Cyprus-Forum.com

[Piratis]

The Cyprus problem as it exists today did start in 1974. If you want to look at the chain of events that led us to the Cyprus problem as it exists today, then the beginning is not 1963. The intercommunal conflict started in 1957 when TCs under the guidance of the British attacked Greek Cypriots, and then in 1959 they imposed on the Cypriot people a constitution instead of allowing Cypriots to choose their own. And if you look just a few decades earlier, you will find the Ottoman rule, where Greek Cypriots are the ones who suffered the most being second category citizens, paying double the taxes than Muslims, and been massacred by the 10s of thousands.

Furthermore, in the only part of history you seem to remember, we have suffered as well, and you committed crimes as well. Why you choose to forget those? To present yourselves as the "innocent victims"? Thats what the poem they teach you says?

So, do you want to look what happens today: the illegal occupation and the violations of the human rights of 100s of thousands of people, and the future: how we will end the illegality and bring to Cyprus peace, democracy and human rights?

Or you want to look into the past trying to find lame excuses for the crimes you insist on committing today? Because if we do look into history, and if based on that we will reward somebody and punish another, then the ones who should be punished should be you, not us. So I suggest to you to leave the past, and concentrate on the problem we have today and its solution where everybody gets his rights back and nobody is punished, and stop trying to find excuses for more crimes and illegalities.

[denizaksulu]

The Cyprus problem as it exists today did start in 1974. If you want to look at the chain of events that led us to the Cyprus problem as it exists today, then the beginning is not 1963. The intercommunal conflict started in 1957 when TCs under the guidance of the British attacked Greek Cypriots, and then in 1959 they imposed on the Cypriot people a constitution instead of allowing Cypriots to choose their own. And if you look just a few decades earlier, you will find the Ottoman rule, where Greek Cypriots are the ones who suffered the most being second category citizens, paying double the taxes than Muslims, and been massacred by the 10s of thousands.

Furthermore, in the only part of history you seem to remember, we have suffered as well, and you committed crimes as well. Why you choose to forget those? To present yourselves as the "innocent victims"? Thats what the poem they teach you says?

So, do you want to look what happens today: the illegal occupation and the violations of the human rights of 100s of thousands of people, and the future: how we will end the illegality and bring to Cyprus peace, democracy and human rights?

Or you want to look into the past trying to find lame excuses for the crimes you insist on committing today? Because if we do look into history, and if based on that we will reward somebody and punish another, then the ones who should be punished should be you, not us. So I suggest to you to leave the past, and concentrate on the problem we have today and its solution where everybody gets his rights back and nobody is punished, and stop trying to find excuses for more crimes and illegalities.

Ofcourse they suffered the most. They were the majority, remember?

[Kikapu]

This is exactly what you ask me to do is become a minority in a GC state run by GCs as a foreigner with no safeguards to ensure my involvement in my own future.

You are not going to become a "minority" in a GC State VP. You are only a "minority" in your country of CYPRUS. Just like you are a "minority" in your "country of TRNC" right now. I don't see you complaining about that. Is it because you have almost 100% of political Power over the "majority" in the "TRNC" therefore you do not feel like a "minority" there.

You are only a minority in numbers in Cyprus not on RIGHTS. You will have exactly the same rights as any other Cypriot. Your safeguards will be the Constitution and the EU. Are you not the one who remind us, that the fact that the RoC gives passports to the TC's, is because the EU watches over the RoC, and not because the RoC wants to give the TC's EU Passports. So why do you believe in the EU on some issues, but you won't use the EU to safeguard the "minorities" interest.??

We can have what they have in other countries eg Switzerland Belgium but both sides need the right to say no when any policy effects their side more negatively than the other.

Belgium is a political mess on the system you want for us, so so much for your wisdom on that example. Switzerland on the other hand, is a democratic country and does not have "2 sides" where one can say NO or Veto to anything. Matters are put up for a vote and the majority rules. Twice the majority said NO to joining the EU. There was no "other side" to veto that vote of the majority. Democracy at work. Perhaps there might come a time, where the majority may vote YES on the EU. Democracy at work again. One cannot always get what they want in a Democracy, but as times change, so do minds. Remember VP,
"Time Does Not Stand Still".

[Viewpoint]

Piratis

VP, I ask you again: If you consider what you demand as "fair" then why you didn't give 50% power to the GCs that live in the "country" you declared? And based on what do you demand that land that belongs to us by 82% should be your separate state? Based on the "GCs are evil and should be punished, and TCs are innocent and should have gains on the Evil GCs loss" theories of yours?

Is there such a demand? did we try to sell them to anyone? did we agree a partnership deal in the TRNC with GCs? did we go back on our signature after agreeing a partnership when forming the TRNC? I dont think so but I know a community not to far away from here who did. You have to come to terms with the fact that your actions lead to todays division, your dream for enosis without taking into account a largable part of the population who had the right to fight against what they believed would endanger them was what lead to what you complain about today, you contributed to division. Its how we resolve matters which is more important not who is more to blame or who wants to gain on the others loss.

And what kind of revenge did I seek for events of the past? Did I ask to take your land? No. You demand to take mine. Did I ask to violate your rights? No. You demand that mine should be violated.

your revenge was enosis and the wiping out of the TC community, well you could hardly expect me to sit back and take what you had in store for me and my people all I demand safety and Turkey gave us a safe haven which has worked for 34 years, You beat me up and take away my rights and have no regrets doing this but as soon as I have the strength to fight back and give you some of your own medicine but not in such a large dose you still complain that we violate your rights, where were our rigths back in 1963??? I didnt see you shouting for democracy and human rights back then. People like you are labelled hypocrites for only shouting democracy and human rights when tis suits you.

When I remind you what happened 430 years ago, and almost non stop until today, is just to remind you that we are the biggest victims on this island, and not you. I do this because you constantly bring up your own distorted, exaggerated and one sided version of some events of the past in your effort to present GCs as "evil" and find excuses to commit yet more crimes against us.

You had the opportunity to build a united island only once in history, you threw it away for division, you only have yourself to blame. What do you think I will get out of proving GCs are evil? more land or more money, you miss the issue we want to live peacefully not in a country dominated by GCs but somewhere where individual and community rights will be provided and respected. The crimes you claim we commited and continue to commit will continue as long as you do not have the will to reverse the process and negotiate a solution acceptable to both sides, the choice is yours.

What you say in this thread is a confirmation to my initial posts. That TCs continue to play the role that was assigned to them in the divide and rule game of UK/Turkey against Cyprus, because they hope that in this way they can have more gains on our loss.

We are not stupid and we will nto give into bullying tactics, the blueprint for a solution has to contain all the elements for both sides that will allow us to commit, you forget that there are 2 sides which have to agree and that we to have the right to reject anything we feel is unfair just like the other side yourselves.

What is funny is that you are using your own distorted version of the inter-communal conflict in order to excuse your unfair demands, forgetting that this inter-communal conflict actually started when you attacked us back in 1957, as your first act in your role in the divide and rule game of UK and Turkey against our island.

You can use which ever version you wish the bottom line is both sides want safeguards that will ensure the past which ever version you subscribe to never happens again.

[Piratis]

Piratis

VP, I ask you again: If you consider what you demand as "fair" then why you didn't give 50% power to the GCs that live in the "country" you declared? And based on what do you demand that land that belongs to us by 82% should be your separate state? Based on the "GCs are evil and should be punished, and TCs are innocent and should have gains on the Evil GCs loss" theories of yours?

Is there such a demand? did we try to sell them to anyone? did we agree a partnership deal in the TRNC with GCs? did we go back on our signature after agreeing a partnership when forming the TRNC? I dont think so but I know a community not to far away from here who did.

They ethically cleansed they majority of Cypriots, replaced them with Turkish settlers and declared their pseudo state on land that belongs by 82% to Greek Cypriots, and this person is acting like everything is nice with what they did! Amazing!

Yes VP, the GCs in occupied areas didn't demand anything. If they did you would kill them all to the last one. Or you want to show to you some reports that describe how you treat those people?

So I ask you again: Why don't you give to those GCs 50% power? Why Turkey doesn't give 50% power to the Kurds?

You have to come to terms with the fact that your actions lead to todays division, your dream for enosis without taking into account a largable part of the population who had the right to fight against what they believed would endanger them was what lead to what you complain about today, you contributed to division. Its how we resolve matters which is more important not who is more to blame or who wants to gain on the others loss.

What lead to todays division was the Turkish invasion and your partition aim that remains unchanged since the 50s.

And what kind of revenge did I seek for events of the past? Did I ask to take your land? No. You demand to take mine. Did I ask to violate your rights? No. You demand that mine should be violated.

Your revenge was enosis and the wiping out of the TC community, well you could hardly expect me to sit back and take what you had in store for me and my people all I demand safety and Turkey gave us a safe haven which has worked for 34 years, You beat me up and take away my rights and have no regrets doing this but as soon as I have the strength to fight back and give you some of your own medicine but not in such a large dose you still complain that we violate your rights, where were our rigths back in 1963??? I didnt see you shouting for democracy and human rights back then. People like you are labelled hypocrites for only shouting democracy and human rights when tis suits you.

Oh, so you "fought back" ah? The inter communal conflict didn't start in 1963. It started in 1958 and you were the ones who attacked us. So don't talk about "fighting back" you are the one who started the whole conflict with your partition aim. Here is the video again:

When I remind you what happened 430 years ago, and almost non stop until today, is just to remind you that we are the biggest victims on this island, and not you. I do this because you constantly bring up your own distorted, exaggerated and one sided version of some events of the past in your effort to present GCs as "evil" and find excuses to commit yet more crimes against us.

You had the opportunity to build a united island only once in history, you threw it away for division, you only have yourself to blame. What do you think I will get out of proving GCs are evil? more land or more money, you miss the issue we want to live peacefully not in a country dominated by GCs but somewhere where individual and community rights will be provided and respected. The crimes you claim we commited and continue to commit will continue as long as you do not have the will to reverse the process and negotiate a solution acceptable to both sides, the choice is yours.

You are blackmailing us by occupying 1/3rd of our country and violating our human rights, and you are trying to force us to accept your terms and you think this will bring peace? You are making a big mistake my friend.
Peace can came when you stop your illegalities, and you allow human rights and democracy in Cyprus.

What you say in this thread is a confirmation to my initial posts. That TCs continue to play the role that was assigned to them in the divide and rule game of UK/Turkey against Cyprus, because they hope that in this way they can have more gains on our loss.

We are not stupid and we will nto give into bullying tactics, the blueprint for a solution has to contain all the elements for both sides that will allow us to commit, you forget that there are 2 sides which have to agree and that we to have the right to reject anything we feel is unfair just like the other side yourselves.

And who gave to you, a minority of 18%, the right to do that? Isn't it the British and the Turks? You collaborated with them in order to gain on our loss, but as I said above don't hope that you will ever achieve this. As long as anybody is trying to gain on our loss and enslave any part of our island there will not be peace.

What is funny is that you are using your own distorted version of the inter-communal conflict in order to excuse your unfair demands, forgetting that this inter-communal conflict actually started when you attacked us back in 1957, as your first act in your role in the divide and rule game of UK and Turkey against our island.

You can use which ever version you wish the bottom line is both sides want safeguards that will ensure the past which ever version you subscribe to never happens again.

[/quote]

And your "safeguard" is to ethnically cleanse the Greek Cypriots from their homes, and violate their human and democratic rights???

Go on VP, continue the game of divide and rule that was assigned to you by UK and Turkey. But don't hope you will gain on our loss my friend, because you will never get any benefit from siding with foreigners against the rest of Cypriots.

[BC Numismatics]

Nothing changes the fact that BOTH Greece & Turkey ARE guilty of using the Cypriot people as pawns in their braindead game,& using Cyprus as a battleground.

As this saying goes; THERE IS ONLY ONE CYPRUS - NEITHER GREEK NOR TURKISH,BUT CYPRIOT!

Aidan.

[Viewpoint]

Piratis

They ethically cleansed they majority of Cypriots, replaced them with Turkish settlers and declared their pseudo state on land that belongs by 82% to Greek Cypriots, and this person is acting like everything is nice with what they did! Amazing!

This is the result not the cause, the cause was your dream for enosis after agreeing to build a united Cyprus, get that into your think head.

Yes VP, the GCs in occupied areas didn't demand anything. If they did you would kill them all to the last one. Or you want to show to you some reports that describe how you treat those people?

Were they killed? you have no evidence to support such a claim, they may have been treated badly but they had the option to go to the GC side did the TCs have the same option in 1963?? Your views are very one sided and although I do acknowledge the hardship of GCs who remained in the TRNC who should have been treated more fairly I have to state that they were not partners in the 1983 TRNC constitution like we were in the 1960 agreements, the wounds of the past were just to tender. They now have their own schools can you say the same for the TCs who reside in the south?

So I ask you again: Why don't you give to those GCs 50% power? Why Turkey doesn't give 50% power to the Kurds?

No one has cliamed such a thing, do you have any independent links?

What lead to todays division was the Turkish invasion and your partition aim that remains unchanged since the 50s.

This is the mentality of a man who want democracy and human rights for all he still believes with conviction that the intervention performed by the Turkish Army was the cuase of todays division, and nothing to do with the GCs dream of enosis and risk to TCs.

Oh, so you "fought back" ah? The inter communal conflict didn't start in 1963. It started in 1958 and you were the ones who attacked us. So don't talk about "fighting back" you are the one who started the whole conflict with your partition aim.

Yes we fought back and being the smaller community we whipped your arses thats what you are having problems swallowing, well get over it, ts finished....do you want a partnership or not thats what you have to decide.

You are blackmailing us by occupying 1/3rd of our country and violating our human rights, and you are trying to force us to accept your terms and you think this will bring peace? You are making a big mistake my friend.
Peace can came when you stop your illegalities, and you allow human rights and democracy in Cyprus.

We are looking for a solution that everyone can commit to and try to understand your sensativities with the Turkish Army Land and Settlers, do you know our sensativites Piratis?
If you want resolve and a solution you have to sit down and talk for it negotiate with the other side, understand their sensativities and try to address them not belittle or push them to one side like the past, your attitude is not different or any more remorseful than your ancestors.

And your "safeguard" is to ethnically cleanse the Greek Cypriots from their homes, and violate their human and democratic rights???

Go on VP, continue the game of divide and rule that was assigned to you by UK and Turkey. But don't hope you will gain on our loss my friend, because you will never get any benefit from siding with foreigners against the rest of Cypriots.

My safeguards are to ensure my safety and have a say in my own future not being dominated or discriminated by GCs and safeguards to ensure that we will never be pushed to one side ever again. Until I see a clear blueprint of where we are going the division can continue we have resigned to the fact that without a solution the TRNC will continue as is.

[Ghandi]

i have been folowing this thread and it is so prdictable.i said if the problem is Turkey than shoudnt the GC try tgive the TC more power so they are not as reliant on them.eg Direct flights.I also said to please not jump on this comment and instead tell me what each side should apologise for.This is obviously a question that no one is comfortable answering.I wonder why?Is it because they do not have their memorised spiel.

I've heard a lot of pathetic TC excuses but this one tops them all! was the response i received.Realise that I am just saying that If the TC has no power and Turkey has than dont we have to give the TC some power to overcome the whole of Cyprus problem.In the scheme of this huge problem are direct flights so important.

Turkey’s military withdrawal from Cyprus is DEMANDED by UN resolutions and it is NOT something that should be used or accepted as a bargaining chip. There should be no “reward” expected by the Turkish Cypriots for it is in their interests that Turkey withdraws and democratic order be restored to all four corners of the island. fair enough but if the UN cant get them out what chance does the TC of doing it.

If a child is reliant on a parent and has to act on his orders than should someone punish the child with as much vigour?North Cyprus must do plenty to fix their mistakes.If again i am told what each side should be sorry for than it would be easier to work out what they need to do.

So the TC has violated your rights and take your land or did Turkey.I am confused you answer like its Turkeys fault and yet blame the TC for it.yYou dont want to give TC's the message that helping divide and rule can be beneficial to them.So what is their mistake within the framework of their real power?What are their real options?Or have they just been overpowered first by the British and then the Turks?

I am not saying incentives be given to the TC but that if the island needs Turkey out than its not about sending messages to the TC but rather about getting turkey out.Did the TC call them to come?its better for everyone if they where gone but incentives may be needed for this to happen

Quote
You are blackmailing us by occupying 1/3rd of our country and violating our human rights, and you are trying to force us to accept your terms and you think this will bring peace? You are making a big mistake my friend.
Peace can came when you stop your illegalities, and you allow human rights and democracy in Cyprus.
You write this to TC,s but are talking about Turkey.I think you blame the TC for Turkey actions and many times are just unaware of your own racism.

Once again my question has not been answered.One learns so much more through silence.Everybody has a point to make or argue and yet no one seems to learn from each others ideas on this sight.

[boomerang]

i have been folowing this thread and it is so prdictable.i said if the problem is Turkey than (then) shoudnt the GC try tgive the TC more power so they are not as reliant on them.eg Direct flights.I also said to please not jump on this comment and instead tell me what each side should apologise for.This is obviously a question that no one is comfortable answering.I wonder why?Is it because they do not have their memorised spiel.

I've heard a lot of pathetic TC excuses but this one tops them all! was the response i received.Realise that I am just saying that If the TC has no power and Turkey has than (then) dont we have to give the TC some power to overcome the whole of Cyprus problem.In the scheme of this huge problem are direct flights so important.

Turkey’s military withdrawal from Cyprus is DEMANDED by UN resolutions and it is NOT something that should be used or accepted as a bargaining chip. There should be no “reward” expected by the Turkish Cypriots for it is in their interests that Turkey withdraws and democratic order be restored to all four corners of the island. fair enough but if the UN cant get them out what chance does the TC of doing it.

If a child is reliant on a parent and has to act on his orders than (then) should someone punish the child with as much vigour?North Cyprus must do plenty to fix their mistakes.If again i am told what each side should be sorry for than (then) it would be easier to work out what they need to do.

So the TC has violated your rights and take your land or did Turkey.I am confused you answer like its Turkeys fault and yet blame the TC for it.yYou dont want to give TC's the message that helping divide and rule can be beneficial to them.So what is their mistake within the framework of their real power?What are their real options?Or have they just been overpowered first by the British and then the Turks?

I am not saying incentives be given to the TC but that if the island needs Turkey out than (then) its not about sending messages to the TC but rather about getting turkey out.Did the TC call them to come?its better for everyone if they where gone but incentives may be needed for this to happen

Quote
You are blackmailing us by occupying 1/3rd of our country and violating our human rights, and you are trying to force us to accept your terms and you think this will bring peace? You are making a big mistake my friend.
Peace can came when you stop your illegalities, and you allow human rights and democracy in Cyprus.
You write this to TC,s but are talking about Turkey.I think you blame the TC for Turkey actions and many times are just unaware of your own racism.

Once again my question has not been answered.One learns so much more through silence.Everybody has a point to make or argue and yet no one seems to learn from each others ideas on this sight.

1...Hey curry boy how about after a comma, a full stop, a question mark, you put a space...Also learn to say THEN instead of THAN...I thought you were educated in OZ and you are a teacher...you shitting me or what?

2...The turkish generals are not in the business of taking orders form anyone...They give orders...

3...then you say

Once again my question has not been answered.One learns so much more through silence.Everybody has a point to make or argue and yet no one seems to learn from each others ideas on this sight.

We are not teachers...and not in the business of educating rita, well in your case the curry boy...

PS...Before you call me a racist for calling you a curry boy allow me to explain
1...curry coz you like curry
and
2...boy coz you haven't got a clue as to what you are talking about

[denizaksulu]

i have been folowing this thread and it is so prdictable.i said if the problem is Turkey than (then) shoudnt the GC try tgive the TC more power so they are not as reliant on them.eg Direct flights.I also said to please not jump on this comment and instead tell me what each side should apologise for.This is obviously a question that no one is comfortable answering.I wonder why?Is it because they do not have their memorised spiel.

I've heard a lot of pathetic TC excuses but this one tops them all! was the response i received.Realise that I am just saying that If the TC has no power and Turkey has than (then) dont we have to give the TC some power to overcome the whole of Cyprus problem.In the scheme of this huge problem are direct flights so important.

Turkey’s military withdrawal from Cyprus is DEMANDED by UN resolutions and it is NOT something that should be used or accepted as a bargaining chip. There should be no “reward” expected by the Turkish Cypriots for it is in their interests that Turkey withdraws and democratic order be restored to all four corners of the island. fair enough but if the UN cant get them out what chance does the TC of doing it.

If a child is reliant on a parent and has to act on his orders than (then) should someone punish the child with as much vigour?North Cyprus must do plenty to fix their mistakes.If again i am told what each side should be sorry for than (then) it would be easier to work out what they need to do.

So the TC has violated your rights and take your land or did Turkey.I am confused you answer like its Turkeys fault and yet blame the TC for it.yYou dont want to give TC's the message that helping divide and rule can be beneficial to them.So what is their mistake within the framework of their real power?What are their real options?Or have they just been overpowered first by the British and then the Turks?

I am not saying incentives be given to the TC but that if the island needs Turkey out than (then) its not about sending messages to the TC but rather about getting turkey out.Did the TC call them to come?its better for everyone if they where gone but incentives may be needed for this to happen

Quote
You are blackmailing us by occupying 1/3rd of our country and violating our human rights, and you are trying to force us to accept your terms and you think this will bring peace? You are making a big mistake my friend.
Peace can came when you stop your illegalities, and you allow human rights and democracy in Cyprus.
You write this to TC,s but are talking about Turkey.I think you blame the TC for Turkey actions and many times are just unaware of your own racism.

Once again my question has not been answered.One learns so much more through silence.Everybody has a point to make or argue and yet no one seems to learn from each others ideas on this sight.

1...Hey curry boy how about after a comma, a full stop, a question mark, you put a space...Also learn to say THEN instead of THAN...I thought you were educated in OZ and you are a teacher...you shitting me or what?

2...The turkish generals are not in the business of taking orders form anyone...They give orders...

3...then you say

Once again my question has not been answered.One learns so much more through silence.Everybody has a point to make or argue and yet no one seems to learn from each others ideas on this sight.

We are not teachers...and not in the business of educating rita, well in your case the curry boy...

PS...Before you call me a racist for calling you a curry boy allow me to explain
1...curry coz you like curry
and
2...boy coz you haven't got a clue as to what you are talking about

....and nouns begin with capital letters.


Hi Boomerang. Had a good day?