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Trust, suspicion, and Stereotyping

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby zan » Sun Mar 30, 2008 1:47 am

Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
The Annan Plan worked fine for the majority of TCs and over 30% of GCs..... :roll: :roll:


If you combine the two figures above, they still fall well short of the majority of Cypriots, therefore AP was
"Dead on Arrival"..........RIP.!!


I think you will find that it had a knife in it's back from that reliable cheet Tpap!!!


Denktash and the Gang did not help either. Everyone had one vote each, including PapaD. It did not pass. Even if PapaD and Denktash said yes, there would have been just two more votes for the worst Peace Plan ever MANUFACTURED............
May the AP rest in PIECES.!!


Because it did not allow Greek rule.......There will never be a plan that allows that my friend so you can vote OXI to all of them.....
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Postby Kikapu » Sun Mar 30, 2008 10:56 pm

zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
The Annan Plan worked fine for the majority of TCs and over 30% of GCs..... :roll: :roll:


If you combine the two figures above, they still fall well short of the majority of Cypriots, therefore AP was
"Dead on Arrival"..........RIP.!!


I think you will find that it had a knife in it's back from that reliable cheet Tpap!!!


Denktash and the Gang did not help either. Everyone had one vote each, including PapaD. It did not pass. Even if PapaD and Denktash said yes, there would have been just two more votes for the worst Peace Plan ever MANUFACTURED............
May the AP rest in PIECES.!!


Because it did not allow Greek rule.......There will never be a plan that allows that my friend so you can vote OXI to all of them.....


Not exactly. Would you have said yes to the plan that was offered to the GC's, if the shoe was on the other foot?? You don't even want to accept True Federation and True Democracy. You accept those first, and if the GC's say OXI on that plan, then I will join you with your claim.

Are you up to the challenge.??
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Postby Kikapu » Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:06 pm

Viewpoint wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
The Annan Plan worked fine for the majority of TCs and over 30% of GCs..... :roll: :roll:


If you combine the two figures above, they still fall well short of the majority of Cypriots, therefore AP was
"Dead on Arrival"..........RIP.!!


I think you will find that it had a knife in it's back from that reliable cheet Tpap!!!


Denktash and the Gang did not help either. Everyone had one vote each, including PapaD. It did not pass. Even if PapaD and Denktash said yes, there would have been just two more votes for the worst Peace Plan ever MANUFACTURED............
May the AP rest in PIECES.!!


It will soon be back from the dead to haunt you, will that mean you will have to lick what you spat out.


It won't be the BBF (Confederacy) part, or the Undemocratic, Racist, or the Human Rights violation part.

Anything else, sure, I will lick it...Happy now VP.??


What if it is? what if it is repackaged with the same basic structure? can the Gcs risk another NO?


You only want to present the same AP 2004 so that it can be rejected, so that you can run around making the same claims that you have said yes to AP and the GC's said NO, so that you can ( you think) get recognition. You don't want a settlement, you want another NO vote. Why do you think Christofias doesn't want the AP on the table at all, because he knows the sneaky games that you are up to. And one more thing, the UN is not pushing the AP to the table. They want the Cypriots to find their own solution, but will be on hand to help. No body trusts Talat by insisting that the AP should be the basis for the next round of talks. Besides, I don't want any Racist, Undemocratic, Human Rights Violation, and Anti Cypriot plan on any talks. Forget it VP, better start accepting a real settlement, because the AP 2004 Confederacy is DEAD.
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Postby zan » Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:46 pm

Where did you hear that :roll: :roll:|Halil posted the thoughts of the EU minister from the UK.....I was there when he said it...sounded very much like the Annan Plan to me...
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Postby Viewpoint » Mon Mar 31, 2008 12:06 am

Kikapu wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
The Annan Plan worked fine for the majority of TCs and over 30% of GCs..... :roll: :roll:


If you combine the two figures above, they still fall well short of the majority of Cypriots, therefore AP was
"Dead on Arrival"..........RIP.!!


I think you will find that it had a knife in it's back from that reliable cheet Tpap!!!


Denktash and the Gang did not help either. Everyone had one vote each, including PapaD. It did not pass. Even if PapaD and Denktash said yes, there would have been just two more votes for the worst Peace Plan ever MANUFACTURED............
May the AP rest in PIECES.!!


It will soon be back from the dead to haunt you, will that mean you will have to lick what you spat out.


It won't be the BBF (Confederacy) part, or the Undemocratic, Racist, or the Human Rights violation part.

Anything else, sure, I will lick it...Happy now VP.??


What if it is? what if it is repackaged with the same basic structure? can the Gcs risk another NO?


You only want to present the same AP 2004 so that it can be rejected, so that you can run around making the same claims that you have said yes to AP and the GC's said NO, so that you can ( you think) get recognition. You don't want a settlement, you want another NO vote. Why do you think Christofias doesn't want the AP on the table at all, because he knows the sneaky games that you are up to. And one more thing, the UN is not pushing the AP to the table. They want the Cypriots to find their own solution, but will be on hand to help. No body trusts Talat by insisting that the AP should be the basis for the next round of talks. Besides, I don't want any Racist, Undemocratic, Human Rights Violation, and Anti Cypriot plan on any talks. Forget it VP, better start accepting a real settlement, because the AP 2004 Confederacy is DEAD.


Directly or indirectly the AP or call it what you want, will be around, the UN will not start from point zero, they can rename it to suit the GCs but the bottom line is that this is the starting point, you accepted licking up what you spat out, demonizing this plan served no purpose as this is the basis for all negotiations, where we take it is up to us but if the final blueprint is not accpetable to TCs we to can reject it just like you have in the past, we will sit on either sides of the table and both sides have the right of rejection. We will not be forced into accepting anything that put our community at risk or danger, as long as GCs stick to the BBF and political equality we will make some headway.
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Postby Kikapu » Mon Mar 31, 2008 9:16 am

Viewpoint wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
It won't be the BBF (Confederacy) part, or the Undemocratic, Racist, or the Human Rights violation part.

Anything else, sure, I will lick it...Happy now VP.??


What if it is? what if it is repackaged with the same basic structure? can the Gcs risk another NO?


You only want to present the same AP 2004 so that it can be rejected, so that you can run around making the same claims that you have said yes to AP and the GC's said NO, so that you can ( you think) get recognition. You don't want a settlement, you want another NO vote. Why do you think Christofias doesn't want the AP on the table at all, because he knows the sneaky games that you are up to. And one more thing, the UN is not pushing the AP to the table. They want the Cypriots to find their own solution, but will be on hand to help. No body trusts Talat by insisting that the AP should be the basis for the next round of talks. Besides, I don't want any Racist, Undemocratic, Human Rights Violation, and Anti Cypriot plan on any talks. Forget it VP, better start accepting a real settlement, because the AP 2004 Confederacy is DEAD.


Directly or indirectly the AP or call it what you want, will be around, the UN will not start from point zero, they can rename it to suit the GCs but the bottom line is that this is the starting point, you accepted licking up what you spat out, demonizing this plan served no purpose as this is the basis for all negotiations, where we take it is up to us but if the final blueprint is not accpetable to TCs we to can reject it just like you have in the past, we will sit on either sides of the table and both sides have the right of rejection. We will not be forced into accepting anything that put our community at risk or danger, as long as GCs stick to the BBF and political equality we will make some headway.


You can re-package the AP anyway you want VP, if the substance is the same, so will be the results, except the plan won't even get off the ground to be voted on. You are not going to get another "NO" vote from the GC's, because they are not going to vote on anything that resembles AP 2004, so that you can claim the "high road" when in reality you support something that is not in the best interest of overwhelming majority of Cypriots, and the quote from your previous post shows us just that very clearly.

I said in my above quote;
"It won't be the BBF (Confederacy) part, or the Undemocratic, Racist, or the Human Rights violation part".

Your response was;
"What if it is? what if it is repackaged with the same basic structure? can the Gcs risk another NO?"

You do not support anything that is fair unless it is Undemocratic, Racist, and violate Human Rights. Christofias will not come out and call you Racist with the plan you support. No, instead, he has put the Turkish Army on the table to withdraw from Cyprus as a occupying force. No country in the world supports occupying force, unless of course they them self are an occupying force, such as Turkey and USA, but in general, no one is going to fault the GC's for demanding for the Turkish Army to leave to find a solution. The other of course is the Turkish Guarantorship. That too will be on the table as a non acceptance by the GC's. Once again, no country is going to fault the GC's for not wanting other nations having a say-so in Cyprus without their approval, and you will find other countries supporting the GC's position on this. The argument that the Turkish Army is there to protect the TC's, that argument has run out long time ago with thousands of Cypriots crossing back and forth without any incidences with yet another crossing to be opened in Nicosia, perhaps the most significant of all others in the last 5 years.

Just those two items above will be rejected by the TC's and Turkey, and the whole "peace plan" will be derailed, so don't worry too much using the 2004 AP as a basis, because it will not even be tackled, because of the other two main topics. So you see VP, you will not be given the chance to take the "high road"claims undeservedly just as you did in 2004, because it is you, who will be saying "NO" next time around.
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Postby Expatkiwi » Mon Mar 31, 2008 9:42 am

I never thought this thread I started would stretch out this long and this many posts. Looks like I hit a nerve. The stereotypes are coming to the fore, and with that, comes the mistrust and suspicion in all its glory. How can there be reconciliation under these conditions? It looks increasingly like partition being the only realistic course.... unless both communities change course (unlikely, that). But, lets see if Christofas and Talat do make headway. Stranger things have happened in the course of human history...
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Postby Kikapu » Mon Mar 31, 2008 10:39 am

Expatkiwi wrote:I never thought this thread I started would stretch out this long and this many posts. Looks like I hit a nerve. The stereotypes are coming to the fore, and with that, comes the mistrust and suspicion in all its glory. How can there be reconciliation under these conditions? It looks increasingly like partition being the only realistic course.... unless both communities change course (unlikely, that). But, lets see if Christofas and Talat do make headway. Stranger things have happened in the course of human history...


Your title of this treat died long time ago Expatkiwi. Threads have a way of taking different course than it was originally intended by the author. What you have in Cyprus now is about Greed and Power as well as "Might makes Right" attitude. Morally Corrupted people does not want to abide by Laws, Democracy, or Human Rights. As for Partition, according to some, the island is already Partitoned. So where is the peace.?? If it were to be permanently partitioned against the will of the majority, then there never be peace on the island. Do not assume Partition is the answer, just because it suits best to the Morally Corrupted, because they stand to gain on the loss of others.
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Postby Expatkiwi » Mon Mar 31, 2008 6:43 pm

Kikapu wrote:
Expatkiwi wrote:I never thought this thread I started would stretch out this long and this many posts. Looks like I hit a nerve. The stereotypes are coming to the fore, and with that, comes the mistrust and suspicion in all its glory. How can there be reconciliation under these conditions? It looks increasingly like partition being the only realistic course.... unless both communities change course (unlikely, that). But, lets see if Christofas and Talat do make headway. Stranger things have happened in the course of human history...


Your title of this treat died long time ago Expatkiwi. Threads have a way of taking different course than it was originally intended by the author. What you have in Cyprus now is about Greed and Power as well as "Might makes Right" attitude. Morally Corrupted people does not want to abide by Laws, Democracy, or Human Rights. As for Partition, according to some, the island is already Partitoned. So where is the peace.?? If it were to be permanently partitioned against the will of the majority, then there never be peace on the island. Do not assume Partition is the answer, just because it suits best to the Morally Corrupted, because they stand to gain on the loss of others.


I never said that there would be anything pleasant about it. But if the Greek Cypriot side had acknowledged the fact that reconciliation is just not possible, then proper negotiations could have taken place, and a lot of the outstanding issues resolved. The end result would have been a TRNC with smaller boundaries (in other words, Famagusta and Morphou back under south Cyprus administration), equitable compensation paid for porperty losses, a mechanism to ensure no foreign troops remaining on the island and most importantly: an end to hostilities.
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Postby Oracle » Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:51 pm

Expatkiwi wrote:I never thought this thread I started would stretch out this long and this many posts. Looks like I hit a nerve. The stereotypes are coming to the fore, and with that, comes the mistrust and suspicion in all its glory. How can there be reconciliation under these conditions? It looks increasingly like partition being the only realistic course.... unless both communities change course (unlikely, that). But, lets see if Christofas and Talat do make headway. Stranger things have happened in the course of human history...


You would do well to read and learn from some of the posts instead of arrogantly assuming you were right ...

Many arguments have been put forward to show how ridiculous your assumptions are ... but either you did not care to read or you are incapable of learning ....

Maybe it is the desire of the posters to teach you something, that has kept them posting, and the length of the thread, is in relation to just how much you still need to be taught ... :lol:
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