Cyprus-Forum.com

[insan]

Let's say there are 17.000 TC soldiers, 4.000 Turkish Soldiers and 30.000 reservists in North. All settlers repatriated and replaced by more eductaed, mostly more nationalist TC refugees who immigrated abroad between 1940s until late 90s. Total, pure TC population of North has reached about 400.000 as a consequence of return of a number of TC migrants.

This is not a dream that cannot be true. There are 500.000 TCs only living in Turkey. And I guess there are no less than 250.000 TCs living in Britain and there should be some 50.000 living in other countries all around the world.


Would the situation be any different than what currently it is?
For what things GCs would complain about? Repatriation of all British TCs? Repatriation of all TC settlers? Withdrawal of TC troops?

[magikthrill]

insan

what are you talking about? i am confused. are you implying that if all TC immigrants were to return to Cyprus then that would change the demographics???

If this is so did you include what would happen if all the GC immigrants returned to Cyprus??

sorry if i got it wrong in which case could you explain what youre talking about

[Piratis]

Insan, there are many more GCs living abroad than TCs.

You can claim any kind of random number you want. You said that in Britain there are 250.000 TCs, but it is well known that GCs are far more in Britain than TCs, so they must be 1.000.000.

Therefore the ratio is exactly the same. GCs not just in Cyprus but world wide are much more than TCs.

Your post is therefore pointless.

[insan]

Ok. Let's assume a certain number of GC emigransts also returned. I'm not talking about return of all TC or GC emigrants. Population ratio has become approx. 1/4.

There are 17.000 TC soldiers, 4.000 Turkish Soldiers and 30.000 reservists in North. All settlers repatriated and replaced by more eductaed, mostly more nationalist TC refugees who immigrated abroad between 1940s until late 90s. Total, pure TC population of North has reached about 400.000 and GC population of South has reached about 1.600.000 as a consequence of return of a certain number of TC and GC migrants.


Would the situation be any different than what currently it is?
For what things GCs would complain about? Repatriation of all British TCs? Repatriation of all TC settlers? Withdrawal of TC troops?

[magikthrill]

no. they would only complaing about the desecration of their human rights, ie the right of refugees to return and the removal of foreign troops, ie Turkish.

i dont see why "british" TCs would be a problem? of course the chances of all refugees getting their property back (minimal) are much greater than your scenario occuring. most Cypriots immigrants are way succesful and those that left in the 40s wouldnt evenconsider coming back unless maybe for retirement, since they have much succesful lives. For example, the Dean of my Engineering School (ranked 7th in the USA) is of Greek Cypriot decent. Why would he want to leave where he is now?

[insan]

no. they would only complaing about the desecration of their human rights, ie the right of refugees to return and the removal of foreign troops, ie Turkish.

Ok, but return of 90.000 GC refugees to their original homes in TCCS would be harder I think. Because not only the private properties of GC refugees would have been given to TC emigrants but also twice the current amount of GC land(private and state) would have been given to the TC emigrants to built their homes, shops, hotels, farms etc..

i dont see why "british" TCs would be a problem?

I have an impression that most of the TCs who live or born abroad have more nationalistic sentiments than the settlers who have been living in North for 30 or 20 years. Besides, the TCs who were born in other countries have the cultural characteristics of the place they were born, rather than a traditional Cypriot identity. When they are compared to the settlers and the Cyprus born children of the settlers, in sense of being culturally Turkish Cypriot ; the settlers and their Cyprus born children are more Turkish Cypriot than the Turkish Cypriots living abroad.

of course the chances of all refugees getting their property back (minimal) are much greater than your scenario occuring. most Cypriots immigrants are way succesful and those that left in the 40s wouldnt evenconsider coming back unless maybe for retirement, since they have much succesful lives. For example, the Dean of my Engineering School (ranked 7th in the USA) is of Greek Cypriot decent. Why would he want to leave where he is now?

But if some TC civil initiatives start a campaign to stimulate the outside TCs to come and invest for his/her own community/country, I'm sure majority of TCs would return to Cyprus. It is a fact that there are so many succesful TC businesmen all around the world and TC community in Cyprus really need their investment rather than the investment of foreigners.

[magikthrill]

I have an impression that most of the TCs who live or born abroad have more nationalistic sentiments than the settlers who have been living in North for 30 or 20 years. Besides, the TCs who were born in other countries have the cultural characteristics of the place they were born, rather than a traditional Cypriot identity. When they are compared to the settlers and the Cyprus born children of the settlers, in sense of being culturally Turkish Cypriot ; the settlers and their Cyprus born children are more Turkish Cypriot than the Turkish Cypriots living abroad.

So what are you saying? That because they're more nationalists GCs are racists and won't accept them to return to THEIR country?

But if some TC civil initiatives start a campaign to stimulate the outside TCs to come and invest for his/her own community/country, I'm sure majority of TCs would return to Cyprus. It is a fact that there are so many succesful TC businesmen all around the world and TC community in Cyprus really need their investment rather than the investment of foreigners.

Maybe. But as I said these people have lives. It will be hard to uproot them just to fulfill a cause that they might not even support. I know many Greeks (not sure with GCs) that have immigrated abroad don't really see Greece as their home anymore and feell ike any type of investment into Greece would be a waste of their money. Of course I doin't know how the case would be with Cypriots.

[insan]

So what are you saying? That because they're more nationalists GCs are racists and won't accept them to return to THEIR country?

No I didn't say that GC are racists. For GCs, there's more to concern about TC nationalism than the nationalistic sentiments of settlers. In the 40s, 50s,60s and onwards until 1974, there were no settlers in Cyprus. In those years majority of TCs had strong nationalistic sentiments. In the elections of 1976, when settlers had no voting rights; The national Unity Party got %70 of the votes while the left wing parties only got around %20 of the votes.

[magikthrill]

No I didn't say that GC are racists. For GCs, there's more to concern about TC nationalism than the nationalistic sentiments of settlers. In the 40s, 50s,60s and onwards until 1974, there were no settlers in Cyprus. In those years majority of TCs had strong nationalistic sentiments. In the elections of 1976, when settlers had no voting rights; The national Unity Party got %70 of the votes while the left wing parties only got around %20 of the votes.

by nationalistic you mean a separate turkish-cypriot state or a united cypriot state?

Regardless, alot of things since 1976 have changed. I don't think its possible for me to stereotype GCs living abroad into one class (ie nationalists, enosists, unionists whatever other -ist you want). Most of the ones I talked to believe the Annan plan should have been voted, but I don't think that's how all of them feel.

[insan]

by nationalistic you mean a separate turkish-cypriot state or a united cypriot state?

A united Cyprus based on bi-zonal, bi-communal federation, political equality of two communities, guarantorship of Turkey, necessary restrictions on freedom of movement until TCs politically, economically, culturally, ethnically and psychologically feel themselves safe and voluntarily accept gradually lifting the restrictions.