Cyprus-Forum.com

[Kikapu]

This is why it is useless to try and speculate what the end product is going to be once the two sides stop negotiating. All these buzz words that are being used by some to mean something what it is that they want for it to mean, when in fact, it may have very little do do with reality, since these people are not making any consideration for it's legality and effectiveness. One thing for sure, that some people have not come to terms with the 2004 AP, and that is, now that Cyprus is in the EU, many of the provisions in the AP will not cut muster with the EU laws, as it would have done prior joining the EU. Now you know why the NeoPartitionist were really pissed off with the GC's "NO vote". The next peace plan will look much different than the 2004 AP overall, because it has no choice. The EU membership has changed all that and has put the pressure on the TC's and Turkey to be more flexible to what is possible now than what would have been before 2004 EU membership.

Best policy is to wait and see what the finish print will look like before we start speculating what all these words really mean.

[Viewpoint]

Compromise to a degree of accpetence is the key for both sides, but if the GCs feel they will use the EU to take away TC weight in running a united Cyprus and a right to say on predetermined issues the resounding no will this time come from the TC side, which of course is right just as it was for the GCs.

[Kifeas]

Compromise to a degree of accpetence is the key for both sides, but if the GCs feel they will use the EU to take away TC weight in running a united Cyprus and a right to say on predetermined issues the resounding no will this time come from the TC side, which of course is right just as it was for the GCs.

Mama Turka won't bother asking you VP! Once they make up their mind that they have to get rid of the Cyprus problem, for the sake of other more important interests, they will take your hand, give it a pen to hold, and force it accross the sheet to make up your signature!

[Kikapu]

VP,

I'm just playing word games here, so keep calm.!!

First you mention in wanting political equality and in the same breath, you say you want a veto power. But doesn't a
veto power in essence becomes political inequality since it will give you a 100% decision making power, so where is the political equality in that.??

There has to be a better way to protect the interests of the TC's than a veto power. Don't forget, we had veto power before and it did not work.

If the veto right is predetermined on sensitive issues whats the problem? The same system exists in the EU I don't see you complaining, if its inequality then give it up tell the EU you don't want veto rights over Turkey accession. The objections to veto on sensitive issues only fuels mistrust, if GCs do not intend on exploiting certain issues against the will of the TCs then why not accept our right to say no, if they do not mess up then we will not have to use our right, I get the impression they do not trust themselves and their only aim is to get the right to pulverize us into minority status in a GC state run by GCs.

VP,

When ever you try to interject the EU rules on veto vote given to each member country to try and justify a veto vote for the TC's in Cyprus, you have already lost the argument to the question put to you, and you know the answers why, so I'm not going to waste any time telling you.

So basically VP, you have not answered my question at all.

However, on the veto vote issue that you claim it is only for a "predetermined issues" which you gave some examples last week, non of them had anything detrimental to the TC's Democratic or Human Rights violations, so atleast you have acknowledged that any laws passed by the government, it will effect all Cypriots and not just the TC's. You main concerns seems to be regarding Turkey, and their EU bid. I can accept that you will want to maintain certain degree of loyalty to Turkey, but shouldn't your loyalty first be made to Cyprus and not another country. Sometimes I get the impression from a lot of the TC's on the forum, that any unity with the GC's is just for convenience and not for "love". Just like all the reasons I've heard regarding getting RoC passports and using hospitals and jobs in the south by the TC's, that is "hey, if it's there and it is being offered, why not take it....it's free."!! I hope that we TC's are going to unite for becoming Cypriots first and not because it is a "marriage of convenience".

Let me set up an hypothetical situation for you. Just suppose we unite and soon after we start drilling for oil and comes along Turkey to try and disrupt the whole operation, even though the whole world says, that the oil belongs to Cyprus and non to Turkey. Turkey then acts aggressively anyway and even results in deaths to Cypriots. If Cyprus wanted to break of diplomatic relationship with Turkey as a result, what are you going to do, use your veto power to stop it, just because anything that has to do with Turkey will be written down on a "predetermined list". So where will your loyalty lie first VP. ??

As for taxes in the north and tourist from Turkey being taxed more than others is a bunch of nothing. First of all, each state will enjoy certain degree of freedom to set their own laws, as long as they do not violate any of the Federal Laws on Democracy and Human Rights. You want to have Casinos in the north, no problem, whorehouses, no problem, no state tax, no problem, no sales tax (VAT), no problem, nudist beaches, no problem, smoking in restaurants, no problem and so on. You will need to pay Federal taxes as everyone else, so you will not be able to escape that. By not collecting enough taxes to pay for all your public service needs and projects will be the fault of the north state, and the Federal government will not give you money for any of your needs, unless you are able to pay part of the cost.

If I were you, I would pick top concerns for the TC's and put them in the new constitution, and have a system, where 51% of the TC's and 51% of GC's will need to approve to amend the constitution in a referendum rather than a "blank check" with a veto power. That should be a easy compromise by both sides so that we can move along to other more important issues, such as land distribution and right of return to properties in the north and the south.

[Viewpoint]

Compromise to a degree of accpetence is the key for both sides, but if the GCs feel they will use the EU to take away TC weight in running a united Cyprus and a right to say on predetermined issues the resounding no will this time come from the TC side, which of course is right just as it was for the GCs.

Mama Turka won't bother asking you VP! Once they make up their mind that they have to get rid of the Cyprus problem, for the sake of other more important interests, they will take your hand, give it a pen to hold, and force it accross the sheet to make up your signature!

If that's truly the case which I doubt then let it be, Turkey has been our sole life line for many years, if they see fit to cut the cord in the fashion then let it be.