Cyprus-Forum.com

[Oracle]

We do not teach our kids to hate the Turks, because that is not how we operate. Our civilisation has not withstood the sands of time because it was built on hate.

But we do teach our kids to read and think.

So when they read. ... not from GC books ... Encyclopaedia Britannica does fine ... that the Ottomans invaded Cyprus and set about massacring the Cypriots to replace with its own people, and when after a few centuries the invading country, now renamed Turkey, sees that the people it has left to colonise Cyprus have not quite succeeded in continuing the complete oppression, and so it sends a second invasion to destroy and occupy nearly half the country and drive out 200,000 innocent people from their homes in the first such case of ethnic cleansing since the Second World War ....

.... then I think they can work it out for themselves ....

We do not teach our kids that it is wrong to hate the Turks because people like halil, zan or Deniz tell us it is wrong, whilst they and their offspring, hypocritically occupy other people's land.

We just teach our kids to think .... and they can!

That is our greatest weapon.

[denizaksulu]

Deniz, thanks for the story.

What is more alarming right now however is how the teenage minds are formed as well. These are the kids that are just about to join the army and the enviroment they grow up in is not a healthy one to this day.

Take ths website for example
www.greekmurderers.net A normal thinking human being would ignore this type of crap, teenagers however will not.

In fact the only adult that i know that uses this typ of website is Zan who's been caught quoting from it a number of times. Now you tell me, what more dangerous?

I have noted that you have not ignored that web site. Unfortunately such sites, anti Turk anti Greek are plentyful. Dont you think that OrPh is a subscriber to these sites.

Seriously I dont think Zan needs these sites. He talks through his heart and I do not necessarily agree with everything he says.

I have enough first hand experience of Turks and their atrocities that any opinions I have of Turks are based on solid evidence and facts from the highest sources.

There are enough of these to fry Turkey.

I have said it before OrPh and I will say it again and most probaly will repeat it at a later date. I am sorry for all the 'atricities' you and my fellow GCs have suffered at the hands of 'The Turks'. Are you sorry of any wrongdoings the GCs have commited against TCs? I know this is not the 'Sorry' thread, but they are all connected as you keep on bringing it up.

Have a good day.


Sorry, it is the 'sorry' thread.

[halil]

Halil, my point is that it is a different scenarion with your kids. They are growing up in what is effectively the spoils of war. They are not staring at a situation every day hoping it will change one day and the one that does not allow this change is the "Turk."

I could not stop my mother of sighing every now and then that she wishes she was in Morphou or Nikitas now. The kid will pick up on this and question, why is the parent sad? What is making his parent sad?

Now we both know that educated people (apart from some fanatics) would never start their kids lives off like that. Regardless of what is happening, teaching your kid to hate a colelctive or an individual is ludicrous. But they will pick up on the anxiety and/or sadness.

As far as the books are concerned, I have no idea (honestly) whats in them today, perhaps someone who has studied them recently can give us an opinion. I still insist however, that goodwill image corrective actions from your side are long overdue. I hope we will be able to find a practical way of reciprocating that as well.

DT, i understand your points but you and i not to teach our kids or talk about same things that what our parents are doing . İn here also same things applies to TC's .Very simple example A BİRTHPLACE İS NEVER FORGOTTEN. Everyday we can see on our news papers , ıt says PAİNFULL LOSS.
also state the place of residence of deceased before 1974.
it says like that :Originialy from Limassol,by beloved partner , Father Mustafa ........ ; originally from İstinjo,settled in Morphou our most beloved uncle ....... etc......etc......
these obituaries convey particular messages.
Even though people may be forced to leave , or migrate from their homes ,they never forget their place of birth , the villages and towns they grew up in DT. they are all true and applies to TC's and GC's as well . We must get lessons from past and we must not push our kids into this muddle . Our only way is education . The way how we grow up them .Our parents and us will pass away one day but ours kids will live in this island , from now and so on .............

[denizaksulu]

Halil, my point is that it is a different scenarion with your kids. They are growing up in what is effectively the spoils of war. They are not staring at a situation every day hoping it will change one day and the one that does not allow this change is the "Turk."

I could not stop my mother of sighing every now and then that she wishes she was in Morphou or Nikitas now. The kid will pick up on this and question, why is the parent sad? What is making his parent sad?

Now we both know that educated people (apart from some fanatics) would never start their kids lives off like that. Regardless of what is happening, teaching your kid to hate a colelctive or an individual is ludicrous. But they will pick up on the anxiety and/or sadness.

As far as the books are concerned, I have no idea (honestly) whats in them today, perhaps someone who has studied them recently can give us an opinion. I still insist however, that goodwill image corrective actions from your side are long overdue. I hope we will be able to find a practical way of reciprocating that as well.

DT, we can not keep on saying 'its a different scenario' etc. What is happening here was the egg before the chicken or vice versa. Instead of accusing, lets discuss without the accusations. I am mindful of the same that I am trying to steer away from. Easily done.

[halil]

2004.12.28] Cyprus history books in internet
Kibris Newspaper
Secondary history books and fourth grade primary school books and exercise books in certain lessons will be available at http://www.mebnet.net.

Cyprus history books are transmitted in internet. Secondary history books and fourth grade primary school books and exercise books in certain lessons will be available at http://www.mebnet.net.

Hasan Alicik, Director of the Ministry of Education and Culture said that through this way, it would be possible to provide such a service to the wider world. “Our history is written by Turksih Cypriots. That’s why we should write our history as well”, he added.

He also said that they were aiming at improving the quality of books through participatory understanding. “Reform of the books are not sufficient but school teachers are required to be trained as well. That is the reason why we are planning to carry out in-service training for the teachers”, he noted. "New Cyprus history books grabbed the attention not only of the students but the majority of the Turkish Cypriot community.”

[Nikitas]

Purdey wrote:

"The USA has the same approach with their native Americans.Cyprus,hell will freeze over first.."

Good point. Americans are quick to promote partition and independence of minorities overseas, but whenever any part of their society displays the slightest tendency to remain separate or split off they come down on them like the proverbial ton of bricks. Starting with their drive westwards when they demolished the Indians and remnants of the Spanish communities to their civil war and the persecution of the American Indian Movement.

We should teach them a lesson and ask them either to limit their diplomatice presence in the EU to one embassy in Brussels or ask for each EU nation to have an embassy in each state capital. Then watch them rationalise their objections. Nothing is funnier than American spin doctors doing their stuff.

[zan]

We do not teach our kids to hate the Turks, because that is not how we operate. Our civilisation has not withstood the sands of time because it was built on hate.

But we do teach our kids to read and think.

So when they read. ... not from GC books ... Encyclopaedia Britannica does fine ... that the Ottomans invaded Cyprus and set about massacring the Cypriots to replace with its own people, and when after a few centuries the invading country, now renamed Turkey, sees that the people it has left to colonise Cyprus have not quite succeeded in continuing the complete oppression, and so it sends a second invasion to destroy and occupy nearly half the country and drive out 200,000 innocent people from their homes in the first such case of ethnic cleansing since the Second World War ....

.... then I think they can work it out for themselves ....

We do not teach our kids that it is wrong to hate the Turks because people like halil, zan or Deniz tell us it is wrong, whilst they and their offspring, hypocritically occupy other people's land.

We just teach our kids to think .... and they can!

That is our greatest weapon.

But you obviously are the worst of examples in reading and thinking.......How many times have I posted the correct number of refugees...Now show me where the 200,000 refugees are please so that we can see what you are teaching your children. SHOW ME WHERE IT SAYS 200,000 and we shall see who does the right amount of reading and the ones that are brain washed by witches like you......... I don't hold any hope that you will answer this because you are so full of crap Frau Shyster!!!

[DT.]

We do not teach our kids to hate the Turks, because that is not how we operate. Our civilisation has not withstood the sands of time because it was built on hate.

But we do teach our kids to read and think.

So when they read. ... not from GC books ... Encyclopaedia Britannica does fine ... that the Ottomans invaded Cyprus and set about massacring the Cypriots to replace with its own people, and when after a few centuries the invading country, now renamed Turkey, sees that the people it has left to colonise Cyprus have not quite succeeded in continuing the complete oppression, and so it sends a second invasion to destroy and occupy nearly half the country and drive out 200,000 innocent people from their homes in the first such case of ethnic cleansing since the Second World War ....

.... then I think they can work it out for themselves ....

We do not teach our kids that it is wrong to hate the Turks because people like halil, zan or Deniz tell us it is wrong, whilst they and their offspring, hypocritically occupy other people's land.

We just teach our kids to think .... and they can!

That is our greatest weapon.

But you obviously are the worst of examples in reading and thinking.......How many times have I posted the correct number of refugees...Now show me where the 200,000 refugees are please so that we can see what you are teaching your children. SHOW ME WHERE IT SAYS 200,000 and we shall see who does the right amount of reading and the ones that are brain washed by witches like you......... I don't hold any hope that you will answer this because you are so full of crap Frau Shyster!!!

tsk tsk..such anger.

[Ghandi]

Imagıne my excıtement at havıng 65 responses to my questıon.I was really ıntersted ın knowıng what peoıple thought an apology should contaın.

Unfortunetely the responses conaıned nothıng more thean banter between ındıvıduals.I learnt nothıng from a sıght that could be very benefıcıal.

Why dont you just have your banter on another thread?Why choose a persons questıon that would be used for genuıne reasearch ?

Thıs has happened before.The people on thıs sıght obvıously thınk of themselves a ıntellıgent.Intellıgent enough to respond only to a certaın group of ıntellectuals.I just thınk they are rude.

As for the educatıon system many on here obvıously dıd not have much cıvıcs,cıtızenshıp ad problem solvıng ın theırs.

Unlıke many ı regard manners hıghly therefore ı wıll respond to the posts on the educatıon systerm although ı beleıve many here are lıke Cyprus

Not prisoners of fate, but only prisoners of their own minds.
Franklin D. Roosevelt,


Thıs ıs a part of an artıcle on the educatıon system ı wrote

I am an Australian Cypriot educator who after reading about the conservative and centralized system and talking to students, teachers and parents believes this system has to change. It is outdated and does not serve the interests of our new generation

In many Cypriot classrooms the teacher is the knower of all the grand power.
. Were he stands and delivers all his knowledge while a class sits passively and absorbs. Should it not be their right to be taught to think and not what to think?

Imagine a country that is helped so much that it becomes reliant on another for its survival at the cost of an identity as they become invisible organs of the other nation. Yes other counties and teachers have helped but it should not be at the cost of any humanity.

Students have concerns that are not heard, they do not feel understood and I believe that they do not feel like their uniqueness belongs in the classroom. Without empathy and the similarities in learners being celebrated, I do not see how many classes will have a commitment to a better future.

Teachers have no right to treat students as “puppets “.If teachers have the power to control everything and students are not given opportunities to use their own beliefs and creativity they will indeed become puppets. The strings that are used to control with linger on in all there learning experiences. A teacher’s role should be based less on expecting and more on awaking expectations. Giving the leaders of tomorrow a chance.

In a world full of propaganda the education system should give students the opportunities to learn how to inquire into, instead of continually looking at a teacher to learn because then they will become easy pawns in any agenda. There learning should not be limited because they are from another time the age of information we do not need them to blindly accept and become lazy citizens.

Without the time given to develop ideas and there ability to tolerate ambiguity students learn to jump at less then optimal solutions. Why would a system create students who will become inferior decision makers?

Am I a traitor to the teaching profession if I think twice about whether I should correct a student who goes outside the lines in a coloring book or who has a different view on a “great “ leader or is this conformity warranted?

Isn’t it more important that we feel the shame that may lead us to change the system so students are taught responsibility for there own ideas. That empowerment is given back to our children as is the ability to clarify their values. Reflecting on the meaning of humanity will only create a better life for all.

Does the fault lie with the government, the teachers, parents, universities or teachers union?

I think that there have been some attempts at change through the history curriculum and many teachers have realized that a teacher based classroom is not what the education community is fighting for anymore.

There have been attempts for large training projects for teachers which are a difficult task as there is an ethnocentric mentality on what education should look like.

. Teachers in Cyprus also do not have much of a voice in this centralized system and most of there anxieties are therefore kept private and they’re accountability low. They also face similar problems to other races such as lack of space and time in the curriculum and the fact that changes in attitude require a long term perspective.

Essentially the system has not been reconstructed and we have a system that is taking the rights of young humans and this should be the shame of all groups except the students.

Cyprus is a unique island because its situation is different; it has many histories, nationalism, and many topics of discussion. This coupled with its small population and naïve educational history gives us hope, that it is the ideal place to create the openness needed, to give students the optimal learning environment that can set precedents world wide.
The teaching of co-operative debate can be an attempt at a solution to the current problems. Through Co-operative debate they learn to disagree with each other while confirming one another’s personal competences, learning through communication to judge ideas and not people
The habit of mind is a teaching method that teaches how to behave intelligently when confronted with problems, were the answers are not immediately known they search and give reasons for their opinions. I trust that this will lead to a life that promotes listening with understanding and empathy. A life with creativity and the ability to take responsible risks. The questioning and posing problem skill will help the youth become better at learning how to rise above basic cultural assumptions and in the process not forget there humanity.. We must not forget that humanity is based on a similarity of all thinkers the spirit of inquiry
Students must confront their suspicious of what is on the other side by thinking about how and why history is represented.
“It is not the strongest of the species that survives, or the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change”. Charles Darwin.
All of the concepts discussed in this paper are in essence the problems not only in education but in Cyprus.

The Education system also does match the culture it comes from, so I think the problem is deeper than thought. It is the mentality and cultural basic assumptions of all our people. Through History we know that the political climate always affects the educational one.

The lack of dialogue, denial of wrongs, nationalism and the propaganda of difference and non acknowledgement of similarity, amongst the many other mistakes mentioned has made a solution in Cyprus difficult.

Sadly the definition of a democracy for the people by the people does not exist in our classrooms and therefore it is debatable if it ever really existed in our country. The people of Cyprus must take some responsibility for this and the leaders take a little more responsibility and also realize that
“The art of governing consists simply of being honest, exercising common sense, following principle, and doing what is right and just.”

[Ghandi]

Sadly I am not expectıng any replıes that aknowlwdge my post and sıncere questıon.Just more war between patrıots macaradıng as ıntellectual rıgour.