Cyprus-Forum.com

[denizaksulu]

We must look at things in a clear and concise fashion not allowing our judgement to be clouded by preconceived notions and prejudices.Turkey is a vast country with an ever expanding infrastructure , a country that has the capacity to take on the best in Europe as far as manufactured goods are concerned , Turkish refrigeration , glassware manufacture domestic appliances and consumer goods of all type are well received in Europe. The Turkish business man is as acute and efficient as his European counterparts. We need Turkey to continue making strides in the direction of progress for the benefit of the Turkish people and those around them. A Turkey out of Europe WOULD BE DETRIMENTAL TO THE INTERESTS OF OUR FUTURE GENERATIONS OF CYPRIOTS.

If Turkey becomes a modern state it will not be a threat to Cyprus or anyone else ..... but an equal World partner.

However joining Europe would be detrimental for the identity of Turkey ...

Oracle, if Turkey does join in, then losing its identity is their rather than your problem. what would you be worried about next?

[alexISS]

.....and pigs may fly. No way.

As in "no way will they ever drag the Prime Minister and the ruling party to court"? The people who actually run Turkey are very unstable and unpredictable Deniz. I too am almost sure that Turkey will never attack Cyprus, but for that 0.1% chance it does, Cyprus (and Greece) have to be prepared

What do YOU think Turkeys aims would be to send more troops to Cyprus?

I have no idea, but I also have no idea why they keep the ones they already have there.

[DT.]

Miltiades post speaks for itself ... just how much Turkey needs to concentrate on improving the quality of life of its people.

How can it improve that quality of life?

Abandoning invading / occupying other countries would be a start ... leaving it to concentrate on internal matters.

Reducing its Military Might would do it a lot of favours ... leave it stronger not weaker.They would then have the required revenue to invest in schools and hospitals.

It already possesses potential .... it does not need Europe to help financially.

Why dont I trust your crocodile tears oracle? (highlights)

Cyprus would have been a Greek province then.

If that had happened GR and others would be fighting a war of independence now against Greece.

[denizaksulu]

Miltiades post speaks for itself ... just how much Turkey needs to concentrate on improving the quality of life of its people.

How can it improve that quality of life?

Abandoning invading / occupying other countries would be a start ... leaving it to concentrate on internal matters.

Reducing its Military Might would do it a lot of favours ... leave it stronger not weaker.They would then have the required revenue to invest in schools and hospitals.

It already possesses potential .... it does not need Europe to help financially.

Why dont I trust your crocodile tears oracle? (highlights)

Cyprus would have been a Greek province then.

If that had happened GR and others would be fighting a war of independence now against Greece.

Maybe. Another thing we will never find out But. A very big but;Those GCs that did not want Enosis, the ones who were too scared or without a voice would have gone along with it except for the few brave ones. Ofcourse they came across the might of Turkey and saw like Pres. Makarios, that although ideal it was not feasable.

We will never know. Too many ifs.

[denizaksulu]

So in short who is to blame for turning a poor uneducated idiots in a country?...and this is the million dollar question?

Are they themselves, people, to blame?...or the state that is suppose to look after them?

Education is the key here people..."turkey=fascist state" should be investing highly in this direction and not the deep state investing by signing billions upon billions in a war machine...billions upon billions she really ain't got in the first place, bankrupting the country...with reliance to the IMF project, making her the 2nd highest recepient to this very day...a shameful act...

"turkey=fascist state" is a NATO member and she does not require to be signing billions upon billions of war machine projects...

[color=red]Very little differance between Turkey and Iraq under Saddam. Just like Iraq which was ruled by a despot, Turkey too is run by a group of despots (the Generals of the Turkish Army). [/color]They spend billions on arms and do not care about their own citizens by spending on health and education. What a sad example of a nation which is trying to join the EU no less. I feel so sorry for the majority who Shah descibes as the "uneducated idiots". One day the majority referred to by Shah as the uneducated idiots will revolutionize and claim their rights. They will claim their rights for a better health and education system and turn Turkey into a modern real democracy where health and education is a higher priority than the military. Then and only then will Turkey mature and be fit for EU entry, provided that they withdraw from Cyprus as well.

Thanks for the statistics Miltiades. My only hope is that the ultra nationalists on this forum take note and change their mentality. The life span and education of their children depends on it. The plight of the majority in Turkey is a disgrace and is so sad. One could say that it is a violation of human rights. Spending billions upon billions on military hardware when at the same time Turkey has a hight illiteracy rate, lower life expectancy due to inadequate education and health system.

Bafidis, your comparison of Turkey to Iraq is a bit OTT. Where in Iraq there was no Democracy at all, In Turkey it is the 'democracy' which is causing Turkey its current problems. I am sure you know that.

[Paphitis]

So in short who is to blame for turning a poor uneducated idiots in a country?...and this is the million dollar question?

Are they themselves, people, to blame?...or the state that is suppose to look after them?

Education is the key here people..."turkey=fascist state" should be investing highly in this direction and not the deep state investing by signing billions upon billions in a war machine...billions upon billions she really ain't got in the first place, bankrupting the country...with reliance to the IMF project, making her the 2nd highest recepient to this very day...a shameful act...

"turkey=fascist state" is a NATO member and she does not require to be signing billions upon billions of war machine projects...

[color=red]Very little differance between Turkey and Iraq under Saddam. Just like Iraq which was ruled by a despot, Turkey too is run by a group of despots (the Generals of the Turkish Army). [/color]They spend billions on arms and do not care about their own citizens by spending on health and education. What a sad example of a nation which is trying to join the EU no less. I feel so sorry for the majority who Shah descibes as the "uneducated idiots". One day the majority referred to by Shah as the uneducated idiots will revolutionize and claim their rights. They will claim their rights for a better health and education system and turn Turkey into a modern real democracy where health and education is a higher priority than the military. Then and only then will Turkey mature and be fit for EU entry, provided that they withdraw from Cyprus as well.

Thanks for the statistics Miltiades. My only hope is that the ultra nationalists on this forum take note and change their mentality. The life span and education of their children depends on it. The plight of the majority in Turkey is a disgrace and is so sad. One could say that it is a violation of human rights. Spending billions upon billions on military hardware when at the same time Turkey has a hight illiteracy rate, lower life expectancy due to inadequate education and health system.

Bafidis, your comparison of Turkey to Iraq is a bit OTT. Where in Iraq there was no Democracy at all, In Turkey it is the 'democracy' which is causing Turkey its current problems. I am sure you know that.

The point I was hoping to make is that Turkish democracy is almost a furvy. In other words, the establishemnt that is really in control are the Turkish Generals and we all know that they have not been elected by the people. Turkey is basically divided between the islamists which have elected the current government and the establishment consisting of Kemalists who are led by the Generals and who are basically the ones that control the country.

Definateley not a fine example of democracy. Are you saying that Turkey is better off under a military dictatorship?

[denizaksulu]

So in short who is to blame for turning a poor uneducated idiots in a country?...and this is the million dollar question?

Are they themselves, people, to blame?...or the state that is suppose to look after them?

Education is the key here people..."turkey=fascist state" should be investing highly in this direction and not the deep state investing by signing billions upon billions in a war machine...billions upon billions she really ain't got in the first place, bankrupting the country...with reliance to the IMF project, making her the 2nd highest recepient to this very day...a shameful act...

"turkey=fascist state" is a NATO member and she does not require to be signing billions upon billions of war machine projects...

[color=red]Very little differance between Turkey and Iraq under Saddam. Just like Iraq which was ruled by a despot, Turkey too is run by a group of despots (the Generals of the Turkish Army). [/color]They spend billions on arms and do not care about their own citizens by spending on health and education. What a sad example of a nation which is trying to join the EU no less. I feel so sorry for the majority who Shah descibes as the "uneducated idiots". One day the majority referred to by Shah as the uneducated idiots will revolutionize and claim their rights. They will claim their rights for a better health and education system and turn Turkey into a modern real democracy where health and education is a higher priority than the military. Then and only then will Turkey mature and be fit for EU entry, provided that they withdraw from Cyprus as well.

Thanks for the statistics Miltiades. My only hope is that the ultra nationalists on this forum take note and change their mentality. The life span and education of their children depends on it. The plight of the majority in Turkey is a disgrace and is so sad. One could say that it is a violation of human rights. Spending billions upon billions on military hardware when at the same time Turkey has a hight illiteracy rate, lower life expectancy due to inadequate education and health system.

Bafidis, your comparison of Turkey to Iraq is a bit OTT. Where in Iraq there was no Democracy at all, In Turkey it is the 'democracy' which is causing Turkey its current problems. I am sure you know that.

The point I was hoping to make is that Turkish democracy is almost a furvy. In other words, the establishemnt that is really in control are the Turkish Generals and we all know that they have not been elected by the people. Turkey is basically divided between the islamists which have elected the current government and the establishment consisting of Kemalists who are led by the Generals and who are basically the ones that control the country.

Definateley not a fine example of democracy.

Well its the kind of Democracy that keeps Turkey from falling apart. Perhaps you could have compared T to old Jugoslavia. Then I would not have commented. Perhaps.

[Paphitis]

Do you believe that Turkey is better off under a military dictatorship?

[denizaksulu]

Do you beleive that Turkey is better off under a military dictatorship?

Certainly not. But have been aware that it is the Military which are keeping the Politicians on a forward path without wandering too much off the narrow and straight. It might not be the democracy you believe in but it is the one that prevents Turkey falling to pieces (like Post Tito, Yugoslavia.) or civil war between the 'religious' and the secular. Since the peasants and the 'religous 'lot outnumber the secular, that would be a bloody business. In other words itsthe Military which is the 'cement' of Turkey.

[Oracle]

Miltiades post speaks for itself ... just how much Turkey needs to concentrate on improving the quality of life of its people.

How can it improve that quality of life?

Abandoning invading / occupying other countries would be a start ... leaving it to concentrate on internal matters.

Reducing its Military Might would do it a lot of favours ... leave it stronger not weaker.They would then have the required revenue to invest in schools and hospitals.

It already possesses potential .... it does not need Europe to help financially.

Why dont I trust your crocodile tears oracle? (highlights)

Cyprus would have been a Greek province then.

If that had happened GR and others would be fighting a war of independence now against Greece.

... Either that or he would have fallen in love with a Spartan Warrior and found happiness at last!