Cyprus-Forum.com

[Viewpoint]

...if we are talking about churches and mosques, visit teke if you love beauty and myth, it lives today as it has been from so long ago and we are all the better for it. never mind Athens, or do you mean to say that the closure of monestaries in Turkey is the blame? lacking the honesty VP i expect from you, you come at me like a tame book. needless to say that some churches would be respectfully used in praise to our same God. and there is no sin in giving shelter to the sheep in the cold winter storm...but what it seems to me that you are saying is that it is ok to tear down mosques, and it is ok as well for churches to be torn down too.

i am not asking you to be the whole Turkish Population, or even the representative of some Turkish Cypriot population, while i reread your post to figure an answer i can only say you read alot into what you think i'm thinking...the words we have written speak for themselves.

i think camus would be appalled at you, but you could be a hero in his book. ..extistential, but still dogmatic.

You have it wrong repulse,

GCs tear down/demolish/erase buildings

TCs reuse/convert buildings

Which of the above is more acceptable having a building to convert back to its former glory or having no building at all?

So can you please answer me one question. Why have all the graves been destroyed then. Is that to resue the ground or what. Please clarify.

VP you talk shite. Turks are animals end of.

The GCs have done exactly the same even worse far before the Turkish army arrived, what does that make you people?

[bilako22]

...if we are talking about churches and mosques, visit teke if you love beauty and myth, it lives today as it has been from so long ago and we are all the better for it. never mind Athens, or do you mean to say that the closure of monestaries in Turkey is the blame? lacking the honesty VP i expect from you, you come at me like a tame book. needless to say that some churches would be respectfully used in praise to our same God. and there is no sin in giving shelter to the sheep in the cold winter storm...but what it seems to me that you are saying is that it is ok to tear down mosques, and it is ok as well for churches to be torn down too.

i am not asking you to be the whole Turkish Population, or even the representative of some Turkish Cypriot population, while i reread your post to figure an answer i can only say you read alot into what you think i'm thinking...the words we have written speak for themselves.

i think camus would be appalled at you, but you could be a hero in his book. ..extistential, but still dogmatic.

You have it wrong repulse,

GCs tear down/demolish/erase buildings

TCs reuse/convert buildings

Which of the above is more acceptable having a building to convert back to its former glory or having no building at all?

So can you please answer me one question. Why have all the graves been destroyed then. Is that to resue the ground or what. Please clarify.

VP you talk shite. Turks are animals end of.

If it makes you feel comfortable and able to sleep better I will admit that we Turks are animals.

[repulsewarrior]

...i like to think that we are changing, your statement is evidence of that, so thank-you bilako, and i will say that Greeks are no different.

[GeorgeV97qaue]

Greeks are not the ones who live in stolen land. Destroy churches and gave yards. Let's get somthing straight here the GC's who commited crimes againts the TC's were a minority. At the time they though their cause was just because you the TC's sided with the Brits.

And for you lot to use the inter communal fighting as the reason to invade in 74 is a farse. In 1974 the fighting had stopped. The fighting was Greek against Greek not against the TC's. The majority of GC's never wanted enosis with Greece all we wanted was a constitution that was workable. The constitution we had at the time was never going to work Britain, Turkey & Greece new that when it was draw up.

Turkey new it would end in violence which they hoped would justify an invasion. With the help of Kissinger you got your way in the end.

Well my view is either we agree a fair solution where all GC's can return all be it under turkish administation or you can continue to live in isolation cause by Turkey not the Greek Cypriots.

[Viewpoint]

Greeks are not the ones who live in stolen land. Destroy churches and gave yards. Let's get somthing straight here the GC's who commited crimes againts the TC's were a minority. At the time they though their cause was just because you the TC's sided with the Brits.

And for you lot to use the inter communal fighting as the reason to invade in 74 is a farse. In 1974 the fighting had stopped. The fighting was Greek against Greek not against the TC's. The majority of GC's never wanted enosis with Greece all we wanted was a constitution that was workable. The constitution we had at the time was never going to work Britain, Turkey & Greece new that when it was draw up.

Turkey new it would end in violence which they hoped would justify an invasion. With the help of Kissinger you got your way in the end.

Well my view is either we agree a fair solution where all GC's can return all be it under turkish administation or you can continue to live in isolation cause by Turkey not the Greek Cypriots.

You have to accept responsibility for your contribution towards the division of today. You had the opportunity to include us in a united Cyprus but you chose to push us out and leave us dangling exposed to the threat of enosis and possible annihilation, all we could do was fight back and fight back we did. The situation may have been good for you prior 1974 but for us it was hell on earth, where were you then? why were you not fighting for my rights? your silence during my suffering is why there is bitterness and mistrust between the 2 communities, you must never forget the Cyprus problem did not start in 1974 but in 1963 when you were chasing your hidden agendas.

[observer]

And for you lot to use the inter communal fighting as the reason to invade in 74 is a farse. In 1974 the fighting had stopped. The fighting was Greek against Greek not against the TC's. The majority of GC's never wanted enosis with Greece all we wanted was a constitution that was workable. The constitution we had at the time was never going to work Britain, Turkey & Greece new that when it was draw up

Can we now leave this thread free for GV to argue with GR who posted the following:

Quote:
Between 15th - 22nd of January of 1950, with the initiative of the Churchs in Cyprus, the referendum for union with Greece was conducted. 95.7% of the population went to the churches and signed the referendum.

http://www.geocities.com/helleniccyprus/eoka.html


Quote:
January 15: The Church of Cyprus organises a referendum as to the future status of the island colony. 97% of all participants vote for Enosis with Greece.

http://wiki.phantis.com/index.php/1950


Quote:
In 1950 the Greek Cypriots overwhelmingly (96 per cent) decided by referendum that Cyprus should be united with Greece. The prime Minister of Greece Nicolaos Plastiras, however, declined to meet a very high level delegation from Cyprus, which was going to hand over to him the official results of the referendum.

http://www.cyprus-mail.com/news/main.ph ... 1&cat_id=1


Quote:
In January 1950, moving swiftly to pre-empt this initiative, the ethnarchy organised its own plebiscite, held in churches across the island, to which AKEL rallied. The result left little doubt about popular sentiment: 96 per cent of Greek Cypriots – that is, 80 per cent of the population of the island – voted for Enosis.

http://www.lrb.co.uk/v30/n08/print/ande01_.html


Quote:
In 1948 the bishop of Citium of Cyprus, Mihail Mouskos, began to organize support for enosis through the Church of Cyprus to exclude communist influence and to restore the temporal power of the church. In January 1950 the British authorities refused his request for a referendum on enosis. Yet when the church hierarchy polled the Greek community, 95.7 percent favored union with Greece.

http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761 ... yprus.html


Quote:
The movement of Greek Cypriots that advocated union [enosis] with Greece gained momentum in 1950, when an unofficial referendum for self-determination showed that 96% of the Greek
population favoured enosis.

http://ec.europa.eu/education/policies/ ... /cy_en.pdf

[GeorgeV97qaue]

Observer you can quote what you like. I wasnt even born when these incidents happened so I cant comments on them.

Viewpoint I'm not saying TC's were not killed by GC's in 1963. I've never denied that. I personally believe that those who killed the TC's are criminals and if any of them are still around they should be sent down. Same goes for the greeks cypriots that backed the 1974 coup.

But dont sit their and say you lot had nothing to do with inter communal violence in 1963. It was the TC's that sided with the brits and became informants on their own country men.

Just to clarify Grivas was a thug and if it was not for him half the problems would not exist. But to soley blame the GC's is unnaceptable.

[Viewpoint]

Observer you can quote what you like. I wasnt even born when these incidents happened so I cant comments on them.

Viewpoint I'm not saying TC's were not killed by GC's in 1963. I've never denied that. I personally believe that those who killed the TC's are criminals and if any of them are still around they should be sent down. Same goes for the greeks cypriots that backed the 1974 coup.

But dont sit their and say you lot had nothing to do with inter communal violence in 1963. It was the TC's that sided with the brits and became informants on their own country men.

Just to clarify Grivas was a thug and if it was not for him half the problems would not exist. But to soley blame the GC's is unnaceptable.

Tell me why we should not have sided with the Brits against enosis?

[GeorgeV97qaue]

I cant tell you anything mate. Your people make their own decisions. Would it not have been better to stay out of it.

Surley if you stayed out of the troubles a better constitution would have been draw up when the brits were ready to sit down and talk about possible independence as Enosis was out of the question because the TC's had rights.

Like I said not everyone wanted Enosis I know my family were against it at the time. The trust between the two community was lost as soon as you backed the brits.

This gave Grivas and his thugs the licence to go after the TC's when independence was granted. Markarios made mistakes in the early 60's when he decided he wanted Cyprus to become part of Greece. This gave Grivas licence to kill. Makarios relised his mistakes but it was too late.

I believe the Turkey munipulated the situation so they could get half of Cyprus. It was always their plan and their mate Kissinger was there to help.

[Viewpoint]

I cant tell you anything mate. Your people make their own decisions. Would it not have been better to stay out of it.

Surley if you stayed out of the troubles a better constitution would have been draw up when the brits were ready to sit down and talk about possible independence as Enosis was out of the question because the TC's had rights.

Like I said not everyone wanted Enosis I know my family were against it at the time. The trust between the two community was lost as soon as you backed the brits.

This gave Grivas and his thugs the licence to go after the TC's when independence was granted. Markarios made mistakes in the early 60's when he decided he wanted Cyprus to become part of Greece. This gave Grivas licence to kill. Makarios relised his mistakes but it was too late.

I believe the Turkey munipulated the situation so they could get half of Cyprus. It was always their plan and their mate Kissinger was there to help.

Staying out was not an option as it was our future and well being that was being gambled, we did not want to be part of Greece so we had no option but to stand up and fight for what we believed, the Brits were our only local ally.

Better constitution for whom? and why?