Cyprus-Forum.com

[miltiades]

I hope you are not "happy " that the pilot was beaten to a pulp "
There are conventions that govern such events , there is nothing to be proud about killing one Turkish pilot , any more than there is in killing the young G/C man while attempting to lower the Turkish flag.

I am actually very disappointed that he was killed so soon when in fact he should’ve been forced to rebuild all the homes he burned down with napalm, and then handed over to all those civilians who found charcoaled family members.

You are of course forgetting that this wretched man was carrying out orders . Barbarism is never justified but since you are a committed supporter of the savages causing havoc in Iraq I can understand.
In response to Shah , let him understand that the majority of G/Cs would endorse my condemnation of such an act as I'm sure that the majority of T/Cs would do likewise in the case of the young G/C shot while ascending the flag pole.

Orders or no orders Miltiades, napalm bombing civilian targets is also a war crime, and both the ones issuing the orders and the ones executing them, are equally punishable!

Kifeas , I think again you are misunderstanding my point. I'm not justifying the use of napalm or any other means in attacking civilian targets. I'm purely saying that this pilot took off from Turkey under orders , just as any other fighter pilot would have done. Having been shot down the correct treatment should have been a civilized one , not beat him to a pulp , burn him or torture him . Civilization demands that man acts in a humane fashion because acting in any other fashion renders him open to an accusation of barbarity. In our world we do not chop peoples arms off for stealing , we do not shoot women who have been raped , we do not put prisoners in dungeons and torture them

[miltiades]

The guy was tortured to death, any idiot with half an eye who sees the pictures of his corpse can tell he was not "burned" to death, nor does he look like someone who has managed to safely eject from his plane and then somehow died later on in the hospital from "injuries".

The "hospital" he died in is 10 minutes from my house and everyone knows that place was not just a hospital back then.

So much for the one sided blame game that occasionally flies around here, regarding how the Turks don't take any prisoners

Any chances of getting/posting a picture of his corpse? I'd like to see it too.

I didn't think that" necrophilia " was your trait !!

[shahmaran]

I hope you are not "happy " that the pilot was beaten to a pulp "
There are conventions that govern such events , there is nothing to be proud about killing one Turkish pilot , any more than there is in killing the young G/C man while attempting to lower the Turkish flag.

I am actually very disappointed that he was killed so soon when in fact he should’ve been forced to rebuild all the homes he burned down with napalm, and then handed over to all those civilians who found charcoaled family members.

You are of course forgetting that this wretched man was carrying out orders . Barbarism is never justified but since you are a commited supporter of the savages causing havoc in Iraq I can understand.
In response to Shah , let him understand that the majority of G/Cs would endorse my condemnation of such an act as I'm sure that the majority of T/Cs would do likewise in the case of the young G/C shot while ascending the flag pole.

Orders or no orders Miltiades, napalm bombing civilian targets is also a war crime, and both the ones issuing the orders and the ones executing them, are equally punishable!

So is torture and civilian executions en-mass, which ones have you been punished for so far?

[Paphitis]

I hope you are not "happy " that the pilot was beaten to a pulp "
There are conventions that govern such events , there is nothing to be proud about killing one Turkish pilot , any more than there is in killing the young G/C man while attempting to lower the Turkish flag.

I am actually very disappointed that he was killed so soon when in fact he should’ve been forced to rebuild all the homes he burned down with napalm, and then handed over to all those civilians who found charcoaled family members.

You are of course forgetting that this wretched man was carrying out orders . Barbarism is never justified but since you are a committed supporter of the savages causing havoc in Iraq I can understand.
In response to Shah , let him understand that the majority of G/Cs would endorse my condemnation of such an act as I'm sure that the majority of T/Cs would do likewise in the case of the young G/C shot while ascending the flag pole.

Orders or no orders Miltiades, napalm bombing civilian targets is also a war crime, and both the ones issuing the orders and the ones executing them, are equally punishable!

Kifeas , I think again you are misunderstanding my point. I'm not justifying the use of napalm or any other means in attacking civilian targets. I'm purely saying that this pilot took off from Turkey under orders , just as any other fighter pilot would have done. Having been shot down the correct treatment should have been a civilized one , not beat him to a pulp , burn him or torture him . Civilization demands that man acts in a humane fashion because acting in any other fashion renders him open to an accusation of barbarity. In our world we do not chop peoples arms off for stealing , we do not shoot women who have been raped , we do not put prisoners in dungeons and torture them

Torture is an effective way of obtaining intelligence. It is naive to assume that these techniques will not be used by the enemy if captured as intelligence also means the possible saviour of dozens, hundreds or even thousands of their own personell. It is also naive to expect to be treated in accordance with any conventions and not be killed when captured as it can so easily be made to appear as though you were killed in action and not under capture. So effectively, such war crimes are very difficult to prove in most situations. A downed pilot behind enemy lines can just about consider themselves as a "Dead Man Walking" or a "Dead Man Running" in this case. And they will be running very fast! Running for their life!

[shahmaran]

The guy was tortured to death, any idiot with half an eye who sees the pictures of his corpse can tell he was not "burned" to death, nor does he look like someone who has managed to safely eject from his plane and then somehow died later on in the hospital from "injuries".

The "hospital" he died in is 10 minutes from my house and everyone knows that place was not just a hospital back then.

So much for the one sided blame game that occasionally flies around here, regarding how the Turks don't take any prisoners

Any chances of getting/posting a picture of his corpse? I'd like to see it too.

I did a quick search for them but unfortunately nothing online, maybe someone else knows, if not you will just have to pay his memorial a visit.

You can even get a chance to give a few kicks to the remains of his plane too, if it would make you feel any better.

[Get Real!]

I hope you are not "happy " that the pilot was beaten to a pulp "
There are conventions that govern such events , there is nothing to be proud about killing one Turkish pilot , any more than there is in killing the young G/C man while attempting to lower the Turkish flag.

I am actually very disappointed that he was killed so soon when in fact he should’ve been forced to rebuild all the homes he burned down with napalm, and then handed over to all those civilians who found charcoaled family members.

You are of course forgetting that this wretched man was carrying out orders . Barbarism is never justified but since you are a committed supporter of the savages causing havoc in Iraq I can understand.
In response to Shah , let him understand that the majority of G/Cs would endorse my condemnation of such an act as I'm sure that the majority of T/Cs would do likewise in the case of the young G/C shot while ascending the flag pole.

Orders or no orders Miltiades, napalm bombing civilian targets is also a war crime, and both the ones issuing the orders and the ones executing them, are equally punishable!

Kifeas , I think again you are misunderstanding my point. I'm not justifying the use of napalm or any other means in attacking civilian targets. I'm purely saying that this pilot took off from Turkey under orders , just as any other fighter pilot would have done. Having been shot down the correct treatment should have been a civilized one , not beat him to a pulp , burn him or torture him . Civilization demands that man acts in a humane fashion because acting in any other fashion renders him open to an accusation of barbarity. In our world we do not chop peoples arms off for stealing , we do not shoot women who have been raped , we do not put prisoners in dungeons and torture them

You have constantly voiced your support of the US’s ILLEGAL invasion/occupation and incalculable atrocities committed in Iraq, yet you now want to bring up “human rights” in support of spineless Turkish pilots dropping hell from the “safety” of the sky on CIVILLIANS… (<- proven fact)

It’s your screwed up “moral values” and contradictory stances that have gradually earned you the “Pappou Skata” title so don’t complain…

Over to Kifeas…

[Get Real!]

The guy was tortured to death, any idiot with half an eye who sees the pictures of his corpse can tell he was not "burned" to death, nor does he look like someone who has managed to safely eject from his plane and then somehow died later on in the hospital from "injuries".

The "hospital" he died in is 10 minutes from my house and everyone knows that place was not just a hospital back then.

So much for the one sided blame game that occasionally flies around here, regarding how the Turks don't take any prisoners

Any chances of getting/posting a picture of his corpse? I'd like to see it too.

I did a quick search for them but unfortunately nothing online, maybe someone else knows, if not you will just have to pay his memorial a visit.

You can even get a chance to give a few kicks to the remains of his plane too, if it would make you feel any better.

For me it's a missing piece of a historic puzzle...

[Paphitis]

I hope you are not "happy " that the pilot was beaten to a pulp "
There are conventions that govern such events , there is nothing to be proud about killing one Turkish pilot , any more than there is in killing the young G/C man while attempting to lower the Turkish flag.

I am actually very disappointed that he was killed so soon when in fact he should’ve been forced to rebuild all the homes he burned down with napalm, and then handed over to all those civilians who found charcoaled family members.

You are of course forgetting that this wretched man was carrying out orders . Barbarism is never justified but since you are a committed supporter of the savages causing havoc in Iraq I can understand.
In response to Shah , let him understand that the majority of G/Cs would endorse my condemnation of such an act as I'm sure that the majority of T/Cs would do likewise in the case of the young G/C shot while ascending the flag pole.

Orders or no orders Miltiades, napalm bombing civilian targets is also a war crime, and both the ones issuing the orders and the ones executing them, are equally punishable!

Kifeas , I think again you are misunderstanding my point. I'm not justifying the use of napalm or any other means in attacking civilian targets. I'm purely saying that this pilot took off from Turkey under orders , just as any other fighter pilot would have done. Having been shot down the correct treatment should have been a civilized one , not beat him to a pulp , burn him or torture him . Civilization demands that man acts in a humane fashion because acting in any other fashion renders him open to an accusation of barbarity. In our world we do not chop peoples arms off for stealing , we do not shoot women who have been raped , we do not put prisoners in dungeons and torture them

You have constantly voiced your support of the US’s ILLEGAL invasion/occupation and incalculable atrocities committed in Iraq, yet you now want to bring up “human rights” in support of spineless Turkish pilots dropping hell from the “safety” of the sky on CIVILLIANS… (<- proven fact)

It’s your screwed up “moral values” and contradictory stances that have gradually earned you the “Pappou Skata” title so don’t complain…

Over to Kifeas…

So do you propose that all coalition partners withdraw from Iraq immediately?

[Get Real!]

I hope you are not "happy " that the pilot was beaten to a pulp "
There are conventions that govern such events , there is nothing to be proud about killing one Turkish pilot , any more than there is in killing the young G/C man while attempting to lower the Turkish flag.

I am actually very disappointed that he was killed so soon when in fact he should’ve been forced to rebuild all the homes he burned down with napalm, and then handed over to all those civilians who found charcoaled family members.

You are of course forgetting that this wretched man was carrying out orders . Barbarism is never justified but since you are a committed supporter of the savages causing havoc in Iraq I can understand.
In response to Shah , let him understand that the majority of G/Cs would endorse my condemnation of such an act as I'm sure that the majority of T/Cs would do likewise in the case of the young G/C shot while ascending the flag pole.

Orders or no orders Miltiades, napalm bombing civilian targets is also a war crime, and both the ones issuing the orders and the ones executing them, are equally punishable!

Kifeas , I think again you are misunderstanding my point. I'm not justifying the use of napalm or any other means in attacking civilian targets. I'm purely saying that this pilot took off from Turkey under orders , just as any other fighter pilot would have done. Having been shot down the correct treatment should have been a civilized one , not beat him to a pulp , burn him or torture him . Civilization demands that man acts in a humane fashion because acting in any other fashion renders him open to an accusation of barbarity. In our world we do not chop peoples arms off for stealing , we do not shoot women who have been raped , we do not put prisoners in dungeons and torture them

You have constantly voiced your support of the US’s ILLEGAL invasion/occupation and incalculable atrocities committed in Iraq, yet you now want to bring up “human rights” in support of spineless Turkish pilots dropping hell from the “safety” of the sky on CIVILLIANS… (<- proven fact)

It’s your screwed up “moral values” and contradictory stances that have gradually earned you the “Pappou Skata” title so don’t complain…

Over to Kifeas…

So do you propose that all coalition partners withdraw from Iraq immediately?

Please feel free to start a thread on that (political section) if interested but not here. Thanks.

[Paphitis]

I hope you are not "happy " that the pilot was beaten to a pulp "
There are conventions that govern such events , there is nothing to be proud about killing one Turkish pilot , any more than there is in killing the young G/C man while attempting to lower the Turkish flag.

I am actually very disappointed that he was killed so soon when in fact he should’ve been forced to rebuild all the homes he burned down with napalm, and then handed over to all those civilians who found charcoaled family members.

You are of course forgetting that this wretched man was carrying out orders . Barbarism is never justified but since you are a committed supporter of the savages causing havoc in Iraq I can understand.
In response to Shah , let him understand that the majority of G/Cs would endorse my condemnation of such an act as I'm sure that the majority of T/Cs would do likewise in the case of the young G/C shot while ascending the flag pole.

Orders or no orders Miltiades, napalm bombing civilian targets is also a war crime, and both the ones issuing the orders and the ones executing them, are equally punishable!

Kifeas , I think again you are misunderstanding my point. I'm not justifying the use of napalm or any other means in attacking civilian targets. I'm purely saying that this pilot took off from Turkey under orders , just as any other fighter pilot would have done. Having been shot down the correct treatment should have been a civilized one , not beat him to a pulp , burn him or torture him . Civilization demands that man acts in a humane fashion because acting in any other fashion renders him open to an accusation of barbarity. In our world we do not chop peoples arms off for stealing , we do not shoot women who have been raped , we do not put prisoners in dungeons and torture them

You have constantly voiced your support of the US’s ILLEGAL invasion/occupation and incalculable atrocities committed in Iraq, yet you now want to bring up “human rights” in support of spineless Turkish pilots dropping hell from the “safety” of the sky on CIVILLIANS… (<- proven fact)

It’s your screwed up “moral values” and contradictory stances that have gradually earned you the “Pappou Skata” title so don’t complain…

Over to Kifeas…

So do you propose that all coalition partners withdraw from Iraq immediately?

Please feel free to start a thread on that (political section) if interested but not here. Thanks.

No need to start another thread. You are the one that diverted to this topic and not me.

You attacked Miltiades about supporting the US/UK actions in Iraq. There is nothing I would want more than the return of Oz troops from Iraq. Unfortunately, the complete withdraw of coalition troops is not possible ATM. And this is because if they did, Iraq will descend into a civil war for the next 5, 10, 15 years. You must also consider that the Iraqi government does not want to see these troops leave yet. There are many humanitarian initiatives currently being undertaken which will hopefully bring stability to the region. The Iraqi army is being trained to take over security responsibilities, hospitals, roads, and other infrastructure are being built. The extensive casualties that you posted in another thread are not all due to coalition forces. I can tell you that the insurgance is responsible for the majority of civilian deaths. By withdrawing now, you are ensuring that many thousands more will die from insurgent powers and bloodshed between Shiite and Sunni.

GR, you very often make some very good points, but on Iraq you are very ignorant.