Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oracle]

I was surprised all chose to ignore this:

But critics claim it is consistent with an AKP "hidden agenda" of gradually eliminating drinking in public through a succession of escalating restrictions.

... it sounds like it may just be the tip of the iceberg of increasing restrictions as Turkey sinks into the depths of Islam.

i THINK THAT IS A GOOD IDEA. kEEP THE STREETS FREE OF BOOZERS.

sHOULD BE IMPLEMENTED ALL OVER THE WORLD.

Sorry about the caps. I promise I was not shouting. Yet.

Really Deniz

First the headscarf wearing, then the alcohol restrictions ... what next?

[JimB]

Optimistic outlooks are good ... but let's not be too obtuse about wider implications.

In Turkey, secularists escalate fight against ruling AKP

The country's highest court is weighing whether to allow a motion to shut down the party, saying its Islamic initiatives cross a constitutional line.
By Yigal Schleifer
March 27, 2008

Yigal Schleifer discusses whether Turkey's top court is siding with secularists.

Istanbul - Turkey's secular establishment has dramatically escalated its fight to thwart the growing influence of the ruling Justice and Development Party (AKP) and the emerging socially and religiously conservative middle class that it represents.

After protesting the AKP's presidential candidate, precipitating new elections, and then losing out to the AKP at the polls last year, hard-line secularists are now taking a new tack: trying to shut down the party for "expunging" the Constitution's secular principles.

Turkey's highest court is set to decide in the coming days whether to allow the motion, filed by the country's top prosecutor on March 14, to go forward. If the Constitutional Court decides to allow the case to proceed, it could plunge Turkey into a deep crisis, threatening the country's emerging political and economic stability and further jeopardizing its already troubled bid for European Union membership.

How would the decreasing secularisation process effect the average holidaymaker (who let's face it is of the "get pissed as cheaply as possible for maximum holiday hours" type) .... not to mention those who have bought their low-priced properties to holiday permanently within?

I think your giving too much credit to the 'average holidaymaker' who 'get pissed as cheaply as possible'. They don't care about politics or who's in control of where. They just look at the adverts for a cheap deal and queue up at the airport with a couple of bottles of duty free.

Ultimately, they go where the value is. Hard to argue with it and it makes a kind of sense.

The purchasers of the low-priced properties usually have one of two reasons to buy them; a) speculative investment, b) they genuinely love the place and want to buy a bit of it.

If it's an investment then it's a gamble - some you win, some you lose. Sit and wait for the situation to recover or bail out and try somewhere else.

Chatting to one of my neighbours last night who's selling up here as they think they'd get a better return elsewhere. No emotion, just business.

If they genuinely love the place - well, time to test the level of that devotion.

Live long enough and most problems disappear.

[Oracle]

Optimistic outlooks are good ... but let's not be too obtuse about wider implications.

In Turkey, secularists escalate fight against ruling AKP

The country's highest court is weighing whether to allow a motion to shut down the party, saying its Islamic initiatives cross a constitutional line.
By Yigal Schleifer
March 27, 2008

Yigal Schleifer discusses whether Turkey's top court is siding with secularists.

Istanbul - Turkey's secular establishment has dramatically escalated its fight to thwart the growing influence of the ruling Justice and Development Party (AKP) and the emerging socially and religiously conservative middle class that it represents.

After protesting the AKP's presidential candidate, precipitating new elections, and then losing out to the AKP at the polls last year, hard-line secularists are now taking a new tack: trying to shut down the party for "expunging" the Constitution's secular principles.

Turkey's highest court is set to decide in the coming days whether to allow the motion, filed by the country's top prosecutor on March 14, to go forward. If the Constitutional Court decides to allow the case to proceed, it could plunge Turkey into a deep crisis, threatening the country's emerging political and economic stability and further jeopardizing its already troubled bid for European Union membership.

How would the decreasing secularisation process effect the average holidaymaker (who let's face it is of the "get pissed as cheaply as possible for maximum holiday hours" type) .... not to mention those who have bought their low-priced properties to holiday permanently within?

I think your giving too much credit to the 'average holidaymaker' who 'get pissed as cheaply as possible'. They don't care about politics or who's in control of where. They just look at the adverts for a cheap deal and queue up at the airport with a couple of bottles of duty free.

Ultimately, they go where the value is. Hard to argue with it and it makes a kind of sense.

The purchasers of the low-priced properties usually have one of two reasons to buy them; a) speculative investment, b) they genuinely love the place and want to buy a bit of it.

If it's an investment then it's a gamble - some you win, some you lose. Sit and wait for the situation to recover or bail out and try somewhere else.

Chatting to one of my neighbours last night who's selling up here as they think they'd get a better return elsewhere. No emotion, just business.

If they genuinely love the place - well, time to test the level of that devotion.

Live long enough and most problems disappear.

Merely hanging around doesn't make problems disappear

The average holiday-maker though ignorant or disinterested in politics is the one who will get a rude awakening, whether they are politically-aware or not .....

Serious / genuine investors do not go for the cheap and shoddy, and location being everything, the main areas for best returns will always be the freer-western democracies. To date the furthest East and South you can go, yet not only remain within the safety net of the EU, but also freedom from Islamic restrictions is Cyprus.

The only ones buying in Turkey are those that cannot afford quality in Cyprus and settle for what they think is near enough, or a stepping stone ... but they are the ones who will lose the most under this new regime of Turkey's ...

[FullMetalTurk]

Here, here to that Deniz. For some strange reason it is regarded as cool, the thing to do ?

Yes, in the UK the drunkenness seems quite bad amongst the youth. But are we all becoming boring old farts? I grew up in Scotland where drinking alcohol is, and always has been, an important part of socialising. I remember fondly many evenings in the pub as a student with my mates having fantastic, in depth, hilarious, argumentative, intellectual conversations whilst very definitely drinking to excess. It was just really good fun. Of course, it isn't essential to get drunk to enjoy oneself, but maybe many of the youngsters today are pretty much behaving as I used to. I can't drink now the way I could (and good thing too!), but every now and then it is fun to sit down with some mates, have a few drinks, and put the world to rights!

there is a drinking culture in all countries through out the world - from angola to zimbabwe. in the british isles we all love a drink, especialy the scots and the irish.i personaly find drinking in cyprus the best.give me bottle of zivana with the mezze to go with it and with the right company, satisfaction guaranteed.and in summer the beer goes down like there's no tomorrow.

but in england there deffinately is a problem related to alcohol - i just cant put my finger on it, its as if people drink for the wrong reasons and i dont want to say its only the youth who has a propblem cos they dont,its everyone and i hate to say this but i think the english has a problem with drinking - please dont slate me for this comment i am not trying to start a fight but this ,i think, is my view though im still working on it.but the truth of the matter is there is more alcohol related crime in england than anywhere else,there is more binge drinking in england than anywhere else and if you go out on a saturday night anywhere in england 99.9% of the time you will see some discusting scenes involving people who ,quite simply, cant handle their drinks.ive been to many countries on this planet and i have never witnessed anywhere what happens in england and i think the hooligan problem that england has had over the years is 100% alcohol related.

like i said i dont want to offend any english people on this forum.

will be back in an hour ,off for a quick pint.

[denizaksulu]

I was surprised all chose to ignore this:

But critics claim it is consistent with an AKP "hidden agenda" of gradually eliminating drinking in public through a succession of escalating restrictions.

... it sounds like it may just be the tip of the iceberg of increasing restrictions as Turkey sinks into the depths of Islam.

i THINK THAT IS A GOOD IDEA. kEEP THE STREETS FREE OF BOOZERS.

sHOULD BE IMPLEMENTED ALL OVER THE WORLD.

Sorry about the caps. I promise I was not shouting. Yet.

Really Deniz

First the headscarf wearing, then the alcohol restrictions ... what next?

Were you thinking of migrating to Turkey Oracle? I am touched by your concern. Turkey is indeed a country full of contradictions and as varied as the different type of Turks living there. The headscarves are abane on society but I dont think it has anything to do with religion. I think it has more to do with 'modesty' and is a reaction to the 'ultra modern' section of society. I dont think it is imposed upon the young ladies. It is their freedom to have the right to wear it. It reminds me of the 'FAD' of wearing 'chastity rings' on girls fingers in the USA.

Public drinking; I need say no more. You have lived in the UK long enough. Should you wishto migrate there, fear not. You have the choice of wearing the scarf, but I am sure you would never drink in public, unless ofcourse you are celebrating the march of the Evzones through the streets of Istanbul. So you are ok.

[denizaksulu]

I was surprised all chose to ignore this:

But critics claim it is consistent with an AKP "hidden agenda" of gradually eliminating drinking in public through a succession of escalating restrictions.

... it sounds like it may just be the tip of the iceberg of increasing restrictions as Turkey sinks into the depths of Islam.

i THINK THAT IS A GOOD IDEA. kEEP THE STREETS FREE OF BOOZERS.

sHOULD BE IMPLEMENTED ALL OVER THE WORLD.

Sorry about the caps. I promise I was not shouting. Yet.

Having trouble with the keyboard Deniz? Been hitting the bottle already?

The temperature has suddenly dropped. (I think that was our summer which flashed by). The cats know where it is warm. Timmy(Timur) the Persian just loves my keyboard. When the CAPS are on I know what the cat was on. Havent had any wine yet btw.

[JimB]

Merely hanging around doesn't make problems disappear

The average holiday-maker though ignorant or disinterested in politics is the one who will get a rude awakening, whether they are politically-aware or not .....

Serious / genuine investors do not go for the cheap and shoddy, and location being everything, the main areas for best returns will always be the freer-western democracies. To date the furthest East and South you can go, yet not only remain within the safety net of the EU, but also freedom from Islamic restrictions is Cyprus.

The only ones buying in Turkey are those that cannot afford quality in Cyprus and settle for what they think is near enough, or a stepping stone ... but they are the ones who will lose the most under this new regime of Turkey's ...

Perhaps I'm just being dense here but I fail to see how a holiday-maker could get a 'rude awakening'. Maybe the possibility of losing a deposit on a self booked villa or something in a very worst case scenario, but that's hardly a wake up call for a nation.

Pay on a credit card and get annual travel insurance. Problem solved and only the inconvenience of booking somewhere else to contend with.

On the property side of things. Hmmmm bit of an over-generalisation don't you think? Saying that everyone who's invested in Turkey can't afford anywhere else is a bit narrow minded.

Quality of property and workmanship. There's good and there's bad in every country. This place is no exception.

Here's the reality.

If your not from here, have ties to here or family / friends involved with here then this place really doesn't come up on the radar. Why would it? People have enough problems of their own to deal with without worrying about some rock in an ocean in a far away place.

I confess that I wasn't even aware that you guys had a dispute going on until after I'd got here. The news is full of tales of wars and disputes and I don't think Cyprus get's much press anywhere else.

Don't get me wrong. I'm sympathetic to you and your people's plight but I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.

I can pack up and leave anytime I want. I made a considered decision that I would not buy property here or invest in this country beyond the level of cash needed for everyday transactions.

Think I'm a cold hearted so and so?

Haven't seen a single post on this site detailing the plight of the estimated five million homeless in China or the 78000 dead in Burma and both still rising. No links to the local banks websites accepting donations or bugger all else.

Why? Not your problem and it doesn't affect you ???

http://www.ifrc.org/what/disasters/response/sichuan-earthquake/index.asp

http://www.bbc.co.uk/charityappeals/emergency/current_appeal.shtml

[Talisker]

I was surprised all chose to ignore this:

But critics claim it is consistent with an AKP "hidden agenda" of gradually eliminating drinking in public through a succession of escalating restrictions.

... it sounds like it may just be the tip of the iceberg of increasing restrictions as Turkey sinks into the depths of Islam.

i THINK THAT IS A GOOD IDEA. kEEP THE STREETS FREE OF BOOZERS.

sHOULD BE IMPLEMENTED ALL OVER THE WORLD.

Sorry about the caps. I promise I was not shouting. Yet.

Having trouble with the keyboard Deniz? Been hitting the bottle already?

The temperature has suddenly dropped. (I think that was our summer which flashed by). The cats know where it is warm. Timmy(Timur) the Persian just loves my keyboard. When the CAPS are on I know what the cat was on. Havent had any wine yet btw.

Our cat is trained to avoid the keyboard and makes do with sleeping on our old-fashioned monitor. She'll regret the day we modernise and get a flat screen........... Don't panic about the summer yet, there's plenty of time to get even more depressed about it yet.............

[Oracle]

The headscarves are abane on society but I dont think it has anything to do with religion. I think it has more to do with 'modesty' and is a reaction to the 'ultra modern' section of society.

... modesty ... great euphemism Deniz.

....... And the most modest women are those of the Yemen

[Kikapu]

The best part about getting "pissed", is taking a piss.

It's the greatest feeling in the world.

Last time I got really "pissed" was on my going away party at the pub back in 1979.

I was afraid to go to sleep, fearing that I may never wake up again.