Cyprus-Forum.com

[Bananiot]

Volkan, the nationalist Turkish Cypriot newspaper has accused Talat that the vast majority of the people that man the Technical Committees and the Working Groups are persons that voted for the Annan Plan.

Similarly, DIKO and EDEK in our side, have accused Christofias of exactly the same thing.

Furthermore, Volkan says that these people have been trained in foreign countries on bicommunal seminars.

Is Papadopoulos an advisor of this paper?

[-mikkie2-]

Well, there are demented nationalists on both sides. Is that something new?

Perhaps Papadopoulos and Denktas Junior are 'advisers' to Volkan? Who knows? Who cares? These people are now sidelined. Even DIKO and EDEK are sidelined despite the fact their leaderships sided with AKEL and by consequence the votes of their members were associated with backing Christofias. It would have made very little differerence which party backed who. People voted for change and that is what they will hopefully get.

I don't think these people can de-rail the current momentum in solving the Cyprus problem. Can you see that happening?

[kurupetos]

Volkan, the nationalist Turkish Cypriot newspaper has accused Talat that the vast majority of the people that man the Technical Committees and the Working Groups are persons that voted for the Annan Plan.

Similarly, DIKO and EDEK in our side, have accused Christofias of exactly the same thing.

Furthermore, Volkan says that these people have been trained in foreign countries on bicommunal seminars.

Is Papadopoulos an advisor of this paper?

There will be a referendum upon completion of the solution proposal (if they manage to agree that is) as in 2004. People will have they final say, therefore I suggest we wait for now.

[Tim Drayton]

Volkan, the nationalist Turkish Cypriot newspaper has accused Talat that the vast majority of the people that man the Technical Committees and the Working Groups are persons that voted for the Annan Plan.

Similarly, DIKO and EDEK in our side, have accused Christofias of exactly the same thing.

Furthermore, Volkan says that these people have been trained in foreign countries on bicommunal seminars.

Is Papadopoulos an advisor of this paper?

Those Turkish Cypriots who opposed the Annan Plan are partionists. It beggars belief that anybody could wish to see such people serving on these committees which are drawing up the blueprint of what could well be the last ever attempt to reunify this island. It is a bit like recruiting arsonists to the fire brigade!

[Tim Drayton]

Well, there are demented nationalists on both sides. Is that something new?

Perhaps Papadopoulos and Denktas Junior are 'advisers' to Volkan? Who knows? Who cares? These people are now sidelined. Even DIKO and EDEK are sidelined despite the fact their leaderships sided with AKEL and by consequence the votes of their members were associated with backing Christofias. It would have made very little differerence which party backed who. People voted for change and that is what they will hopefully get.

I don't think these people can de-rail the current momentum in solving the Cyprus problem. Can you see that happening?

My reading of the mood among Turkish Cypriots is that if the current round of negotiations goes nowhere, the UBP (Denktash' party) will be voted back in at the next elections. It is logical really - Talat was elected to achieve a settlement and if he fails to do this, the majority of people will shrug their shoulders and say that partition is the only remaining option. It is a mistake to imagine that Denktash, senior or junior, have been permanently sidelined.

[Get Real!]

Volkan, the nationalist Turkish Cypriot newspaper has accused Talat that the vast majority of the people that man the Technical Committees and the Working Groups are persons that voted for the Annan Plan.

Similarly, DIKO and EDEK in our side, have accused Christofias of exactly the same thing.

Furthermore, Volkan says that these people have been trained in foreign countries on bicommunal seminars.

Is Papadopoulos an advisor of this paper?

Anglo-American attempts to "train" short-sighted GC & TC fools into yet another ethnic-based Cypriot disaster will be met by far more resistance than the AP in 2004 and if Christofias falls for it, I predict an ill-fated political career much like that of Anastasiades...

[-mikkie2-]

"It is a mistake to imagine that Denktash, senior or junior, have been permanently sidelined."

The real issue is Turkish EU membership.

If there is no solution and the Turkish side attempts to table views and ideas that they know the GC's will find unacceptable, then Turkey will have a major problem on her hands. The fact is Cyprus is an EU member. If there is no solution then we will have partition and Turkey excluded from the EU. I don't believe Turkey will want exclusion from the EU. It will have to compromise at some point and that is the reality, contrary to what many TC's think.

I think that it is telling that the Christofias government is serioous about finding a solution by the noises it is making. For example, it highlights the need to make the public aware of what a solution to the problem would mean and the compromises that would be made. I personally think that as long as Christofias plays his cards right (and this is my big worry!), we will have a solution.

The crux of the matter is the refugees and return of land. The TC's will need to accept that they cannot have it all their own way. The more autonomy they want will have to paid for by a higher % return of land to the GC's. On the other side, the stronger the central federal government (which is what the GC side wants) then the less land will be returned but a higher % of refugees to return under TC control. The balances are very fine but I think this balance can be found. All other aspects have been talked to death and we know roughly what the final set up will be.

The stakes are high for both sides and it affects the wider region. That is why the status quo suited pretty much everybody up till now and that is why a solution is imperative.

[Piratis]

Volkan, the nationalist Turkish Cypriot newspaper has accused Talat that the vast majority of the people that man the Technical Committees and the Working Groups are persons that voted for the Annan Plan.

Similarly, DIKO and EDEK in our side, have accused Christofias of exactly the same thing.

Furthermore, Volkan says that these people have been trained in foreign countries on bicommunal seminars.

Is Papadopoulos an advisor of this paper?

Bananiot, since it is a bit difficult for you to understand it, let me draw if for you:

TCs who want an official partition <----> TCs who want disguised partition <----> GCs who accept disguised partition <----> GCs who do not accept partition.

So your position is very close to the position of the people of Volkan, just not close enough. On the other hand, our position is the opposite of those fascists of Volkan.

If you have any doubts to this then answer this question:

The partitionists of this forum (VP, Zan Murataga etc) with whom agree more, with you or with me? With you. Why? Because your position is very close to theirs: Partition of Cyprus.

On the other hand, I never agree with those partitionists, while I agree with Kikapu or Bir (the non partitionists TCs) the 99% of the time.

Now about the people in the committees and the Annan plan:

The majority of TCs voted for the Annan plan. Therefore the Annan plan supporters within the TC community represent the majority and this means they can correctly represent the TC community.

On the other hand, only a small minority of GCs voted for the Annan plan. Therefore those Annan plan supporters are not representative of the GC community.

Who should be at the negations and committees are people that represent the majority of each community. Otherwise whats the point if they will agree on things that the Cypriot people will reject in a referendum?

[Bananiot]

Poor old Piratis has not yet realised that since February we have a new President with a new mandate. The old President was sent home by the vast majority vote (I am enjoying this) because the people did not finally realise that he was ugly but because the people condemned his policies.

Unforunately we will not be negotiating with Birkibrisly and Kikapu for a final solution but with Talat and Turkey. We cannot choose, again unfortunately, with whom we would be making a deal, unless Piratis has an ace under his slip.

The solution will be a compromise for all of us, Turks and Greeks and if we fail to compromise then partition cannot be avoided. In my book partition is far worst than the worse compromise solution. Just remember also that every time we went hell bent for maximum we ended up crying over disaster.

[-mikkie2-]

The overidding factor here is Turkish EU membership.

Turkey is being repeatedly warned by the EU that the Cyprus problem needs to be solved. It is not just a matter of solving it either way - unification under a federation or partition.

If its partition this is obviously unacceptable for us and the consequence is Turkey will never become a member of the EU and the Eastern Mediterranean will remain unstable. Turkey seems to want to play the card that we can never agree on the solution or a solution that she is happy with. Unfortunately for Turkey it will also mean exclusion from the EU and Turkey knows this.

Ultimately, Turkey will have to compromise, just as we have to compromise because there is more at stake than just Cyprus.

The fact that Christofias was voted president means that the Papadopoulos policy is a failure. Christofias won on the promise that he will make solving the Cyrpus problem his priority. If Christofias and Talat agree a solution and present it to the people then ultimately, the people will vote for it in a referendum.

It is very telling that Christofias has said that the public needs to be prepared for the solution and that the public needs to be informed on what that will mean and the compromises that will need to be made.