Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oracle]

... We too have made many mistakes, but with attitude like yours and Piratis you prove Denktash right everytime, ...

... VP this is the first time I hear you admitting mistakes on both sides. Actually I applaud this because it gives you more credibility....

..... why should I be forced to live in a GC state?

PS I have admitted our mistakes in past posts and even apologised but as you know people only read and remember what they want.

As Humanist says, such an admission is to be applauded. But I can't find these mistakes that have been confessed, only some sweeping statements and gesturing throwaway remarks.

Starting afresh ..... What are those mistakes the Turk-TCs admit to having made?
Mistakes that you (personal and collective) are not proud of and would rather not have carried out or have had happen.

How could those mistakes have been carried out differently? ... given the benefit of hindsight.

We have the freedom to make mistakes and by admitting to them they cease to be crimes.

Personal request: It would be really good if VP and the other Turk-TCs stated what they consider as the mistakes and their alternatives and eventually hopefully the GCs will chip in with our mistakes; and we can have a genuine exchange .... without the usual abusive [especially to me] hurlings, no matter how witty!

[denizaksulu]

After Independence, a brother-in-law of mine from Kophinou, had a picture of President Makarios and Vice President Dr.F.Kucuk signing the Zurich Agreement. He was asked why did he have a phtograph of Makarios on the wall. He replied, "this is history in the making" , and added "from now on we will be living in peace".

Little did he know, that within a few years, that peace he had hoped for would be shattered. In 1967 he was facing the wild gangs and the National Guard, who attacked his village and where many were killed. This was not the peace he had hoped for.

Our first mistake was to trust Pres. Makarios not to try and alter the Constitution, to make it unucceptable to the TurkishCypriot population.

[Get Real!]

Waiting for honest TC member replies is like waiting for cows to come home…

"The Greek National Organization of Cypriot Fighters (EOKA) was initially anti-British, but the British formed a Turkish auxiliary police force and used it against the Greeks, in such a way that the two communities clashed with each other. That was when attacks started to be diverted towards the Turks."

http://www.turkishdailynews.com.tr/arti ... wsid=59288

[denizaksulu]

Waiting for honest TC member replies is like waiting for cows to come home…

"The Greek National Organization of Cypriot Fighters (EOKA) was initially anti-British, but the British formed a Turkish auxiliary police force and used it against the Greeks, in such a way that the two communities clashed with each other. That was when attacks started to be diverted towards the Turks."

http://www.turkishdailynews.com.tr/arti ... wsid=59288

GR, not all honest members (TC or GC) have a PC at their workplace. You are specially privileged, why, you even go to bed with one (if you ever go to bed that is).

[Get Real!]

Waiting for honest TC member replies is like waiting for cows to come home…

"The Greek National Organization of Cypriot Fighters (EOKA) was initially anti-British, but the British formed a Turkish auxiliary police force and used it against the Greeks, in such a way that the two communities clashed with each other. That was when attacks started to be diverted towards the Turks."

http://www.turkishdailynews.com.tr/arti ... wsid=59288

GR, not all honest members (TC or GC) have a PC at their workplace. You are specially privileged, why, you even go to bed with one (if you ever go to bed that is).

Having spent countless hours debating with TCs, the two things that spring to my mind the most upon hearing the words "Turkish Cypriot" these days, are the disappointing DISHONESTY and MISINFORMATION...

[umit07]

The same I can say for most GC's GR.

[Oracle]

Our first mistake was to trust Pres. Makarios not to try and alter the Constitution, to make it unucceptable to the TurkishCypriot population.

You are saying that you trusted the Constitution would remain unmodified, even if found unworkable, and you were disappointed.

How did you react to this knowledge that it was up for alteration?

Do you endorse the methods employed to prevent the proposed changes?

In hindsight, what other steps could have been taken to prevent the modifications, which may have led to a more satisfactory outcome, for all concerned?

Remembering that the Constitution for Independence was allowing us the Freedom to move towards a genuine Democracy; at what point did an 18% group decide they should impose stagnation to the rest of the Cypriot population?

How much was known of the planned improvements, before deciding they were unacceptable for TCs?

Were they unacceptable because they were deemed unfair to TCs only or to Cypriots generally?

[denizaksulu]

Waiting for honest TC member replies is like waiting for cows to come home…

"The Greek National Organization of Cypriot Fighters (EOKA) was initially anti-British, but the British formed a Turkish auxiliary police force and used it against the Greeks, in such a way that the two communities clashed with each other. That was when attacks started to be diverted towards the Turks."

http://www.turkishdailynews.com.tr/arti ... wsid=59288

GR, not all honest members (TC or GC) have a PC at their workplace. You are specially privileged, why, you even go to bed with one (if you ever go to bed that is).

Having spent countless hours debating with TCs, the two things that spring to my mind the most upon hearing the words "Turkish Cypriot" these days, are the disappointing DISHONESTY and MISINFORMATION...

I often use 'Turkish speaking' or 'Greek speaking' Cypriots. On this occasion I used the wording as per the Constitution of the Republic Cyprus. Cant please you all the time GR.

[Get Real!]

The same I can say for most GC's GR.

Unfortunately, you are one such perpetrator of misinformation... so start worrying about YOUR part in this.

[denizaksulu]

Our first mistake was to trust Pres. Makarios not to try and alter the Constitution, to make it unucceptable to the TurkishCypriot population.

You are saying that you trusted the Constitution would remain unmodified, even if found unworkable, and you were disappointed.

How did you react to this knowledge that it was up for alteration?

Do you endorse the methods employed to prevent the proposed changes?

In hindsight, what other steps could have been taken to prevent the modifications, which may have led to a more satisfactory outcome, for all concerned?

Remembering that the Constitution for Independence was allowing us the Freedom to move towards a genuine Democracy; at what point did an 18% group decide they should impose stagnation to the rest of the Cypriot population?

How much was known of the planned improvements, before deciding they were unacceptable for TCs?

Were they unacceptable because they were deemed unfair to TCs only or to Cypriots generally?

Whether the 30:70 proportion was fair or not, it was obvious to many of the TCs what the real intention of the 'majority' GC were.

I used the word 'we' in the plural. I was 'apolitical' at the time but very well aware of the problems caused to TCs regarding the Municipalities. It was bad enoutgh that any finacial improvement in the Turkish sector was hindered, you wanted more - under the guise of proportional representation. As stated in the Politis, the actions culminating in the events of Dec 1963 were planned long before the disclosure of the goverments intentions.