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Legalities and Illegalities ... Mean Nothing Anymore!

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby Oracle » Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:30 am

umit07 wrote:Well Oracle I think it must be something we learnt from your "Greek Culture", like when you decided it was "unfair" to obide to your country's "primary law" the constitution. You went so far that the bloody foreign judge of the highest court had to resign due to the GC's not taking him seriously. So I guess we ended up finding ourselves in old Texas were guns talk. You can't just use terms like justice when it suits you.


Are you saying you only learn from chosen negative aspects of our culture ... and yet ignore the rest.

The Constitution was not drawn up by us, just like invaders were not invited by us. Both are wrong ... so why should we be forced to accept them?

If a judge resigned, that is not the first time .... and at least we did not shoot him:

Washington Post wrote:Judge Killed in Attack On Turkish High Court

By Yesim Borg and Karl Vick
Washington Post Foreign Service
Thursday, May 18, 2006; Page A19

ISTANBUL, May 17 -- A gunman opened fire on judges in Turkey's highest administrative court on Wednesday, killing one and wounding four after shouting "God is great!" and "We are God's ambassadors!"

Police and witnesses said the attacker, who was arrested and being interrogated by anti-terrorist police, was a lawyer who was incensed over a ruling further restricting Islamic dress in Turkey. The shooting occurred at midmorning in the heart of Ankara, the capital of a republic founded 83 years ago on principles that regard Islam as a threat to democratic governance in a country that is 99 percent Muslim.

Police detain Alpaslan Arslan, who allegedly killed one judge and wounded four others in response to a court ruling further restricting Islamic dress. (Associated Press)

Shortly after the ambulances carried away the wounded -- one of whom, Mustafa Yucel Ozbilgin, died at the hospital after being shot in the head -- limousines began arriving with visiting dignitaries expressing condolences. One, Turkey's avowedly secular president, Ahmet Necdet Sezer, a former judge, declared, "This attack is aimed at the unchangeable secular and democratic characters of the republic."

But court officials snubbed Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan, a onetime proponent of political Islam who had publicly criticized the high court ruling that officials said incensed the gunman.

The administrative court ruled in February that under Turkish law -- which bars female employees from wearing Islamic head scarves in state workplaces -- a kindergarten teacher could be denied a promotion for covering her head on her way to school, on the grounds she set a bad example for children.

The suspect, identified as Alpaslan Arslan, "said the attack was punishment for the ruling on the head scarf," acting Chief Judge Tansel Colasan told reporters. Before opening fire with a 9mm pistol, Colasan said, the attacker shouted, "We are God's ambassadors! We are His soldiers!"

Police said they found newspaper photographs of several judges in the assailant's car, according to the semiofficial Anatolian news agency. A pro-Islamic daily, Vakit, published photos of the jurists on its front page after the ruling. Last week, one high court judge, Sumru Cortoglu, complained in a speech that "by using personal photos or information of members of the judiciary, some are trying to turn them into targets."

The shooting came with tensions already rising between Erdogan's populist Justice and Development Party and the secular establishment, which is anchored in the judiciary, the powerful military and the presidency of Sezer, whose term expires next year. Erdogan's party controls parliament, which will elect Sezer's successor, and Erdogan might seek the office first held by Turkey's secular founder, Mustafa Kemal Ataturk.

Erdogan "is trying to open his way to the presidency," said Mehmet Farac, an expert on radical Islam at Cumhuriyet, a staunchly pro-secular daily. "However, the society is reacting to him taking the seat that belonged to Ataturk. The Islamic section reacts against this reaction. There may be new attacks."

Cumhuriyet has been attacked by firebombs three times in recent weeks, reportedly by Islamic radicals incensed by the newspaper's print and television ads accusing Erdogan's party of undermining the republic.

"I hope those who still can't see where Turkey is being dragged, who refuse to see it, will take this as a warning," Deniz Baykal, leader of Ataturk's Republican People's Party, said after Wednesday's attack. "Unfortunately, blood has spilled into politics in Turkey. Turkey is being dragged into a very dangerous situation. Everybody should come to their senses."

But key questions remained unanswered in the first hours after the attack. CNN Turk television quoted unnamed police sources as saying the suspect appeared to be linked to a radical Islamic group called Turkish Hezbollah, while the Anatolian news agency reported that he described himself to his interrogators as "an extreme nationalist."

Erdogan, who describes Islam not as a threat to Turkey's secular government but as a moral guide that informs his party's socially conservative agenda, called for restraint. "Associating today's attack with any side would not be right," he said. "We cannot accept any incident designed to hurt stability in Turkey."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 01898.html
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Postby Viewpoint » Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:50 am

Are these guys for real? they sign an agreement renege on it because it doesn't serve their purpose of gifting Cyprus to Greece, try to eradicate the stumbling block namely the TCs and then complain about us fighting back. Man these people are mind warped and suffering from dementia, if you play with a bomb and explodes you cant complain about the outcome which in this case is division and loss of land, you should have stopped playing with the bomb when you were warned not to.
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Postby Oracle » Fri Apr 18, 2008 10:12 am

Viewpoint wrote:Are these guys for real? they sign an agreement renege on it because it doesn't serve their purpose of gifting Cyprus to Greece, try to eradicate the stumbling block namely the TCs and then complain about us fighting back. Man these people are mind warped and suffering from dementia, if you play with a bomb and explodes you cant complain about the outcome which in this case is division and loss of land, you should have stopped playing with the bomb when you were warned not to.


So now you admit you were an unexploded bomb, living amongst us. Perhaps that might convey the unease we felt with your possession of so much power, gifted to you by the British, who like evil guardians left us to play with a bomb.
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Postby Viewpoint » Fri Apr 18, 2008 10:29 am

Oracle wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:Are these guys for real? they sign an agreement renege on it because it doesn't serve their purpose of gifting Cyprus to Greece, try to eradicate the stumbling block namely the TCs and then complain about us fighting back. Man these people are mind warped and suffering from dementia, if you play with a bomb and explodes you cant complain about the outcome which in this case is division and loss of land, you should have stopped playing with the bomb when you were warned not to.


So now you admit you were an unexploded bomb, living amongst us. Perhaps that might convey the unease we felt with your possession of so much power, gifted to you by the British, who like evil guardians left us to play with a bomb.


A bomb left alone will never explode, its the same for every community/country, play with it or even worse kick it around, treat it badly and it will surely go off in your face. You should have headed the warnings that turning Cyprus into Greece was going to explode in your face.
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Postby observer » Fri Apr 18, 2008 11:03 am

growuptcs wrote:Dont say we didnt want you on the island. Thats the smokescreen that you been using still to this day. It's ridiculous how you spew it out like its all true. You knew who we had to fight to gain independence, while you were backstabbing us. And besides that, I have hatred for you because of denying me my land. Considering that you never even hung out with a GC, whats with your hatred other than looking to keep his land?

This is simply untrue. Makarios, EOKA, and much of the GC population if wall graffitti and flags are to be believed, were not fighting for independence. They were fighting to become part of Greece. Why should any TC help you become part of Greece?

If you could bring back to life any of the EOKA guys who were killed in the 1950s they would be amazed to discover that they had been fighting for independence.
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Postby Oracle » Fri Apr 18, 2008 11:48 am

observer wrote:
growuptcs wrote:Dont say we didnt want you on the island. Thats the smokescreen that you been using still to this day. It's ridiculous how you spew it out like its all true. You knew who we had to fight to gain independence, while you were backstabbing us. And besides that, I have hatred for you because of denying me my land. Considering that you never even hung out with a GC, whats with your hatred other than looking to keep his land?

This is simply untrue. Makarios, EOKA, and much of the GC population if wall graffitti and flags are to be believed, were not fighting for independence. They were fighting to become part of Greece. Why should any TC help you become part of Greece?

If you could bring back to life any of the EOKA guys who were killed in the 1950s they would be amazed to discover that they had been fighting for independence.


This is the saddest excuse I ever heard of anyone ever starting a war.

It beats the lie about "weapons of mass distraction".

Banksy had better disarm himself of those spray cans, before he becomes the cause of WWIII.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XXSg8BApBwA
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Me6-aX7vh ... re=related
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Postby observer » Fri Apr 18, 2008 1:03 pm

Oracle wrote:
observer wrote:
growuptcs wrote:Dont say we didnt want you on the island. Thats the smokescreen that you been using still to this day. It's ridiculous how you spew it out like its all true. You knew who we had to fight to gain independence, while you were backstabbing us. And besides that, I have hatred for you because of denying me my land. Considering that you never even hung out with a GC, whats with your hatred other than looking to keep his land?

This is simply untrue. Makarios, EOKA, and much of the GC population if wall graffitti and flags are to be believed, were not fighting for independence. They were fighting to become part of Greece. Why should any TC help you become part of Greece?

If you could bring back to life any of the EOKA guys who were killed in the 1950s they would be amazed to discover that they had been fighting for independence.


This is the saddest excuse I ever heard of anyone ever starting a war.

It beats the lie about "weapons of mass distraction".

Banksy had better disarm himself of those spray cans, before he becomes the cause of WWIII.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XXSg8BApBwA
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Me6-aX7vh ... re=related


Somehow this got diverted from a statement you made (on another thread?) that EOKA were fighting for independence not union with Greece.

Your statement is simply not true.
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Postby Oracle » Fri Apr 18, 2008 1:56 pm

observer wrote:
Oracle wrote:
observer wrote:
growuptcs wrote:Dont say we didnt want you on the island. Thats the smokescreen that you been using still to this day. It's ridiculous how you spew it out like its all true. You knew who we had to fight to gain independence, while you were backstabbing us. And besides that, I have hatred for you because of denying me my land. Considering that you never even hung out with a GC, whats with your hatred other than looking to keep his land?

This is simply untrue. Makarios, EOKA, and much of the GC population if wall graffitti and flags are to be believed, were not fighting for independence. They were fighting to become part of Greece. Why should any TC help you become part of Greece?

If you could bring back to life any of the EOKA guys who were killed in the 1950s they would be amazed to discover that they had been fighting for independence.


This is the saddest excuse I ever heard of anyone ever starting a war.

It beats the lie about "weapons of mass distraction".

Banksy had better disarm himself of those spray cans, before he becomes the cause of WWIII.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XXSg8BApBwA
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Me6-aX7vh ... re=related


Somehow this got diverted from a statement you made (on another thread?) that EOKA were fighting for independence not union with Greece.

Your statement is simply not true.

I don't know about this tenuous link as the quotes above indicate you taking growuptcs to task about Independence ... anyway, press on!.

It's very easy to muddy the waters regarding the primary objective of EOKA ... especially since a number of them went on to form EOKA B.

But the fear to the British of what EOKA were fighting for was Independence.

A summation of the main points of Grivas' EOKA campaign, from his own memoirs ... clearly indicates that until Independence, all their actions were directed towards gaining Independence ...

1. From inception until arrival of Harding EOKA's actions were characterised by sabotage, strikes, demonstrations and sporadic attacks against the British.

2. Until the exile of Makarios III British soldiers were ambushed, the youth movement (ANE) organised, the Battle of Spilia fought.

3. Until the first ceasefire the British enacted draconian measures to eliminate EOKA, who counterattack and attempt to kill Harding. Mass demonstrations and general strikes continued.

4. Unil the 2nd ceasefire EOKA continued to attack British military personnel. Turkish-Cypriots demanded partition. EOKA fighters Markos Drakos, Michalis Georgalas and Grigoris Afxentiou killed in battles.

5. Until Harding's replacement EOKA limited their attacks in an effort to free Makarios III from exile. Makarios freed. Turkish-Cypriots co-operate with the British against EOKA. Harding back home.

6. MacMillan plan announced. Foot appointed and seeks to meet Grivas. TCs continue attacks against Greeks + properties. EOKA resume attacks on the British.

7. Until the Cypriot matter discussed in the UN (Nov. 1958). EOKA strike back against the TC extremists. British "divide and conquer" policy succeeds. Four EOKA fighters killed in the Battle of Liopetri. Kyriakos Matsis killed at Dikomo.

8. From then until the Zurich and London agreements (Feb. 1959) violence subsided as Greece and Turkey discussed the future and the island of Cyprus becme an independent republic.
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Postby Get Real! » Fri Apr 18, 2008 2:02 pm

Police detain Alpaslan Arslan, who allegedly killed one judge and wounded four others in response to a court ruling further restricting Islamic dress. (Associated Press)

:shock: :shock: :shock:

Is that "Alpie" by any chance Deniz??? :shock:
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Postby Eric dayi » Fri Apr 18, 2008 2:12 pm

Oracle wrote:
observer wrote:
Oracle wrote:
observer wrote:
growuptcs wrote:Dont say we didnt want you on the island. Thats the smokescreen that you been using still to this day. It's ridiculous how you spew it out like its all true. You knew who we had to fight to gain independence, while you were backstabbing us. And besides that, I have hatred for you because of denying me my land. Considering that you never even hung out with a GC, whats with your hatred other than looking to keep his land?

This is simply untrue. Makarios, EOKA, and much of the GC population if wall graffitti and flags are to be believed, were not fighting for independence. They were fighting to become part of Greece. Why should any TC help you become part of Greece?

If you could bring back to life any of the EOKA guys who were killed in the 1950s they would be amazed to discover that they had been fighting for independence.


This is the saddest excuse I ever heard of anyone ever starting a war.

It beats the lie about "weapons of mass distraction".

Banksy had better disarm himself of those spray cans, before he becomes the cause of WWIII.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XXSg8BApBwA
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Me6-aX7vh ... re=related


Somehow this got diverted from a statement you made (on another thread?) that EOKA were fighting for independence not union with Greece.

Your statement is simply not true.

I don't know about this tenuous link as the quotes above indicate you taking growuptcs to task about Independence ... anyway, press on!.

It's very easy to muddy the waters regarding the primary objective of EOKA ... especially since a number of them went on to form EOKA B.

But the fear to the British of what EOKA were fighting for was Independence.

A summation of the main points of Grivas' EOKA campaign, from his own memoirs ... clearly indicates that until Independence, all their actions were directed towards gaining Independence ...


:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:


EOKA (Ethniki Organosis Kyprion Agoniston)

EOKA [Ethniki Organosis Kyprion Agoniston - National Organization of Cypriot Fighters] started a guerrilla campaign against British colonial rule aimed at self-determination and union with Greece (Enosis)on 01 April 1955. The campaign, which started when the first EOKA bombs exploded at 00.30 hours on 1st of April 1955, lasted until 1959 and caused the death of more Greek Cypriot civilians than the total of British killed. It created civil strife and mistrust between the two Cypriot communities. Tension increased in early 1957, when EOKA attacked Turkish police and auxiliaries. EOKA received direct support from Greece in money, arms, organization and propaganda. Greek-speaking Cypriots were awed by EOKA terrorists and subject to bombardment by Athens radio.


http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... a/eoka.htm

I won't even bother with the rest of your crap.
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