Cyprus-Forum.com

[halil]

Get Real and DT,

The Administration in North Cyprus were one of the first to make its statement of recognizing the UDI of Kosovo from a province to a nation. At the moment, fourteen nations have formally recognized Kosovo (of which three are UNSC permanent members) with more poised to follow suit over the next few days. Expatkiwi's warning is not one to be brushed off lightly given Talat's message of support.
Why would Kosovo recognize the north of Cyprus as the TRNC? First, since the Republic of Cyprus had led the way in splitting the EU on the recognition issue, the Pristina government would not be feeling well-disposed to the Republic of Cyprus Government. Second, recognition of TRNC would further cement close ties to its traditional ally Turkey (which also signaled early recognition). Third, the rubicon of initial international recognition has already been crossed and a swift withdrawal of recogition would really not be realistic by a Kosovan TRNC recognition move. Fourth, the Republic of Kosovo is not obliged to follow UN Security Council resolutions as it is not a UN member and that the resolutions pertaining to Cyprus only apply to UN members. In addition, the fact that Kosovo is not going to get into the UN due to the veto powers of the Peoples Republic of China and the Russian Federation only makes the Pristina Government's decision on this easier. Fifth, Putin had said quite clearly that the TRNC should be recognized if Kosovo is. THAT was a real diplomatic fubar from him, and reinforces the view that the north is a de facto republic (if not de jure). Sixth, Kosovo assession to the EU will not happen due to the fact that at least five member nations will veto the assession - led by Cyprus, so threats about denying EU memebership to Kosovo is not going to cut any ice unless the attitiude among certain member nations changes.
So - like Expatkiwi has already said - I would be cautious of Kosovo. If the new President of Cyprus fails to deliver on reunification promises and - like Papadopolous - it makes the Republic of Cyprus look at fault, that, plus the continued policy of hostility to Kosovo Independence will very likely result in the north being recognized as a sovereign nation by another country: The Republic of Kosovo. When THAT rubicon is crossed, then you might as well kiss goodbye to any attempt at reconciliation.

Thank you, Utu. I couldn't have put it any better myself.

Thank you, Utu. I couldn't have put it any better myself.

I agree. You never can, since most of your points have no value at all, due to your hypocrisy.

As far as recognition by the "TRNC" and "KOSOVO" of each other goes, it amounts to this equation.


(-ve) + (-ve) = -ve

Hardly anything to write home about.!!!

Furthermore, by trying to link any correlation of the conditions on the ground between the "states" of TRNC" and "KOSOVO", the conditions are as wide as the Grand Canyon itself. Their only commonality that exists are, that they are illegal in the eyes of the international community, no matter how much recognition they may get from legal states. I use the "..." to address these "states" as not being legal, as they are not in the eyes of the UN. Like anything else in life, if one does not play by the rules, then they are committing a "foul", and since we have given that responsibility to the UN to be the "referee" as to what a "foul" is, then the "TRNC" and "KOSOVO" are as illegal as they get.

Expatkiwi,

I have meant to post to last week, but did not have time. You have not been "fudging" numbers again, have you.??

The 1960 Constitution
Cyprus was declared an independent state on August 16, 1960. The new state's constitution, as defined by the Zürich and London Agreements, explicitly recognised the two main ethnic communities in Cyprus:

the Greek Cypriot community with approximately 65% of the population and

the Turkish Cypriot community with approximately 35% of the population.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyprus

Kikapu,
have a response to below tread. this is more important mate.
Tarafların pozisyonları belli.Yazmakla olmuyor.
http://www.cyprus-forum.com/viewtopic.p ... ffb21c3143

[denizaksulu]

The case of the disappearing GC's AGAIN!

....or is it the higher birthrate of the TCs ?

[Expatkiwi]

Expatkiwi,

I have meant to post to last week, but did not have time. You have not been "fudging" numbers again, have you.??

Quote:
The 1960 Constitution
Cyprus was declared an independent state on August 16, 1960. The new state's constitution, as defined by the Zürich and London Agreements, explicitly recognised the two main ethnic communities in Cyprus:

the Greek Cypriot community with approximately 65% of the population and

the Turkish Cypriot community with approximately 35% of the population.

Interestingly enough (and as hard as it might seem for you to beleive it), this one I have no knowledge of. I'm well aware that the Turkish Cypriots made up a little over 18% of the total population of the island. By the way, with the number of countries recognizing Kosovo increasing daily (including my own USA, though New Zealand is being a real fence-sitter on the issue at the moment), Kosovo's status is not exactly 'illegal' now, is it?

[Expatkiwi]

Utu and Expat, let's keep things simple...

Internationally, Kosovo is currently an absolute NOBODY and must therefore be desperate to survive and be accepted more than anything else. The last thing Kosovo needs right now is to start playing international games such as recognizing a UN rejected “TRNC” like you suggest.

Ask yourself, if you were the newbie president of Kosovo would it be in your newfound country’s interests to start international power-playing games?

If Kosovo is denied UN membership and EU membership because of Cyprus throwing a spanner into the works, reciprocating the 'spanner-throwing' by recognition of TRNC would not be beyond the realms of possibility. FYI, I contacted the TRNC Rep here in Los Angles for his understanding on the Kosovo issue. He replied that Kosovo would be playing a wait-and-see strategy and will see how the new RoCy government will tackle the Cyprus Question before making a decision. He does beleive that substantial support in Kosovo for the TRNC exists (as well as opposition to RoCy) and that recognition would be forthcoming if your side drops the ball. Personally, I'm hoping that they will.

[Nikitas]

The real issue here is not whether Kossovo is legal or not. The real issue is what is the status of the minorities in Kossovo in the future. Whether independent or autonomous the problem is what happens to the minorities of Serbs, Rom and others. This is the point which reflects on Cyprus.

EULEX is there to see that these minorities retain their rights. The Kossovars are bending over backwards to convince everyone that the rights of minorities are guaranteed. The next few months will show how the situation will go.

Drawing a parallel with Cyprus the point is not whether the TRNC is recognised or not, but what will happen to the rights of the GCs who own property in the north. Apparently independence does not deprive the minorities of their properties in Kossovo, nor their rights to reside anywhere in the province. Are all the TCs who are enthusing over Kossovo share these views?

[Kikapu]

Expatkiwi,

I have meant to post to last week, but did not have time. You have not been "fudging" numbers again, have you.??

Quote:
The 1960 Constitution
Cyprus was declared an independent state on August 16, 1960. The new state's constitution, as defined by the Zürich and London Agreements, explicitly recognised the two main ethnic communities in Cyprus:

the Greek Cypriot community with approximately 65% of the population and

the Turkish Cypriot community with approximately 35% of the population.

Interestingly enough (and as hard as it might seem for you to beleive it), this one I have no knowledge of. I'm well aware that the Turkish Cypriots made up a little over 18% of the total population of the island. By the way, with the number of countries recognizing Kosovo increasing daily (including my own USA, though New Zealand is being a real fence-sitter on the issue at the moment), Kosovo's status is not exactly 'illegal' now, is it?

Interestingly enough (and as hard as it might seem for you to beleive it), this one I have no knowledge of

I was just checking with a question.......not accusing you.!!

By the way, with the number of countries recognizing Kosovo increasing daily (including my own USA, though New Zealand is being a real fence-sitter on the issue at the moment), Kosovo's status is not exactly 'illegal' now, is it.?

Irrelevant how many countries recognises "Kosovo". Numbers has nothing to do with it. Following your logic, just because Turkey recognises the "TRNC", then it must be legal.................well, is it.??

I support "Kosovo" to become an independent state, legally.

I suppose technically speaking Expatkiwi, until the UN says that Kosovo is legal, or illegal, she still remains part of Serbia. So lets wait for the official ruling by the UN, when the UNSC votes on the matter soon.

[DT.]

Utu and Expat, let's keep things simple...

Internationally, Kosovo is currently an absolute NOBODY and must therefore be desperate to survive and be accepted more than anything else. The last thing Kosovo needs right now is to start playing international games such as recognizing a UN rejected “TRNC” like you suggest.

Ask yourself, if you were the newbie president of Kosovo would it be in your newfound country’s interests to start international power-playing games?

If Kosovo is denied UN membership and EU membership because of Cyprus throwing a spanner into the works, reciprocating the 'spanner-throwing' by recognition of TRNC would not be beyond the realms of possibility. FYI, I contacted the TRNC Rep here in Los Angles for his understanding on the Kosovo issue. He replied that Kosovo would be playing a wait-and-see strategy and will see how the new RoCy government will tackle the Cyprus Question before making a decision. He does beleive that substantial support in Kosovo for the TRNC exists (as well as opposition to RoCy) and that recognition would be forthcoming if your side drops the ball. Personally, I'm hoping that they will.

Expat, next time you speak to him could you please ask him why he's too embarassed to write in his cv on his website that he is the "trnc" rep? I also like the name change from Mehmet to Mike!

Mike M. Mustafoglu. Mr. Mustafoglu is the founder and President of TransGlobal Financial LLC. Prior to establishing TransGlobal in 1991, Mr. Mustafoglu served in executive positions with the Oxbow Group, which has been ranked by Forbes magazine as one of the top 400 privately held companies in the United States. The Oxbow group of companies has been engaged in private equity investing, commodities trading, industrial manufacturing, electricity, oil and coal production, petroleum refining, publishing and high technology. Mr. Mustafoglu was instrumental in the startup, turnaround and development of various Oxbow portfolio companies and served on the firm's Management Committee. He was vice-president of Oxbow Resources, and President of the following companies: Oxbow Energy, Inc., Pacific Basin Transportation, Inc., Oxbow Hydrocarbons, Inc. and PetroPort Terminal Corporation. Prior to joining Oxbow in 1984, Mr. Mustafoglu was with Getty Oil Company of Los Angeles, where he had executive positions in corporate finance and planning. His most recent position was Vice President of Finance for Getty Oil Canada, a $600 million company. Prior to joining Getty, he was with Shell Oil Company performing digital seismic wave processing.

Mr. Mustafoglu serves as director on the boards of various public and private companies. Some of these public companies included ECO2, Inc., Serv-Tech, Inc., Corgenix Medical Corporation, U.S. Medical Group, Inc. and Para Mas Internet, Inc.

Mr. Mustafoglu received a Bachelor of Science degree in Electrical Engineering from Wichita State University in Kansas in 1974, where he attended school as a Fulbright Scholar. He earned a Masters in Business Administration in finance and quantitative science from University of Southern California/University of Houston in 1978. In 1990, Palm Beach Atlantic College awarded him the American Free Enterprise Medal in recognition of his entrepreneurial accomplishments. Mr. Mustafoglu is the author of various articles dealing with business risk.

[Nikitas]

Expatkiwi wrote:

"If Kosovo is denied UN membership and EU membership because of Cyprus throwing a spanner into the works, reciprocating the 'spanner-throwing' by recognition of TRNC would not be beyond the realms of possibility."

And the TRNC no doubt will withdraw its recognition of Spain and Romania and Bulgaria who are also opposed to Kossovo independence and are far more likely than RoC to oppose EU entry. Wow! Fearsome TRNC!

[Expatkiwi]

I bet you guys are havingh a good laugh at what is happening in Belgrade at the moment. Low-life Serb hooligans stormed and burned the United States Embassy. Bastards!


By the way, DT, Mike (to his friends) Mustafagolu and his wife Demetra are personal friends of my family.

[BC Numismatics]

The difference between Kosovo & the so-called 'TRNC' is one is now recognised legally as a proper country (Kosovo),& the other isn't (so-called 'TRNC').

Aidan.