Cyprus-Forum.com

[Daemon]

Turkey fuck her self from a long before and she can suck my dick because I do not believe in nations.

You see I’m not suffering from inferiority complex and is impossible for me to be a nationalist fagot like you.

And don’t feel this way all people have some things to be shame about.

You are just a Turkish fagot. Nothing important or special

[Daemon]

But I will return to my favorite subject. Since he never says something he is the subject him self. So let’s examine the GR subject. He is the most redicoulous piece of shit I’ve ever met in my life and from know on he will be my favorite subject, since he is an old man( ) that he always try to bump my balls like a retardedwhen actually never got an invitation. I never thought what I could drop so low in his fagot level but since he is an old man( ) I suppose what for me is a must to examine this hilarious subject.

[petr87]

Welcome

Yeah you are right ... it's not because it is Greeks vs Turks ... but simply because one section of the population has violated the rights of another, by ethnically cleansing them from their homes and stealing their land ....

It is so much more ...

It is the difference between Right and Wrong![/quote
Thanks
Yeah you are right but,
everyone violated the other side's rights...i'm not saying that we GCs are better.Not all Turks are responsible for what happened.But what i can't stand hearing is that it wasn't an invasion but a "peaceful intervention".do u know what i mean?if it was a peaceful intervention there wouldn't be so much slaughters and violence.you know what?i really wish for a solution to the Cypriot problem but i don't think that is going to be one...

[Get Real!]

But I will return to my favorite subject. Since he never says something he is the subject him self. So let’s examine the GR subject. He is the most redicoulous piece of shit I’ve ever met in my life and from know on he will be my favorite subject, since he is an old man( ) that he always try to bump my balls like a retardedwhen actually never got an invitation. I never thought what I could drop so low in his fagot level but since he is an old man( ) I suppose what for me is a must to examine this hilarious subject.

Your old man has been had for he should've thrown you across his knees a long time ago and slapped your pink bottom but such is life though, many parents never earn any respect from their kids so the kids turn out rotten like you and sadly they go on to produce tomorrow’s crap only to repeat the whole cycle again…

[Daemon]

Wow what an imagination. Re axriste den katalaveneis oti apla eisai mia thrasidili ilithiotita?

The Miss Fagot of the year award goes to GR.

You are an old man GR? And why do you have brains of 15 year’s old retarded boy and you never can put together a single reasonable argument?

[Daemon]

The old man that always trying to use his super power (of stupidity) to bump my balls like a retarded is speaking about his cycles. Of course cycles is the only thing you can do especially when there is not any subject and when we are in the field of stupidity where arguments are not needed. Can you point me a single topic where you did actually answer me to something with any reasonable argument? The only thing you are doing as an old man( ) is to running after me like a retarded.

[denizaksulu]

Expat, your conclusion of the “problem” is based on the assumption that Greek Cypriots already trust the Turkish Cypriots, despite centuries of TC disloyalty against Cyprus, and that all that remains now if for the GCs to also earn the trust of the TCs and the problem is gone!

If you take a good look at the sociological side of Cyprus from the 1500s onwards you’ll find that the Turkish Cypriots were always TURKS first and whatever else after. At best, this is referred to as a conflict of interests.

Slight correction here GR. From 1500' onwards it was Muslim Ottomans till the begining of the 20th Century. The Greek speakers were the Orthodox Ottomans and the 'Turkish speakers ' were the Moslem Ottomans. It was after British rule that Turkish nationalism began to spread across the island. Some would suggest that it was the Orthodox Ottomans of Cyprus who betrayed the Ottoman rule by supporting the Greek War of Independence and the Cretan tragedy.

Regards

[utu]

Interesting (and not overly surprised) to see this thread - like so many others - breaking down into abuse, accusation, interpretations of history, and character assasaination. Did I leave anything out?

The title of this thread is really appropriate. There is a TOTAL lack of trust, a lot of suspicion, and the exposure- and use - of stereotypes. Little wonder that the Cyprus Problem has lasted this long.

[Kikapu]

Kikapu

I really did not wanted to get into involved debate with you over the Cyprus problems at this time as there is some movement towards peace talks, but since you raised the land issue, Cyprus can only have peace when land returns to it's rightful owners, or to be shared by it's rightful owners, and with the permission of the rightful owners. Anything else is nothing more than "might makes right".

I agree this can be done through a 2 state solution as supported by TCs and the GC leadership a BBF.

You also very quietly skipped my question to you, which was to tell me what was it that I told Expatkiwi that was inaccurate when I made him a list of events that has already happened, that if one were to support a permanent partition can only do so with the acceptance of all the things I listed, which makes him and others Morally Corrupted.

I disagree with the whole of your post to expat especially the belittling and righteous attitude you portray, who the hell are you to catagorize people as morally corrupt.

VP, do yourself a favour and stop looking for "ghosts" in my past that you think has harmed me or my family by the Turks or the TC's. Despite our ordeal in the hands of the GC's in 1963, myself and my immediate family has moved on with our lives and do not hold today's GC society responsible for the crimes committed by the few back then.

You for me are on the other side and even if you are a TC 100% your attitude and ideology is totally GC, you do not hae one good thing to say about TCs nor do you support the smallest od arguments in favor of TCs, you make excuses but they only confirm that you cannot be unbiased. Im glad that you and your family have been able to get past the past events but you have to accept many have not and therefore need safeguards to ensure they are comfortable with uniting with GCs, you have no right to sidestep other peoples fears just becuase you are convinced there are none.

My grievances with Turkey and the "TRNC" is strictly on their political dishonesty and political shenanigans towards finding a solution to Cyprus. But you very conveniently want to tie my displeasures of the above to make it mean that I'm against the Turks or the TC's. If that were the case, I would not have had my 50th Birthday celebrations in Turkey with my twin sister near Antalya at my favourite hotel. But your tactics fall in the above political dishonesty and political shenanigans very nicely to cast a label over me. Nice try, but my conscious is very clear and just like Teflon, it will not allow anything to stick to it..

You have to realize that for us Turkey stepped in, in our hour of need, they have provided not only financial support but also moral support through rough times for TCs, so we will always be indebted and your demonizing them will not sway TCs your way, you only perpetuate mistrust and hate towards people like yourself. You can ask any TC on this forum your hate for Turks is obvious in every post saying your saying you dont does not convince anyone becuase 99% of the time your display the opposite.

My whole approach to the political events in the "TRNC" just comes down to one thing, and that is being very Principled, which understandably clashes head on with the unprincipled, unethical, the greedy, and the morally corrupted. Along the way, the good and the innocent TC's who have become the "misguided lemmings" also end up arguing with my points of view at times, just because they want to "go with the flow". I do not have anything against them personally, and often I give them understanding in their stance. There are others who are also principled TC's such as Birkibrisli, Denizaksulu, Iceman and some others, but as individuals, we are different on some of our points of view. I do not expect others to understand how I formulate my points of view and they at times question me on them, as I do with theirs. It does not mean we do not care about our own community, the TC's and Cypriots in general. On the contrary, perhaps more than the others who are self serving individuals.

You and the GC support you have may think you are principled but from this side of the fence you look like a traitor and someone who has not 1 good to say about his own community, not once have you stepped into support a TCs arguments can we be so wrong, neither side is 100% wrong yet you continue to persue your goal of proving we are 100% to blame. I recommend you try to put the TC sides viewpoint accross thats you know or support anything that we claim.

VP,

I doubt there ever will be an agreed 2 state solution based on Annan Plan BBF "Virgin Birth" Confederacy. That would mean, that all the land that would become a "Turkish State" would have to be gifted to the TC's by the GC's, whether GC's will chose to live in that state or not. As a Confederate state, there are no guarantees that the TC's down the road will not just ask for a Independence and break away completely, and in the eyes of the International Community, just like Kosovo, it will be recognized. You are the one always asking for guarantees for the TC's from the GC's to keep their word on what ever they may sign with the TC's, just what kind of Guarantees are you going to give the GC's, that you will not break away once the land has been "gifted" to you.?? I believe, the best offer the GC's will give the TC's, is on True Federation with a 2 state solution. I see it as a good compromise personally, because neither side gets what they want, and both sides are tied together at the "hip" to make it work. Just need to work out the political power bit, and we are halfway there in restoring every ones Human Rights back, as well as see the island uniting slowly but surely.

Just to touch on Expat for a minute. The man is morally corrupted from the time he altered information on Wikipedia a while back in favour of the TC's regarding land percentages, then used that same information to try and make a case. Even if you want to overlook his partition stance, which already makes him a Hypocrite, just his fudging on Wikipedia makes him corrupted. You want to support him, go right ahead. It only adds bad light to the TC's cause, because information was fabricated to make a case. I do not think you would accept that from your children. Expat is a grown person, he should know better.


You make a mistake, that if I argue towards a point that concerns Turkey or the "TRNC", you think that I'm favouring the GC's on their political moves. . Just how do you reach that conclusion ??. Do you see me making any comments in supporting any GC positions.?? I argue points that I see for myself and not through the eyes of others. If they happen to be similar, don't blame me for having the same view as the GC's. Blame them for seeing it my way. In any case, I approach the whole issue from the point of a Cypriot. You do not see yourself as a Cypriot, so naturally you cannot understand my points. The "TRNC" is not my country VP, Cyprus is, so how can I be a traitor to a "country" that is not in existence for me.

For me, the whole island is my country, and you will come to this realisation if real peace is sought, because there never going to be 2 states (countries) solution. Either we are one country of Cyprus with 2 states, (True Federation) or there's going to be 2 states (countries) on an agreed partition. If you do not believe me, ask the rest of the world and they will tell you. I have been posting news from International Newspapers and they have not referred "TRNC" being a country. They don't even use the term "TRNC", except on rare occasions. It only says Turkish Cypriot administered area, or Turkish Occupation areas and so on. I'm not trying to diminish what the "TRNC" means to you, but I'm a practical person and see things as they are, and not what people want them to be. In order for anyone to be a traitor, they would have to sell their country out to a foreign country. I have not done that, but in the eyes of many, many have done so.

TC's who cross to the South to work or the many thousand TC's who hold RoC passports that live amongst you, including Denktash's family members. If it wasn't for the fact that many TC's hold British Passports, they too would be obtaining RoC passports. Are these people traitors in the eyes of the "TRNC". I should hope not, because that would really bring a new meaning to "sleeping with the enemy". And since when does anyone becomes a traitor for criticizing their country, leaders and different political groups.?? I have asked you before to open a thread and ask all the TC's to say whether my criticism of the "TRNC" constitutes being treasonist or not. Hell they can say so anytime they want, but they have not. The only person wants to make an issue of this, is you, and even you do not come out and say it, so what's stopping you VP.

IF it wasn't for America during WWII, all of Europe would be speaking German today, some may say, and yet, many in Europe criticizes America all the time at different times on their foreign policy, so just because Turkey came to save the TC's (debatable subject for another time), one does not blindly say yes to Turkey from now on. The only time that all criticisms will be condemned, is when the "TRNC" becomes a FASCIST STATE. Is it a fascist state VP, or does freedom of speech still recognised there as part of Democracy ??. Further more, what hateful things have I said towards TC's and Turks that you keep mentioning. All my criticism are based only as Political on specific issues and not towards Turkey as a country or it's people. To me "TRNC" is not even a country, so I might as well be talking to thin air. When peace is found, there won't be any "TRNC". If it was a country, there would be no reason for it to disappear, nor there be any need to find peace. What for.??

If I were to visit the "TRNC", I would be visiting my country of Cyprus, just as I did the RoC, nothing more nothing less. How does all this make it a GC point of view.?? What part of what I said is not true VP. Deep down you must know what I'm talking about. Anyway, as soon as peace is found and we have a "whole" country again called Cyprus, all these discussions will be forgotten as people of Cyprus once again become Cypriots, and if they don't and they want to remain "Turks or Greeks", is when I will be calling them TRAITORS to Cyprus.

[Viewpoint]

Kikapu

I doubt there ever will be an agreed 2 state solution based on Annan Plan BBF "Virgin Birth" Confederacy. That would mean, that all the land that would become a "Turkish State" would have to be gifted to the TC's by the GC's, whether GC's will chose to live in that state or not. As a Confederate state, there are no guarantees that the TC's down the road will not just ask for a Independence and break away completely, and in the eyes of the International Community, just like Kosovo, it will be recognized. You are the one always asking for guarantees for the TC's from the GC's to keep their word on what ever they may sign with the TC's, just what kind of Guarantees are you going to give the GC's, that you will not break away once the land has been "gifted" to you.?? I believe, the best offer the GC's will give the TC's, is on True Federation with a 2 state solution. I see it as a good compromise personally, because neither side gets what they want, and both sides are tied together at the "hip" to make it work. Just need to work out the political power bit, and we are halfway there in restoring every ones Human Rights back, as well as see the island uniting slowly but surely.

Imho I think nothing less than a 2 state solution joined at a federal state level with 1 identity a united Cyprus where every citizen can settle where ever they wish and every refugee gets the right to return or sell up and stay put. Our individual ideology is not to far off from each other, you just have a problem like all GCs accepting that the north state we dont have to call it Turkish (dont get stuck on names) will be administered by TCs, arent we worthy? whats the problem? GCs will be able to live where they wish.

Why do you not want a virgin birth? why not get rid of the rememnents of what went wrong, TCs do not accept the "RoC" just as much as the GCs reject the TRNC. We have the opportunity to start a fresh leave behind the dark past which has shaped a new future as 2 states, if we wish to unite then surely continuation of what went wrong will ensure another failure.

As for your theory that we will want to break away all I can say is GCs should ask for guarantees that ensure we cannot but should also have accept safeguards to ensure that if GCs should try to manipulate or change our agreements then the penalty will be automatic division. Why should we want to break away from a structure where everyone is living in safety and prosperity?

Just to touch on Expat for a minute. The man is morally corrupted from the time he altered information on Wikipedia a while back in favour of the TC's regarding land percentages, then used that same information to try and make a case. Even if you want to overlook his partition stance, which already makes him a Hypocrite, just his fudging on Wikipedia makes him corrupted. You want to support him, go right ahead. It only adds bad light to the TC's cause, because information was fabricated to make a case. I do not think you would accept that from your children. Expat is a grown person, he should know better.

You have the right to you own opinion but you have no right to play judge and jury, when I challenhed you over expat it was to give him the beneift of the doubt and question your arrogant and know it all attitude, you do not have all the answers and you are far from perfect, so dont think or act like you are because you are definately not.

You make a mistake, that if I argue towards a point that concerns Turkey or the "TRNC", you think that I'm favouring the GC's on their political moves. . Just how do you reach that conclusion ??. Do you see me making any comments in supporting any GC positions.?? I argue points that I see for myself and not through the eyes of others. If they happen to be similar, don't blame me for having the same view as the GC's. Blame them for seeing it my way. In any case, I approach the whole issue from the point of a Cypriot. You do not see yourself as a Cypriot, so naturally you cannot understand my points. The "TRNC" is not my country VP, Cyprus is, so how can I be a traitor to a "country" that is not in existence for me.

All your comments are directly in line with GC so every comment you make supports their arguments 100%, what you are saying you do not think like GCs they think like you, comical isnt that the same thing? you both think the same, 100%, your manipulating words to support a twisted theory which posters can see right through.

You dont have to be a traitor to a country it can be a community like TCs or even to a friend, you have sold out your community full stop, its one thing supporting the GC viewpoint thats your right but not saying anything to support or defend the people you claim are your community whos suffering you say you understand is like twsiting the knife after you have stabbed us in the heart.

For me, the whole island is my country, and you will come to this realisation if real peace is sought, because there never going to be 2 states (countries) solution. Either we are one country of Cyprus with 2 states, (True Federation) or there's going to be 2 states (countries) on an agreed partition. If you do not believe me, ask the rest of the world and they will tell you. I have been posting news from International Newspapers and they have not referred "TRNC" being a country. They don't even use the term "TRNC", except on rare occasions. It only says Turkish Cypriot administered area, or Turkish Occupation areas and so on. I'm not trying to diminish what the "TRNC" means to you, but I'm a practical person and see things as they are, and not what people want them to be. In order for anyone to be a traitor, they would have to sell their country out to a foreign country. I have not done that, but in the eyes of many, many have done so.

There are plenty of litriture around the world that states Turkish Republic of Cyprus, you choose to ignore these as that suits your goal, you may dream of your ideal Cyprrus but this may not necessarily correspond with what will happen oe what is happening today, you see things they way you wish they would be. The TRNC may not be your country but it is for 250.000 Turkish Cypriot citizens who call it home even with all its faults you may bury your head in the sand but we are here and kicking, you can call the south "RoC" your country like all the other GCs.

A traitor can also sell out his people, community, friends.

TC's who cross to the South to work or the many thousand TC's who hold RoC passports that live amongst you, including Denktash's family members. If it wasn't for the fact that many TC's hold British Passports, they too would be obtaining RoC passports. Are these people traitors in the eyes of the "TRNC". I should hope not, because that would really bring a new meaning to "sleeping with the enemy". And since when does anyone becomes a traitor for criticizing their country, leaders and different political groups.?? I have asked you before to open a thread and ask all the TC's to say whether my criticism of the "TRNC" constitutes being treasonist or not. Hell they can say so anytime they want, but they have not. The only person wants to make an issue of this, is you, and even you do not come out and say it, so what's stopping you VP.

TCs work all over the world just like you, they sell their labour, working south of the border is like working in another country, as for passports if GCs claim they represent the whole island then the minimum they can do is provide a passport, if you hand out benefits people will take them, Id like to see the GCs not give out these passports. Why do yo unot open the thread and ask TCs yourself, are you afraid f the comments?

IF it wasn't for America during WWII, all of Europe would be speaking German today, some may say, and yet, many in Europe criticizes America all the time at different times on their foreign policy, so just because Turkey came to save the TC's (debatable subject for another time), one does not blindly say yes to Turkey from now on. The only time that all criticisms will be condemned, is when the "TRNC" becomes a FASCIST STATE. Is it a fascist state VP, or does freedom of speech still recognised there as part of Democracy ??. Further more, what hateful things have I said towards TC's and Turks that you keep mentioning. All my criticism are based only as Political on specific issues and not towards Turkey as a country or it's people. To me "TRNC" is not even a country, so I might as well be talking to thin air. When peace is found, there won't be any "TRNC". If it was a country, there would be no reason for it to disappear, nor there be any need to find peace. What for.??

If it wasnt for the Turkish army we would all have been speaking greek and become Greek Muslims if we were spared of course but we wont go there as of course we like other GCs you will claim we would have been kings.

You maybe shocked in the future like all other GCs that the "RoC" will be dissolved just like the TRNC for a new start for Cypriots, how will you stop this?

If I were to visit the "TRNC", I would be visiting my country of Cyprus, just as I did the RoC, nothing more nothing less. How does all this make it a GC point of view.?? What part of what I said is not true VP. Deep down you must know what I'm talking about. Anyway, as soon as peace is found and we have a "whole" country again called Cyprus, all these discussions will be forgotten as people of Cyprus once again become Cypriots, and if they don't and they want to remain "Turks or Greeks", is when I will be calling them TRAITORS to Cyprus.

ALl I can say is if you shoudl ever visit the TRNC you will much the wiser and maybe appreciate how we live and what are fears are, the island has been divided for 34 years your old Cyprus has long gone and things have changed it will never be the same but w ehave the chance to build a united Cyprus or agree partition the choice is yours. I know where I stand because I lost hope a long time ago and willl not hold my breath for this round of talks although I do wish them every sucess but as I have stated before the chasm is to wide to bridge and if we do not agree partition it will exsist any all but in name.