Cyprus-Forum.com

[BirKibrisli]

Question 1 is about the Ottoman conquer of Cyprus and the following administrative order...Here is the opening paragraph in full translation:

"The Ottoman Empire conquered Cyprus in 1571,at a cost of 80,000 martyrs,in order to stop the pirates based on Cyprus from attacking ships sailing through the Mediterranean,and to help the Orthodox Greeks who were oppressed by the Catholic Venetians."
The ottoman rule lasted for 307 years in practice and 352 years legally...

During this time Cyprus experienced a liberty not seen in her long history.

The Turks liberated the Orthodox church and brought the freedom of religion to Greek Cypriots...By accepting the Archbishop as the political representative of his people,Ottoman rule gave Greek Cypriots the right to take their grievances directly to the Palace...

The Greek Cypriots responded by supporting the Greek uprising of 1821 by means of money,ammunition and soldiers,and by trying to massacre the entire Turkish Cypriot population in the same year...

During the Ottoman rule the economic situation of the Greek Cypriots improved immeasurably...This was the result of the great tolerance shown to them by the Ottomans...

The island's administrative system was redrawn,and brought under 17 districts run by "KADIs"...Greek Cypriots as well as Armenian and Maronite Cypriots were given representation rights on the Administrative Council... Hence for the first time in their history,Greek Cypriots had a say in the running of their island...Also by means of tax collection by the Church,and the liberties in the education system,Greek Cypriots enjoyed an early form of self-rule...

There you are,you ungrateful sods....Now you know how good you had it under the Ottomans....What say you...????????

BK, The lines highlighted in red are well documented and have references in western publications.

The other paragraphs (not highlighted) also have references in Western sources.

Are any references given in this book? I for one am glad I dont refer to Turkish Publications as I prefer 'neutral' or original sources.

Translating bits and pieces are prone to errors and are in danger of loosing original meanings ( like the Bible translations). This is just a quick observation BK.

Please clarify the purpose of the 'bits and pieces' so we can attempt to comment 'objectively'.

Selamlar

Please clarify 'who are the 'ungrateful sods' you refer to''.

No,Deniz.No references so far in this book.
And I am not translating bits and pieces. I am essentially summary translating everything,except the repetitions.

What I am doing is trying to show how we are brainwashed by our so called "historians"...Of course there are references to most of this stuff in western publications. But this guy is taking the historical events and putting the best possible spin on them to whitewash history. Notice the use of words like "martyrs" and phrases like "to help the Orthodox Greeks", "Cyprus experienced liberty...", "the freedom of religion", "to massacre the entire TC population", "the economic situation of the GCs improved immeasurably" etc etc....The cumulative effect is the implication that the Ottomans did the Cypriots a favour by invading them...

You know and I know that when the Ottomans captured a place they summarily executed the ruling elite and the top ranking soldiers,as a matter of course..And there was a period of "free for all" for the Ottoman soldiers (lasting 3 days if I am not mistaken) when they could go looting and raping and killing at will,especially if the enemy did not surrender on command...Mr Ismail chose to ignore those historical facts which did not suit him...This book is pure propaganda at its best. I feel we need to understand how we are spoon-fed this stuff which poisons our minds. I have no doubt there are equivalent publications on the "other" side. We just have to expose them for what they are if we are to get to the point of real understanding,empathy and compassion for our fellow Cypriots...

[BirKibrisli]

I just came across this book by a Mr Sabahattin Ismail,who,according to the back cover of his book, is a Paphian Journalist who has occupied some important positions in the trnc administration. In the year 2000, he was working as the permanent secretary to the President,who I take to be Mr RR Denktash...So we can safely assume this is the Official trnc approved short history of the Cyprus problem...

I thought it might be interesting to take a close look at it.
This will give our Cypriot brothers and sisters a good idea of the kind of brainwashing which goes on in the North of the border...

Please feel free to jump in as usual and agree or disagree with Mr Ismail's version of the events...The book is in Turkish,so I intend to summarise the general points for you in English,and translate some of the more important aspects in full...The Questions in question goes back to 1571,and covers most of the important milestones in the Cyprus conflict,strictly from the Turkish and TC perspective...I hope you will enjoy
this exercise,and participate in great numbers in bringing out the truth of the matters...

Bir
When introducing Sabahattin Ismail AKA "SABO" (to ordinary TC's) you should have also stated that he is the Chief Editor for TC daily paper Volkan...He also is an ex commie educated in Moscow at the same time as Dogan Harman..
He was press advisor for Denktas during his presidency.
He does not reflect "Official trnc approved short history of the Cyprus problem"
The books he wrote were sponsored by Denktas when he was in power...
Sabahattin Ismail was one of the two leading figures (Taner Etkin was the other) of the non existent UHH (Ulusal Halk Harekati) the organisation formed by Denktas to rival the TC peoples movement before 2003...

That should give you an idea of this gentleman before you start discussing his views on Cyprus history..

Thanks for that info,iceman. I had no idea who this gentleman was except what was written on the back cover. You say these books were sponsored by Denktash when he was in power. You also say " he does not reflect" the official trnc approved history of the Cypro...Does that mean you believe there is a difference between Denktash's view and the official view??? Please expand on that if you will...

[iceman]

yes bir.I do believe there is a difference between Denktas' view of the history and the present official view..To my knowledge this has reflected even to the history books used in the schools and it did cause some arguments few years ago..

[BC Numismatics]

Deniz,that's Rauf Denktash,who looks kind of like the big fat ugly pointed-hatted Nazi gorilla called the Pope of Rome.

Aidan.

Thanks but No thanks BCN. I never even thought of insulting your Greek National Hero. I looked him up on the net and read about him and thereby expanding my knowlege re: the collapse of the Ottoman Empire..

Have a nice evening

Deniz,I don't have a Greek national hero at all.I do admire this guy; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Paisley though.

Aidan.

[BirKibrisli]

Question 2 is about the origins of the TCs. 3 is about the origins of the GCs...Nothing very notable in either of those topics....

Question 4 is: What is Megali idea??????

The literal definition of megali idea is "the big ideal"...
This idea is in existence since the 1453 capture of Istanbul by Fatih Sultan Mehmet...According to this big idea Constantinople will be recaptured,and a Great Hellenic Empire will be re-established on the lands from Greece,Crete,Rodes,Cyprus,Anatolia,all the way to Alexandria in Egypt.

Megali idea is the brainchild of one Rigas Ferreros. He is responsible for preparing the first Megali Idea map,and publishing it in Vienna in 1796.

The job of fostering theMegali Idea and passing it on to the following generations fell onto the Orthodox Church,and their Patriarchy in Istanbul...
It is undeniable that their success depended very much on the tolerance shown to the Church by the Ottomans.
The Megali Idea got its momentum after Greece got her independence in 1821. Crete,Rhodes and the Aegean Islands became Greek territory,Greece invaded Anatolia,but was repelled by the Turkish people in Anatolia and by the Turkish Cypriots in Cyprus...

It is important to stress that Megali Idea was always supported by the Western nations,especially by Britain and Russia....

So that is Megali Idea according to Mr Ismail...Everyone happy with that???

Question 5 is: What are Filiki Eteriya and Ethniki Eteriya???

Megali Idea was supported by the various Balkan countries,the British,and The Russians ,who had their own expansionist ideas at the expense of the ottoman Empire...An organisation was needed to put Megali Idea into operation.So in 1814,in the Russian city of Odessa ,an organisation called Filiki Eteriya was founded and secretly supported by the Tsarist Russia.

Soon the orgainsation spred to the Balkans,and was headed by the Tsar Alexandre's Aid De Camp,Alexandros Ipsilantis. In 1821 the Mora uprising was started by the Filiki Eteriya. It is known that a branch of Etniki Eteriya was founded in Cyprus,and was supported by the Orthodox priests which had great influence over the Greek Cypriots. It is also known that this organisation was behind the uprisings in Cyprus.

After Greece's independence another organisation was established in the Greek Army called Ethniki Eteriya. This organisation played the lead role in Crete's annexation by Greece...Both these organisations had the Megali Idea as their main objective. And to achieve this objective they secretly organised uprisings on Ottoman soil....

Now,this all Mr Ismail says about these organisations. He implies that they were sinister organisations acting against the Ottomans. Does anyone know any more about these organisations??? How are they considered by present day Greeks or GCs???? (Bir)

[BirKibrisli]

Question 2 is about the origins of the TCs. 3 is about the origins of the GCs...Nothing very notable in either of those topics....

Question 4 is: What is Megali idea??????

The literal definition of megali idea is "the big ideal"...
This idea is in existence since the 1453 capture of Istanbul by Fatih Sultan Mehmet...According to this big idea Constantinople will be recaptured,and a Great Hellenic Empire will be re-established on the lands from Greece,Crete,Rodes,Cyprus,Anatolia,all the way to Alexandria in Egypt.

Megali idea is the brainchild of one Rigas Ferreros. He is responsible for preparing the first Megali Idea map,and publishing it in Vienna in 1796.

The job of fostering theMegali Idea and passing it on to the following generations fell onto the Orthodox Church,and their Patriarchy in Istanbul...
It is undeniable that their success depended very much on the tolerance shown to the Church by the Ottomans.
The Megali Idea got its momentum after Greece got her independence in 1821. Crete,Rhodes and the Aegean Islands became Greek territory,Greece invaded Anatolia,but was repelled by the Turkish people in Anatolia and by the Turkish Cypriots in Cyprus...

It is important to stress that Megali Idea was always supported by the Western nations,especially by Britain and Russia....

So that is Megali Idea according to Mr Ismail...Everyone happy with that???

Question 5 is: What are Filiki Eteriya and Ethniki Eteriya???

Megali Idea was supported by the various Balkan countries,the British,and The Russians ,who had their own expansionist ideas at the expense of the ottoman Empire...An organisation was needed to put Megali Idea into operation.So in 1814,in the Russian city of Odessa ,an organisation called Filiki Eteriya was founded and secretly supported by the Tsarist Russia.

Soon the orgainsation spred to the Balkans,and was headed by the Tsar Alexandre's Aid De Camp,Alexandros Ipsilantis. In 1821 the Mora uprising was started by the Filiki Eteriya. It is known that a branch of Etniki Eteriya was founded in Cyprus,and was supported by the Orthodox priests which had great influence over the Greek Cypriots. It is also known that this organisation was behind the uprisings in Cyprus.

After Greece's independence another organisation was established in the Greek Army called Ethniki Eteriya. This organisation played the lead role in Crete's annexation by Greece...Both these organisations had the Megali Idea as their main objective. And to achieve this objective they secretly organised uprisings on Ottoman soil....

Now,this all Mr Ismail says about these organisations. He implies that they were sinister organisations acting against the Ottomans. Does anyone know any more about these organisations??? How are they considered by present day Greeks or GCs???? (Bir)

Question No 6 is : What is ENOSIS??????

Enosis is the union of Cyprus with Greece under the framework of Megali Idea...The idea has been around since 1791...We can say that this is the starting date of the Cyprus problem...

Greece officially demanded Cyprus on 30 December,1918.

On 18 September 1928 Greece gave an ultimatum to Britain,Russia and France demanding Enosis with Cyprus.
And after theWWI,at the Paris peace conference,Greek PM Venizelos made the following demands :

1.Western Anatolia (Izmir,Bursa,Canakkale,Izmit and the environments)

2.Pontus (Trabzon,Sivas,Kastamonu and the environments)

3.North Epir (South Albania)

4. Cyprus,Rhodes,Meis,Bozcaada,and Imros

5.West and East Thrace...


Enosis movement was supported by the Greek Orthodox Church,the Patriarchy,and the Greek Government.This ideal was used by the Church and the schools for many years to brainwash young minds hence causing great catastrophe for Cyprus.

From 1821 onwards,in order to achieve Enosis,the Turkish Cypriot community was regularly attacked. As they saw the TCs as an obstacle for Enosis,attacks and massacres were organised against the TCs in 1895,1912, and during 1955-74...

A Greek writer, Tenekides,describes how Enosis was drilled into GC brains in this way: " GC schools were used to spread the Hellenic ideals.
GC teachers used to present gifts, showing Cyprus in a state of union with Greece, to the Governor whenever he visited their villages,while the GC students chanted "Zito Enosis" slogans..."
The recent aim of the Enosis movement is to achieve a Greek Cypriot Republic over the whole island,to become a member of the EU and hence indirectly achieving union with Greece,and to reduce the TC community to a minority status in Cyprus...

[GreekForumer]

Megali idea is the brainchild of one Rigas Ferreros. He is responsible for preparing the first Megali Idea map,and publishing it in Vienna in 1796.?

But the revolutionary hymn was not simply rhetoric, or something to be sung late in the evening at the Taverna ton Ellinon; it embodied important elements of Rigas' philosophy, some unexpected. First, the revolution is to be not against Turks as such, but against tyranny. Turks, he says, are oppressed equally with Greeks, equally with Christians.

We who suffer under the yoke, let us kill the ravening wolves
Who keep us in harsh subjection, Christian and Turk alike.

Thus Turks are summoned to join in the coming struggle and not only the Turks: in the course of some twenty lines Rigas calls for support from Bulgarians, Albanians, Armenians and Arabs, and from the people of Malta, Egypt and Aleppo. Although the appeal was to Muslims as well as Christians, Rigas somewhat naively proposed the symbol of the united movement against tyranny should be the cross.

David Brewer, "The Greek War of Independence" pg 18
ISBN : 978-1585673957

[Tim Drayton]

Megali idea is the brainchild of one Rigas Ferreros. He is responsible for preparing the first Megali Idea map,and publishing it in Vienna in 1796.?

But the revolutionary hymn was not simply rhetoric, or something to be sung late in the evening at the Taverna ton Ellinon; it embodied important elements of Rigas' philosophy, some unexpected. First, the revolution is to be not against Turks as such, but against tyranny. Turks, he says, are oppressed equally with Greeks, equally with Christians.

We who suffer under the yoke, let us kill the ravening wolves
Who keep us in harsh subjection, Christian and Turk alike.

Thus Turks are summoned to join in the coming struggle and not only the Turks: in the course of some twenty lines Rigas calls for support from Bulgarians, Albanians, Armenians and Arabs, and from the people of Malta, Egypt and Aleppo. Although the appeal was to Muslims as well as Christians, Rigas somewhat naively proposed the symbol of the united movement against tyranny should be the cross.

David Brewer, "The Greek War of Independence" pg 18
ISBN : 978-1585673957

I would agree with this analysis. In my opinion, the ordinary Turks were one of the oppressed peoples of the Ottoman Empire. The Ottoman ruling class was just that - a ruling class - and there was nothing especially Turkish about it in its final years following centuries of intermarriage between European and Ottoman royal families and the constant influx of janissaries, who by definition were not ethnically Turkish, into ruling circles. The hybrid Ottoman language was as much Arabic and Persian as it was Turkish. I believe that the term τουρκοκρατία (tourkokratia:"Turkish rule") used by Greek speakers to refer to Ottoman rule contains a serious political flaw because it was precisely <i>Ottoman</i> and not Turkish rule, and that it is objectional in that it promotes Turkophobia amongst Greeks based on a false premise.

It is only in this context that we can understand why Mustafa Kemal Atatürk is revered as a saviour by the Turkish people. Admittedly he saved his people from the imperialist yoke that the bankrupt Ottoman administration had signed them into with the treaty of Sevres rather than from that administration itself. This does not detract from his monumental achievements. I see so much misguided commentary on this forum by Greek speakers about Atatürk, and perhaps if his actions were to be interpreted in the light of the above quote by Rigas Ferreros, it will be easier to understand why Mustafa Kemal is considered to be a national hero in Turkey.

[BirKibrisli]

In Question 7 Mr Sabahattin Ismail tackles the 1821 Uprising and The First Enosis Proclamation...Following is a summary translation....

After achieving independence Greece's expansionary and hegemonic policies made sure Cyprus never saw peace and tranquillity for centuries...This was evident form the early days of the Mora Uprising.

Soon after the Greek uprising,the Orthodox Church in Cyprus,which was always behind every reactionary,fanatical,and nationalist movement started preparing for an uprising. First they begun their propaganda and brainwashing activities via the Church sermons.. Then followed a visit to Cyprus by a leader of Filiki Eteriya,Konstantin Kanaris,who made speeches encouraging an uprising,and collected money,food,and ammunition for the Greek uprising...

After that Archbishop Kiprianos turned the churches into ammunition depots...Sent letters to various churches explaining how the uprising will take place.But a GC called Dimitri from the village of Ayanni wrote a letter to the Ottoman Governor and denounced the uprising...

The Governor,Kuchuk Mehmet,raided the churches and confiscated the weapons and ammunition. Some of the leaders were executed,others sent to prison or exile.Archbishop Kiprianos was among those executed...
The letter of denunciation reads:
"On the night of the Passover at 6 o'clock Nicosia will come under cannon fire. Archbishop Kiprianos told us this in a letter read out in Church...
As soon as the cannons begin all the Christians will attack Nicosia with arms.After capturing Nicosia all Muslims will be put to death..."

Evidently the massacre of the Turks was being planned even in Ottoman times...Some priests sent into exile got together in Rome towards the end of 1821,issued the first Enosis proclamation inviting all Christian Monarchs to help unite Cyprus with Greece....



So says Mr Ismail....Everyone happy with that???

[BirKibrisli]

In Question 7 Mr Sabahattin Ismail tackles the 1821 Uprising and The First Enosis Proclamation...Following is a summary translation....

After achieving independence Greece's expansionary and hegemonic policies made sure Cyprus never saw peace and tranquillity for centuries...This was evident form the early days of the Mora Uprising.

Soon after the Greek uprising,the Orthodox Church in Cyprus,which was always behind every reactionary,fanatical,and nationalist movement started preparing for an uprising. First they begun their propaganda and brainwashing activities via the Church sermons.. Then followed a visit to Cyprus by a leader of Filiki Eteriya,Konstantin Kanaris,who made speeches encouraging an uprising,and collected money,food,and ammunition for the Greek uprising...

After that Archbishop Kiprianos turned the churches into ammunition depots...Sent letters to various churches explaining how the uprising will take place.But a GC called Dimitri from the village of Ayanni wrote a letter to the Ottoman Governor and denounced the uprising...

The Governor,Kuchuk Mehmet,raided the churches and confiscated the weapons and ammunition. Some of the leaders were executed,others sent to prison or exile.Archbishop Kiprianos was among those executed...
The letter of denunciation reads:
"On the night of the Passover at 6 o'clock Nicosia will come under cannon fire. Archbishop Kiprianos told us this in a letter read out in Church...
As soon as the cannons begin all the Christians will attack Nicosia with arms.After capturing Nicosia all Muslims will be put to death..."

Evidently the massacre of the Turks was being planned even in Ottoman times...Some priests sent into exile got together in Rome towards the end of 1821,issued the first Enosis proclamation inviting all Christian Monarchs to help unite Cyprus with Greece....



So says Mr Ismail....Everyone happy with that???

I hope you are all enjoying Mr Ismail's version of our recent history.From your silence I take that your are either in shock or totally in agreement...
Lets press on a bit more...In question 8 our historian deals with" The transition to British rule and TC migration"...

In 1878, taking the opportunity of the Ottoman-Russian war,the British managed to rent Cyprus for 92,000 gold pieces a year,with a promise of help to defeat the Russians. The rental agreement was temporary. When the Russian threat passed Cyprus was to be returned to the Ottomans. In other words,Cyprus was always part of the Empire.
But from day one,the British was only interested in how they were going to annex Cyprus. Eventually,after WWI,using the excuse that The Ottoman's were on the losing side,they officially declared Cyprus to be part of the British Empire,and stopped paying the rent...

And on 27 November 1917 in an order from "the Royal Council", the British gave Cypriots 2 years to apply to become British citizens.
Facing this illegal British demand thousands of TCs migrated to Anatolia.
Waves of TC migration took place in 1878,1914,and 1917...In addition,there was a big wave of migration after the 1923 Lausanne agreement when Cyprus came legally under the British rule...

As a result of these waves of migration,more than 30,000 Turkish Cypriots left Cyprus,mainly the educated ones. Similarly,another wave of TC migration came after the 1960 agreements when British rule ended. And also during the 1963-74 period,there was continuing migration of TCs as a result of oppression and attacks by the GCs...Today more than 400,000 TCs live abroad.225,000 in Turkey,120,000 in England,40 thousand in Australia,10 thousand in the USA,and some 5000 in Canada and other countries...