Cyprus-Forum.com

[humanist]

yeap you got me right eric. i cannot lie to to an inteligent person like you

[DT.]

and your a knob who cant answer a simple question...
seriously dont you have to be elsewhere trying to convince the world that there are .5 million, 1 million or 1.5 million armenian missing?? which number do you subscribe to??

Why? You want to add one more to it? Is this what happens when you lose your temper?

[Viewpoint]

Piratis

So every territory that was conquered by the Ottomans stopped being Greek, Serbian, Bulgarian, Egyptian etc, and became Turkish according to you?

Ottoman Empire.

Ottoman Empire what? You can oppress people and enslave them, this doesn't mean that Athens or Crete or Cyprus stop being Greek because they came under Ottoman rule.

An equivalent to the Native Americans and Australian Aborigines would be the Greeks in Asia Minor. There in the middle ages you managed to exterminate most of them and make them a minority in Asia Minor, just like it happened to the Native Americans and Australian Aborigines.

Correct that was the practice in those days nothing different in many parts of the world.

Of those days yes. But apparently you want to continue with the same middle age practices today. What was the norm then, today it is considered criminal. Otherwise Hitler would just be considered just another great conqueror, and not a criminal.

The Native Americans can not unite USA with Canada not because they are native, but because they are the minority of that country. If the great majority of Americans and Canadians wanted to unite their countries would any minority be able to deny this to them? In fact that is how the various states where united to form the USA.

If the minority do not want to accept what the majority is forcing on them, if they feel threatened then the natural reaction is to fight for what you believe is right, this causes division such as we have today in Cyprus.

No my friend. A minority has no right to take guns and stating killing people just because they do not like the democratic choice of the country as a whole. We didn't ask for a single of your human rights to be violated. The only thing we asked for is for our island to be part of the free Greek state. How it was fine for you when Cyprus was part of the Ottoman and British empires against the will of Cypriots themselves, but it was not fine to be part of the Greek state which is what the great majority of Cypriots wanted?

But in Cyprus you didn't become the majority, you are a minority just like the minority of Turks in Greece and Bulgaria, or the whites in Africa and South America. So how can you demand to determine the destiny of this island against the will of the majority of people? Maybe the Turks in Greece, Bulgaria or Germany should do the same as well? Maybe the Whites in Africa or south America should demand the same?

We have been the minority in numbers but this did not make us any less a partner, the 1960 agreements which you signed is proof. Do these other minorities have such an agreements, the threat from the GC community was so vast that the only way to stop the GCs gifting Cyprus to Greece was to ensure that the TC who faced discrimination, persecution and death could say NO. No one can change history therefore these agreements which give our community rights, we will never allow to remove them as you did back in the 1960s.

Those "rights" where given to you by the British colonizers because you helped them to oppress our revolution and keep Cyprus enslaved, not because you were in any danger. In fact you were the ones you started the conflict in the 1950s and started to kill us and demand our death and our ethic cleansing.

Apparently what you want to do today is to continue with middle age practices and conquer the north part of our country and exterminate us from it. Well, it is not the middle ages anymore, and you continuing with such Nazi practices is not acceptable in the 21st century. Trying to excuse your actions of today by referring to the practices of the middle ages is something very lame.

This comical explanation of the plight the TCs suffered at the hands of GCs is pathetic, the division of today is a direct result of your own human rights abuses against TCs after agreeing to share the island, which you had no intention of sticking to, thats makes you a bunch of liars who cannot be trusted to stick to any agreements even in the 21st century. Therefore safeguards are vital to ensure you stick to any agreements you sign in the future and that you are fully aware what will happen if you should try to change the situation without our permission.

Greek Cypriots are the ones who suffered and continue to suffer at the hands of Turks. TCs had casualties only when they attacked us and tried to deny to us our freedom and self-determination on our island. We never attacked you first. So it is comical to pretend to be the victim when in fact you have always been and you continue to be the aggressors.

As I said many times the only thing that can bring peace is to give freedom and self determination to Cypriots. Forcing us by putting a gun on our head to sign some agreement that surrenders to you our rights means absolutely nothing to us. Keep this in mind for future reference as well.

When did I admit such a lie? The conflict between GCs and TCs didn't start in 1963, but in 1958 when you attacked us, and collaborated with the British in order to continue to deny to the Cypriot people their freedom and self-determination.

When did we attack you in 1958, lets clarify this claim you keep repeating and see if you know the full chain of events.

When? Isn't it you who started the attacks against us in the 50s, and you who made the demand back then that we should be ethnically cleansed from the north part of our country? We didn't touch you until you attacked us. All we did until then was fight against the colonialists for our liberation.

So who killed the TCs if it wasnt GCs, please provide details, you know this is utter crap and the fact that you moved out of the North was the price you paid for your mistakes when trying to gift Cyprus our home to Greece without our say so.

So when you first came here and occupied Cyprus did you ask us if we wanted you on our island? You didn't. So now why should we take permission from your minority with what we are going to do with our own island? You have the right to say your opinion and to cast your vote any way you like, but you have no right to force your minority opinion.

As far as what you did in the 50s, I posted the British made video many times. It is undeniable that you are the ones who started the intercommunal conflict by attacking us. Until then we were fighting against the colonialists and we had not bothered you at all. But the Btitish promised to you gains on our loss if you collaborated with them to deafeat the Cypriots, and so you attacked us.

Here is the video again:

You came to Cyprus as conquers in order to enslave and oppress us. We didn't import you in this island as slaves.
All we didn't was fight against the colonialists for our freedom. But you attacked us again just like you did when you first invaded our island, in order to deny to us again our freedom and self-determination.

The Ottomans attacked your ancestors not me I had no choice in the matter, they came here 500 years ago which in any books is enough time to make us indegenious to this island which even today I know you have problems accepting but its a fact. You cannot stamp and ignore a large part of your population and force a situation on them which is life threatening, they have every right to fight back for not only their rights but their lives.

The problem is not what your ancestors did to my ancestors. Is that you have not stopped with the crimes against us ever since. You continue with the same kinds of crimes today as if we are still in the middle ages.
And I will tell you again: Stop pretending to be the victims. You are the ones who always started the attacks against us.

Of course I see you as equal citizens and accept the 100% of your rights. When did I say the opposite?

Where were you in 1963 to 1974??? dont blame us if we do not believe you we have 11 years of good reason.

In 1963 we exactly proposed that you should have equal rights with us and not more, and then you started to attack us again.

On the contrary you want each one TC to count as 5 GCs, you want discrimination and segragation based on ethnic background, and you insist to steal our lands and violate our human rights.

We want BBF and political equality as supported by the UN and 90% of the world.

Political equality means that each citizen is equal to each other, which is not what you demand. What you demand is that each TC should be equal to 5 GCs. Thats inequality, not equality.
As far as BBF goes, no problem at all, as long as the area that is under your control belongs exclusively to you and was not stolen from us.

Piratis we can argue back and forth forever because we have totally different viewpoints, yours is from a GC stance and mine from a TC stance this is normal. The reality you face today is what you have to deal with, you can go lodge all the complaints you want in the world to all the official bodies, what will this achieve? a solution? its hasn't worked for 48 years and I am 100% it will never work.

You really have to get a grip and understand that you have to share equally with the TC community under a BBF solution where our rights are protected by a political formula where we will not be pushed to one side just because the majority thought it was their right, no majority has the right to take decisions on my behalf that are life threatening or sensative to one people, no majority has the right to take away my country as you did in the past.

Piratis we are perfect examples of why there will never be a solution and why I subscribe to agreed division, the chasm is far to wide between us, a forced marriage will not work and only end in tears for everyone.

This forum has made me believe even more that our best interests will not be in uniting with GCs, they do not see us an equal community but only as a minority who should forget any sort of community rights and submit to living in a GC state run by GCs. It is this attitude that hardens my belief that we should concentrate on our world relations and high light at every opportunity the GC non European stance when it comes to compromise and sharing, in time and as we are witnessing the other nations will move closer to the TRNC, recognition may not come over night but at least we would have a hope whereas accepting minority status in a GC state would mean losing Cyprus forever.

[Piratis]

There was never a marriage VP. When you first came to our island you didn't ask us if we wanted to "marry" you and if we welcomed you to our home. You forced your way in.

I know that you want to steal our lands. There is nothing new in this, no need to remind me.

If you want to gain land and power on our loss by brute force then be sure we will not capitulate to the invadors of your kind. You are welcome to stay on this island as the 18% minority that you are with the same protective rights that every other minority has. But if you start a war to take our lands and our rights then be sure we will not capitulate and the war will end when and only when you give back every single thing that you forcefully took from us.

Your mentality is the kind of arrogant greedy mentality that many Turks have. You think that because you have the military power during some time frame that you can use brute force to upgrade yourselves from 18% to 50% and to steal our lands. Just remember your arrogance VP. In the future you will have only yourself to blame.

[Viewpoint]

There was never a marriage VP. When you first came to our island you didn't ask us if we wanted to "marry" you and if we welcomed you to our home. You forced your way in.

I know that you want to steal our lands. There is nothing new in this, no need to remind me.

If you want to gain land and power on our loss by brute force then be sure we will not capitulate to the invadors of your kind. You are welcome to stay on this island as the 18% minority that you are with the same protective rights that every other minority has. But if you start a war to take our lands and our rights then be sure we will not capitulate and the war will end when and only when you give back every single thing that you forcefully took from us.

Your mentality is the kind of arrogant greedy mentality that many Turks have. You think that because you have the military power during some time frame that you can use brute force to upgrade yourselves from 18% to 50% and to steal our lands. Just remember your arrogance VP. In the future you will have only yourself to blame.

Empty threats don't work Piratis, the marriage as you fully know happened in 1960 when we both signed on the dotted line. Its you who wants 100% of the island and 82% control to do as you wish, I and many people would say you are the greedy ones, just as you were in the past.

We will never a capitulate into a GC state, forget it we would rather die fighting or stay as we are forever while you wait and wait and wait and wait for that swing in power you long for.

[Piratis]

Defending the borders and the sovereignty of my country is a "threat"? Well, for the foreign invadors apparently it is.

And you are telling me that I am greedy because I want democracy and proportional representation?? If I was greedy I would be asking what you are asking: That 100s of thousands of TCs should be ethnically cleansed, that we should take their lands, and that we should have 3 times more power than what proportionally belongs to us.

[Viewpoint]

Defending the borders and the sovereignty of my country is a "threat"? Well, for the foreign invadors apparently it is.

And you are telling me that I am greedy because I want democracy and proportional representation?? If I was greedy I would be asking what you are asking: That 100s of thousands of TCs should be ethnically cleansed, that we should take their lands, and that we should have 3 times more power than what proportionally belongs to us.

You want to create a GC state on our land and reduce us to minority status we will not allow it, we will do whatever is necessary to stop you, get that in your head.

Now if you want to share fairly where there are safeguards to ensure certain red lines of the TCs then we will talk but otherwise we will not capitulate to your demands.

[Piratis]

I don't want to create anything on your land. You are the ones who want to create a some "Turkish Republic" on our Cypriot lands.

I don't want to "reduce" you into anything. You are the 18% and therefore you are a minority. You are the ones who want to use force to upgrade yourselves from 18% to 50%, and take our rights and our lands.

share fairly = share proportionately, and that is what I want. Unless if with "share fairly" you mean the way Turkey is shared between Turks and Kurds? No problem with that either.

[Kikapu]

Now if you want to share fairly where there are safeguards to ensure certain red lines of the TCs then we will talk but otherwise we will not capitulate to your demands.

Sorry to ask again VP, but just exactly what are those "Red Lines" again.??

I know NO future Enosis with Greece is one and NO trade with Turkey is the other.
What else.??

[ARMENIAN CYPRIOT]

and your a knob who cant answer a simple question...
seriously dont you have to be elsewhere trying to convince the world that there are .5 million, 1 million or 1.5 million armenian missing?? which number do you subscribe to??

Al your mother is like a door knob. Everybody gets to take a turn on her.