitution and the law as well as those that they have taken on while exercising their freedom, to put it in legal terms societies move from status to contract.

Hasturer has a point when he says the TCs have failed to exercise and claim their rights as Cypriot citizens. But that does not answer the question as to whether the GCs regard them as inferior, any more than other segments of Cypriot society are judged as inferior, ie Cypriot women. The attitude has nothing to do with race. It is also insulting to read Hasturer's blanket statement that all GCs regard the TCs as shamishi makers. I recal an equally insulting statement by Denktash that TCs are not capable in business and if the two communities reunite the TCs are condemned , because of this inferiority, to be second class poor citizens. This is nonsense.

People prove their worth by joining in and by participating, allowing others to judge their performance. A good architect is good because he or she produces good work and not because he is male and GC. The withdrawal of TCs from most areas of life, even before the EOKA campaign prevented such assessments, but that does not lead to an automatic rejection and relegation to shamishi makers.

I am sure that once the separation is lifted, and people are judged by what they do and accompish the ethnic distinctions will fade. The able and sincere will come through and the social faults we have as Cypriots will be equally strong in both sides. ie nepotism, cronyism etc. Guaranteeing equality of opportunity will be a major transcommunal challenge.

Shamishi will be made by badly paid immigrants and that will be another story.

You make a lot of sense,Nikitas...All we need to do is look at what Cypriots have achieved in the diaspora....No matter what their ethnic background,Cypriots have risen to great heights in all aspects of life,despite their handicaps of being migrants or refugees...I sometimes shake my head when I think of my own modest background,born in the Paphos mountains in a village without electricity or running water...Yet,in my country of refuge, I managed to obtain positions where meeting and dealing with international and national dignitaries were daily occurrences...

... did you deliver the Shamishi to them?

[Get Real!]

Bir asked:

"So is Hasturer right when he claims Christofias is handicapped by this "preconception" held by the majority of the GCs??? "

NO, NO and NO! He is not right. I have heard Christofias castigate the Greek Cypriots for not accepting the TCs as equals on a class basis, not a racial basis.

In the not too distand future this question will be redundant. In a proper functioning society people are not judged by status, which they cannot help, but by the obligations put on them by the constitution and the law as well as those that they have taken on while exercising their freedom, to put it in legal terms societies move from status to contract.

Hasturer has a point when he says the TCs have failed to exercise and claim their rights as Cypriot citizens. But that does not answer the question as to whether the GCs regard them as inferior, any more than other segments of Cypriot society are judged as inferior, ie Cypriot women. The attitude has nothing to do with race. It is also insulting to read Hasturer's blanket statement that all GCs regard the TCs as shamishi makers. I recal an equally insulting statement by Denktash that TCs are not capable in business and if the two communities reunite the TCs are condemned , because of this inferiority, to be second class poor citizens. This is nonsense.

People prove their worth by joining in and by participating, allowing others to judge their performance. A good architect is good because he or she produces good work and not because he is male and GC. The withdrawal of TCs from most areas of life, even before the EOKA campaign prevented such assessments, but that does not lead to an automatic rejection and relegation to shamishi makers.

I am sure that once the separation is lifted, and people are judged by what they do and accompish the ethnic distinctions will fade. The able and sincere will come through and the social faults we have as Cypriots will be equally strong in both sides. ie nepotism, cronyism etc. Guaranteeing equality of opportunity will be a major transcommunal challenge.

Shamishi will be made by badly paid immigrants and that will be another story.

You make a lot of sense,Nikitas...All we need to do is look at what Cypriots have achieved in the diaspora....No matter what their ethnic background,Cypriots have risen to great heights in all aspects of life,despite their handicaps of being migrants or refugees...I sometimes shake my head when I think of my own modest background,born in the Paphos mountains in a village without electricity or running water...Yet,in my country of refuge, I managed to obtain positions where meeting and dealing with international and national dignitaries were daily occurrences...

... did you deliver the Shamishi to them?

Don’t underestimate the Mae West and Mata Hari evening dignitary “interrogations”…

[BirKibrisli]

Bir asked:

"So is Hasturer right when he claims Christofias is handicapped by this "preconception" held by the majority of the GCs??? "

NO, NO and NO! He is not right. I have heard Christofias castigate the Greek Cypriots for not accepting the TCs as equals on a class basis, not a racial basis.

In the not too distand future this question will be redundant. In a proper functioning society people are not judged by status, which they cannot help, but by the obligations put on them by the constitution and the law as well as those that they have taken on while exercising their freedom, to put it in legal terms societies move from status to contract.

Hasturer has a point when he says the TCs have failed to exercise and claim their rights as Cypriot citizens. But that does not answer the question as to whether the GCs regard them as inferior, any more than other segments of Cypriot society are judged as inferior, ie Cypriot women. The attitude has nothing to do with race. It is also insulting to read Hasturer's blanket statement that all GCs regard the TCs as shamishi makers. I recal an equally insulting statement by Denktash that TCs are not capable in business and if the two communities reunite the TCs are condemned , because of this inferiority, to be second class poor citizens. This is nonsense.

People prove their worth by joining in and by participating, allowing others to judge their performance. A good architect is good because he or she produces good work and not because he is male and GC. The withdrawal of TCs from most areas of life, even before the EOKA campaign prevented such assessments, but that does not lead to an automatic rejection and relegation to shamishi makers.

I am sure that once the separation is lifted, and people are judged by what they do and accompish the ethnic distinctions will fade. The able and sincere will come through and the social faults we have as Cypriots will be equally strong in both sides. ie nepotism, cronyism etc. Guaranteeing equality of opportunity will be a major transcommunal challenge.

Shamishi will be made by badly paid immigrants and that will be another story.

You make a lot of sense,Nikitas...All we need to do is look at what Cypriots have achieved in the diaspora....No matter what their ethnic background,Cypriots have risen to great heights in all aspects of life,despite their handicaps of being migrants or refugees...I sometimes shake my head when I think of my own modest background,born in the Paphos mountains in a village without electricity or running water...Yet,in my country of refuge, I managed to obtain positions where meeting and dealing with international and national dignitaries were daily occurrences...

... did you deliver the Shamishi to them?

Jealous are we????
In my next life I will be a lokma and shamishi maker in the RoC,Oracle...
pity you will not partake in any...you are figment of someone's twisted imagination... Which makes me,an idiot talking to a nonexistent entity...

[Nikitas]

Bir,

I know what you mean. In London it is evident not only that Cypriots of all backgrounds make it big, but often there is close cooperation between GCs and TCs and not a few partnerships with people of the two communities working profitably and harmoniously.

I am sure it is the same in Australia and in every other place where Cypriots go. Even in areas where we have no traditional skills, like in shipping, Cypriots often manage to show the traditional players a thing or two.

Since going overseas seems to act as a catalyst for good things, perhaps national service should include a mandatory 6 month working stint in various countries in groups comprising people from both communities.

[Nikitas]

By the way, only a person who has never tried making loukoumades or shamishi would underestimate the skill involved in making them. Dont knock it till you try it.

[Oracle]

Bir asked:

"So is Hasturer right when he claims Christofias is handicapped by this "preconception" held by the majority of the GCs??? "

NO, NO and NO! He is not right. I have heard Christofias castigate the Greek Cypriots for not accepting the TCs as equals on a class basis, not a racial basis.

In the not too distand future this question will be redundant. In a proper functioning society people are not judged by status, which they cannot help, but by the obligations put on them by the constitution and the law as well as those that they have taken on while exercising their freedom, to put it in legal terms societies move from status to contract.

Hasturer has a point when he says the TCs have failed to exercise and claim their rights as Cypriot citizens. But that does not answer the question as to whether the GCs regard them as inferior, any more than other segments of Cypriot society are judged as inferior, ie Cypriot women. The attitude has nothing to do with race. It is also insulting to read Hasturer's blanket statement that all GCs regard the TCs as shamishi makers. I recal an equally insulting statement by Denktash that TCs are not capable in business and if the two communities reunite the TCs are condemned , because of this inferiority, to be second class poor citizens. This is nonsense.

People prove their worth by joining in and by participating, allowing others to judge their performance. A good architect is good because he or she produces good work and not because he is male and GC. The withdrawal of TCs from most areas of life, even before the EOKA campaign prevented such assessments, but that does not lead to an automatic rejection and relegation to shamishi makers.

I am sure that once the separation is lifted, and people are judged by what they do and accompish the ethnic distinctions will fade. The able and sincere will come through and the social faults we have as Cypriots will be equally strong in both sides. ie nepotism, cronyism etc. Guaranteeing equality of opportunity will be a major transcommunal challenge.

Shamishi will be made by badly paid immigrants and that will be another story.

You make a lot of sense,Nikitas...All we need to do is look at what Cypriots have achieved in the diaspora....No matter what their ethnic background,Cypriots have risen to great heights in all aspects of life,despite their handicaps of being migrants or refugees...I sometimes shake my head when I think of my own modest background,born in the Paphos mountains in a village without electricity or running water...Yet,in my country of refuge, I managed to obtain positions where meeting and dealing with international and national dignitaries were daily occurrences...

... did you deliver the Shamishi to them?

Jealous are we????
In my next life I will be a lokma and shamishi maker in the RoC,Oracle...
pity you will not partake in any...you are figment of someone's twisted imagination... Which makes me,an idiot talking to a nonexistent entity...

I see I present a threat to you since your wish be that I did not exist.

You are a fantasist through and through. And I may be your nightmare vision ...... a logical practical person!

Meetings with dignitaries provide me with no envy; mere disappointments, to date!

Now, when it comes to intellectuals .... Mmmm

[Oracle]

Bir,

I know what you mean. In London it is evident not only that Cypriots of all backgrounds make it big, but often there is close cooperation between GCs and TCs and not a few partnerships with people of the two communities working profitably and harmoniously.

I am sure it is the same in Australia and in every other place where Cypriots go. Even in areas where we have no traditional skills, like in shipping, Cypriots often manage to show the traditional players a thing or two.

Since going overseas seems to act as a catalyst for good things, perhaps national service should include a mandatory 6 month working stint in various countries in groups comprising people from both communities.

Maybe it is an inherent trait in those of such a disposition ... the pioneering spirit? ... that they be high achievers to survive and do better under the challenges of (harsher) novel environments.

Indeed it has to be by choice, and not enforced.

So maybe the stint in a foreign country would not serve everyone.

[BirKibrisli]

By the way, only a person who has never tried making loukoumades or shamishi would underestimate the skill involved in making them. Dont knock it till you try it.

Nikitas,believe me when I say that after all I have lived trough in my 57 years,to feed my fellow Cypriots with delicious lokmades and shamishi would be an honour and a pleasure....If you know how to make them,can I come and learn from you wherever you are????