Cyprus-Forum.com

[LANDJO]

Dear all,

As a foreigner and recent arrival to Nicosia, I have been following the discussion in the English speaking media closely and talked to many people (predominantly GC).

What I do not understand, however, is exactly how the GC community view the alleged grievances of the TC community. Instead, the discussion focuses on illegality, property rights, the Geneva convention, and the claim that the Cyprus problem is an issue of invasion rather than intercommuncal conflict. There is little to no reaction to, not even an open dismissal of, the concerns of the TC community.

The concerns, though, are surely known to all of you. So please tell me what you think or what the dominant view of the following issues are:

- The Akritas plan
- The mass deportations during the years leading up to 1974
- Whether or not the initial intervention (not the permanent occupation) was justified
- Killings by EOKA
- Makarios' famous quote 'When Turkey intervenes, there will not be a Turk left on the island to save'

Is there any understanding for the claim that these incidents make it hard for the TC community to accede to living as a minority in a united state?

Or all of of the above dismissed as inconsequential or even untrue?

Thanks for your help!

[gabaston]

Hi Landjo,

Any third party is welcome to this forum, it may reflect an unbiased view, and that helps.

I think you and the rest of the world are coming to understand that we are not a bunch of savage mental barbars, thank you and thank the rest of the world. i wont try and sway you opinions in any way, you are in cyprus and in due course will formulate your own. Instead i will try and put across what i as a tc believe the gc argument to be.

if i were a gc i would see it this way:

"3500 yrs ago my ancestors came to this land. I was peaceful then. During this period we have been subjected to the rule of The Venetians, The Romans, The Byzantines, The Ottomans, Knight Templers, and the British, and maybe a few more here and there. We have never been afforded the luxury of being able to rule ourselves.

After the Second World War, and with British Empire decline we saw for the first time an opportunity to rule ourselves. We did this under the banner of Enosis (Union with Greece). With Greek funding and backing we fought a war against The British, and brought the Brits to the negotiating table.

At last we were free to rule ourselves, or worst-case scenario be part of the Greek nation. There was however a small little problem, that being the Tc's.

After having kicked out the British we believed that the Turks would be in no position to oppose our plans.

After seeing off empire after empire it now seemed a sure thing that we could get the tc's to fall into line, and see our points of view. We made the fundamental mistake of democratically sharing power with a minority population, and sought to legally redress this imbalance by legally declaring them an insignificant minority. This they didn’t like, and they retreated into their enclaves, and prepared for war.

Then a few years later when The Greek Colonels decided the time was right they staged a coupe to finally free us of all the outside foreign oppression, which we have suffered for the past three and a half thousand yrs.

Turkey saw this as an excuse to come and steal our lands, and that’s basically how it goes."

Well im not trying to influence you in any way, im just telling the gc version as best as i understand it.

I hope you enjoy your stay in Cyprus and trust that you will spread the truth as you see it to your fellow countrymen, and continue to enlighten the world to the realities, and not myths of Cyprus.

[gabaston]

As im sure you are aware the gc’s will not admit to any of the acts which you have mentioned. At best they will say they were mistakes.
If the truth be told im sure that the vast majority of gc’s were actually unaware of the tragic events tcs were enduring, in much the same way as The German people were unaware or too frightened of the Nazi’s.

Many gc’s can not confront these issues. They will claim t propaganda, or lies, and patriotically defend a cause of which they have no first hand knowledge. Either that or they are perpetuating their 3500 freedom struggle for Greek or Greek Cypriot, and now coz it suits their cause, the latest remixed version Cypriot Rule. The only way they want us, is under their majority rule.

It doesn’t take a genius to understand why we don’t want gc majority rule, but they cling to it in the belief that it takes two turks to share one brain cell.



God help us

[Piratis]

LANDJO, no nation is made of saints. However you have to put everything into the right perspective.

The Turks in order to excuse their crimes in Cyprus magnify and emphasize over and over again the crimes committed against TCs in a period of less than 20 years. They (and their allies) as if they were the ones with no sins, try to punish GCs forever because they misbehaved over a tiny period of time (compared with our long history).

The truth is though, that the suffering that the Ottomans and later the Turks caused to GCs is 100 times more in magnitude.

While the GCs have admitted their crimes (yes we did them!) and want to have legality and human rights for everybody, the Turks not only deny their many times more crimes, but they continue the violation of our human rights and international law as we speak.

We do not ask for anybody to be punished because of what happened in the past. However we feel it is very unfair to convict GCs forever for their wrong doings, while rewording Turkey for their hugely more crimes.

[insan]

While the GCs have admitted their crimes (yes we did them!) and want to have legality and human rights for everybody, the Turks not only deny their many times more crimes, but they continue the violation of our human rights and international law as we speak.

Who admitted the "crimes of GCs"? First of all just two ordinary ex-Eoka-B members admitted what they personally did. We have never heard an official acknowledgement from so called RoC.

On the other hand the ones who speak about the crimes of GC right wing and reveal some truths are only left-wing GCs.

However what you ask Turkish side to acknowledge(admit) is the dirty propaganda lies of GC ruling elite.

[gabaston]

WHAT???????????????????????????????????????????????????


While the GCs have admitted their crimes (yes we did them!)


OH - MY - GOD.

ive waited forty years for that.....................................im in total shock.....................i cant comment.


Well done P.




In response no empire was built without blooshed. Not from Roman, to Soviet,
Alexandre the Great, nor Ottoman. The world knows and accepts this, and if the Armenians claims are true, at least somehow they have been rewarded in some part by having a country, where they are at last safe. The Jews too have one. The gc's also have a home where they can feel safe. Now in the year 2005 is it such a terrible crime for tc's at last live without the fear of bullets?

[TCBananiot]

While the GCs have admitted their crimes (yes we did them!) and want to have legality and human rights for everybody, the Turks not only deny their many times more crimes, but they continue the violation of our human rights and international law as we speak.

Who admitted the "crimes of GCs"? First of all just two ordinary ex-Eoka-B members admitted what they personally did. We have never heard an official acknowledgement from so called RoC.

On the other hand the ones who speak about the crimes of GC right wing and reveal some truths are only left-wing GCs.

However what you ask Turkish side to acknowledge(admit) is the dirty propaganda lies of GC ruling elite.

What you mean Insan?
Only the GCs have made crimes against us?
Our side didn't do any wrongdoings and ...crimes?

[brother]

Welcome to the forum TCBananiot

What you mean Insan?
Only the GCs have made crimes against us?
Our side didn't do any wrongdoings and ...crimes?

So what is it you want to say and you made this remark, please feel free to comment.

[TCBananiot]

Welcome to the forum TCBananiot

What you mean Insan?
Only the GCs have made crimes against us?
Our side didn't do any wrongdoings and ...crimes?

So what is it you want to say and you made this remark, please feel free to comment.

Thanks brother

I ask if we believe that our side didn't any aggravations and killings against gCs in the past. I think we also made too many wrong doings. Why we ask only them to admit but we never do anything similar ourselves?

[gabaston]

I think that Piratis is talking about the Ottomans, not us on Cyprus.
Credit where credit is due Mr Pirates, that was a brave admission.
I think if the rest of your people and your govt had the honesty you have and inform the world of this, we might have peace by next year.